Teen is hateful towards her family.

 

  #1  
Old 08-31-04, 09:26 PM
irbythoc
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Teen is hateful towards her family.

My daughter has always had a terrible relationship with everybody in our family. It seems like she despises us for no reason. She hates her little brother and loves to remind him of the fact(I'm talking ACTUAL hatred) and has absolutely no respect for her mother or myself. She hasn't been exposed to any type of abuse by any of us, but she inflicts every type of abuse on us that you can imagine; physical, psychological, emotional, financial. She even punched my wife in the face once! The only people that seem to matter to her are her friends at school, who are, in my opinion, kind of trashy. Her favorite thing to do is remind us, in certain subtle ways, that she thinks her friends are gold and that we are garbage.

She gets a thrill out of pushing my buttons and getting me angry. I think she tries to provoke me into hitting her so she can tell one of her teachers. I just won't. I'm not a violent person. I have never been able to bring myself to hurt anyone who wasn't trying to hurt me. This has been going on for years and now she has all the teenager problems heaped on top of the existing ones. I cannot figure out what her problem is. Anyone ever hear of a case like this? Her abuse of us is a daily and constant thing. Our quality of life in my house is very low because of the way she treats us. What the heck are we going to do with her? If you have any advice, please don't be too general because we've already tried a lot of things in an effort to reach her. Despite the abuse, we love her and don't wish to kick her out.

I grew up in a loving family, so I can't understand the concept of a kid who DOESN'T want to get along with her family.

Parent abuse DOES exist!!
 
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Old 09-01-04, 02:47 AM
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Teen behavior

The child may need counseling. Or, perhaps, the family needs counseling. If the child has never been exposed to violence, then perhaps the child has a conduct disorder. Siuch teens are bullies and intimidate others, get involved in fights, carry a knife, and are cruel to people and animals, steal, use drugs, skip school, run away from home, and sometimes are arsonists. Such kids tend not be well adjusted and have low self-esteem. They are miserable and unhappy. Many of these kids are dyslexic (have reading problems) and don't do well in school. Social skills are poor and they tend to be isolated.

Kids with ADHD (attention deficit disorders) often develop other behavior problems. Sometimes kids that are bullied at school develop depression and associated behavior problems. If interventions at home and school have failed, perhaps it is time for a professional assessment.
 
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Old 09-01-04, 08:28 AM
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She has a fear of adults and our past attempts to get her to counseling have been difficult. She attends a few meetings and then decides that she doesn't want to go any more. I have seriously thought of getting counseling for myself just to help deal with the stress and maybe learn how to tolerate her without going nuts. My wife deals with it by pretending there's no problem or shifting the blame on me because I complain about the way things are. She's more of a victim than I am!

She has been diagnosed with severe depression and has a panic/anxiety disorder, but I don't see how any of those problems would necessarily make someone abusive towards their family. I dunno.
 
  #4  
Old 09-06-04, 07:43 PM
coolcalmu
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get tough quick

you need to toughen up quick. If you dont she will end up in prison one day or all alone. If i were you i would give her a good old fashion spanking.
 
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Old 09-09-04, 01:27 AM
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Question

I'm not about to sugar coat this.

Go back and read what you've posted. Then come back and tell us what flags pop-up.

It seem's to me you've spent a good number of years nurturing and feeding this animal (read-situation) and now you're perplexed as to how to tame it.

Yes counseling is needed first and foremost for you and your wife.
This is plainly evident in the following quote:
"My wife deals with it by pretending there's no problem or shifting the blame on me because I complain about the way things are. She's more of a victim than I am!"

or,,
"She gets a thrill out of pushing my buttons and getting me angry."
Pushing your buttons,,,Victim ????
I'm sorry but, just when did you decide to give up your parental role and take on that of a victim? Do you honestly think that your situation is so unique?

Complaining does nothing.

Kids learn from SOLID UNWAVERING parenting. Consistance is the key. You both have to unite and back each other no matter how difficult it is.
Your child has studied (perhaps even aided) the roles you and your wife have taken and is using them against you.

Once you and your wife get your act together, THEN you can focus on your teen.

Then perhaps statements such as this-
"She has been diagnosed with severe depression and has a panic/anxiety disorder, but I don't see how any of those problems would necessarily make someone abusive towards their family."
-and the ones above won't have you seeking solutions on a UBB forum......
 
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Old 09-16-04, 01:10 PM
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I won't sugar coat, either, and I'm sorry if this sounds harsh. Sounds like a desperate situation, and desperate times call for desperate measures, period.

Punched your wife in the face?

Military school. They'll fix her. If they don't she's probably irreparable.

Good luck.

Chris
 
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Old 09-16-04, 02:29 PM
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If she has actually punched your wife in the face you two need to press charges. A couple months in a youth detention center could do her some good. Family looks real good compared to guards and counselers. Take control.
 
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Old 09-17-04, 05:23 AM
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Originally Posted by irbythoc
She has been diagnosed with severe depression and has a panic/anxiety disorder, but I don't see how any of those problems would necessarily make someone abusive towards their family. I dunno.
Yes it will ! She needs serious help if she has these problems. She knows she can run you and your wife over and you need to put the foot down and take action and save this young girl from a life of misery.
 
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Old 10-09-04, 09:56 PM
irbythoc
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Dear pucker, I don't think for one moment the answer to my questions can be found in my last post. As far as I am concerned my situation IS unique! There's no question in my mind about that. (Unique does not mean SINGULAR in the realm of this subject). There are parents out there that have a similar situation to mine, I just haven't ran into any of them yet. What I'm looking to do here is to relate to people what my UNIQUE situation is and see if anyone reading this has found ways to deal with it THROUGH PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. If I made the assumption that my situation is NORMAL then I would get nowhere. I've talked with enough parents who have teenage daughters to get a good idea what is normal for them.

If I'm coming off as defensive, it's not because I have a big ego and feel like I have to save face, it's because I've had my fill of these "armchair" parents who only have to deal with NORMAL teenage behavior. So, I guess what I'm saying is that if you don't have a teenager with behavior problems IN ADDITION to normal teenager behavior problems, you probably wouldn't have any good advice.

As far as putting my foot down, I've put it THROUGH THE FLOOR plenty of times. It's not a question of that. She only sees it as a challenge. No amount or type of punishment has any effect because what she really wants is to beat you. That's when she is in her glory. Seeing us completely exasperated at the thought that nothing we can do to her is going to change the way she acts. Man, if you could be here and see it for yourself, you'd understand.

Sometimes it's scary. I deal with convicted felons on a daily basis as a part of my job and I've gianed a hell of a lot of insight as to how they think. I don't like some of the parallel's I've seen between some of their behavior and my daughter's.
 
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Old 10-10-04, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by irbythoc
Sometimes it's scary. I deal with convicted felons on a daily basis as a part of my job and I've gianed a hell of a lot of insight as to how they think. I don't like some of the parallel's I've seen between some of their behavior and my daughter's.

I'm going to tell you something I rarely tell anyone. I know this is public, but at this point, I think you need to hear it.

One of my uncle's was a murderer. He killed 5 people. He was killed in prison by his cellmate after a few years in jail.

My other uncle was, for lack of a better term, a psycho (mainly due the shell shock leftovers from his Vietnam experience).

When I was a teenager, I was hateful, angry at everyone, and severly depressed. I also have ADHD.

My mother once told me during a fight we were having (nothing physical) that I reminded her of Alan (this was my killer uncle, and her brother). I took extreme offense to that, smacked her, and ran to my room.

That incident is many years past, but never will I forgive myself for doing it. My mother and I are not amazingly close, but we do speak, and have a fairly good relationship.

If your daughter sees your punishments as "challenges", you have to give her a challenge she CAN'T win. I say again, and I damn well mean it.

Originally Posted by WorldBuilder
Military school. They'll fix her. If they don't she's probably irreparable.
Do it. Now. For her own good and yours.

Chris
 
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Old 10-10-04, 09:31 AM
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irbythoc I know exactly where your coming from. We had a Teen that did the exact same thing and more. She argued and fought with everyone, sneak out at night, started doing drugs, got involved in a gang, and HIT my wife in the face too.Counseling is in order here if you can for you and your wife at least.

The two of you MUST stick together on any punishment involved, no matter what it is and don't Ever argue about punishment being done in front of her.

it's not a pretty picture when hitting is involved, but it can't be taken lightly.When my daughter hit my wife with her fist in the face, my wife pushed her back against the wall and slapped her back. Our daughter said she was going to call the police when it happened, I grabbed the phone and handed it to her, while telling her it was self-defense. You must take control of this situation. Use tuff love, let her know you love her every day several times a day, even while punishing her. Even tho you think she is not listening to you about all the problems you are having with her, she is, it will come out in the wash later in life.

Ground her..... and keep strict with it. Not just a day or 2 ,weeks if necessary. Ground her from phone, TV, music everything.

I hate to admit it cause I think it's illegal, but to keep her from sneaking out at night we screwed the window closed from the outside, and put alarms on the exit doors and other windows.

Drugs? ya I caught her and her friends getting ready to do cocaine in her room " I thought the 1 boy looked fishy so kept my eye out " I walked in the room, they tried to hide it, but I found it. Told them all to grab some wall and found the rest, Took him to the bathroom " by the scruff of his shirt " amd made him flush it all down the toilet. I should have called the cops but didn't. Thinking this is 1 way to make her think I was fair about it and see that we are not as bad as she thinks we are, instead I told him if he ever came within 1 block of my daughter I would beat him to a pulp and he was lucky I wasn't calling the police.

I could go on forever on this topic, but to make a long story short, tuff love and time heals wounds and anger.

She actually turned out to be a great mom herself and Tells Us All the time that we were right and that she is so sorry she put us through the mess she put us through, and now she talks to another Teen daughter we have thats starting down that road explaining how she was wrong and we are right.

Just remember.... you and your wife MUST stick together..... Show tuff love and true love. If you would like to talk more on this I'm sure anyone would take a PM from you and talk 1 on 1 including me.

Best of luck and love to you and your family.
 
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Old 10-14-04, 11:52 AM
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Thumbs up

You don't say what her age is.. 11 ? 18 ??

if it is the later . Tell it is time to move out.

If she is younger tell her if she doesn't act her age and be nice you will put her on Ritalin, and take away her cell phone or other privileges she enjoys.

You may also threatin Boarding school. Or announce we are moving to another city. (Just to push her buttons.)

Maybe pickup Dr. Phil's new Family book on the market today.

Goodluck
 
  #13  
Old 10-14-04, 07:24 PM
irbythoc
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Wink

Glasman, thank you for sharing that. It's encouraging to hear that your daughter turned out the way she did. It sounds like her main problem was hanging with the wrong crowd.

I don't think that my daughter has been approached with drugs or the scum that peddles or uses them, but she really doesn't seem to be into SELF abuse. She pretty much looks out for number one and takes good care of herself. It's just the rest of her family that she can't stand and likes to abuse. Sometimes her cruelty seems downright sadistic. I can't really relate to the way she acts, myself, because I was a pretty clean cut kid and I had a lot of affection for my parents and my sisters.

I just worry about how her inability to form normal bonds with her family will affect her ability to form relationships in the future. I mean, if you don't care about your family members and can't form normal bonds with them, how can I expect her to be able to do it with anybody else? I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I think I'll just blame it on Hollywood.
 
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Old 10-16-04, 08:22 AM
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I know you've gotten plenty of responses and 'armchair parenting' is difficult at best (esp since I don't know her age or what discipline you've already tried) but here's what I'd do as a mother:

I would without warning or explanation enact these rules:

She may not watch television at all - any time day or night - AT ALL. Remove the one in her room if any.

She may not use a telephone AT ALL and remove her cell if she has one (or pager, etc)

Remove her Xbox/playstation 2, CD player, and computer. Put them in the attic. She may not use any of these things. If she needs entertainment she may read a book or write or draw.

She may not leave the house except to attend school (or with the family). She goes to school, she returns home, she does her homework at the kitchen table, she spends the rest of the evening in her room QUIETLY. She may come out to eat supper with the family.

When she has her inevitable freak-out, calmly inform her that when she begins acting like a human and not a rabid animal she may get human privileges. Tell her that you love her but that she is no longer going to terrorize and rule the family.

If (when) she has a melt-down and screams, threatens, attempts to physically harm you, etc, CALMLY take her by both arms (I'm assuming you are physically stronger than her) and take her to her room, tell her that she may scream, punch the walls, etc to her hearts content, remind her again that she may live like a human as soon as she acts like one, and shut the door.



Simultaneously you must do three things(for yourself):

1) Firmly get your wifes cooperation!! As all the PP said YOU AND YOUR WIFE MUST BE TOGETHER ON THIS AND UNWAVERING.

2) document everything that you can remember (with dates)

3) Also: go to her school and tell her teachers, her principal and her councellor exactly what you've told us and that you're going to try a new approach. Get their help and support! they are probably suffering as well. Also this gives you an 'out' if your dau tries to ring DSS or the cops or whatever dramatic crap she can think of


Try this for two weeks - weekends as well!!. If she considers getting punishment as "winning" let's see how she likes THIS.

I hope this helps

-Blue
 
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Old 11-15-04, 06:24 PM
irbythoc
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Thanks, Blue. The old "take everything" trick. I've heard Dr. Luara suggested this approach to one caller (I would have voted for her!). She even went one step further- she suggested only letting her have ONE set of clothing just to wear to school! Believe me, if I could get my wife on board I would do it in a heart beat. But.....

Here's another horror story that just happened today, just for an illustration of her typical behavior;
My daughter has an admirer, Dan, at school who she really does not like. I've seen this kid. He's about 6'4", 320lbs. He looks like a damn bear! Any way, my daughter has been sending this guy mixed signals by giving him the brush off at school and then having long conversations with him on the phone. We've been trying to make her understand the can of worms that she's opening up by doing this. Today my wife started teasing her, "Felicia it's your sweety, Dan, on the phone!" My daughter responded by yelling, "LEAVE ME THE F**K ALONE YOU F**KING ***HOLE!!!" at the top of her lungs.

As a result she is loosing for one week: internet, phone, and boom box. I gave her the option of geting one privilege back IF she gave my wife a sincere appology. She did so. I gave her the phone privileges back. Big Dan's the only one who calls her!!! How poetic.

Your suggestion makes perfect sense and I have no doubt that it would have some results. Right now I'm thinking of getting her back into therapy. Maybe she wont be so resistant right now. She's been receptive to the idea lately. Not because she wants to get along better with her family, but so she can make friends easier at school.

Funny you should mention, I bought a journal about t week ago to document her behavior! I haven't started using it yet. I'm going to start tonight and log today's outburst. Maybe it'll be something I can bring to therapy.

Thanks
 

Last edited by bobrod; 03-30-05 at 09:17 AM. Reason: Offensive language
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Old 11-16-04, 03:16 AM
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"Believe me, if I could get my wife on board I would do it in a heart beat. But....."

But what?

C'mon tell us.

That's O-kay you summed it up perfectly. "Today my wife started teasing her, "Felicia it's your sweety, Dan, on the phone!"

It's obvious you've two teenagers on your hands.

I'd also like to know why you haven't taken the ADULT role and a had a one on one with Dan. Explaining to him that you don't approve of your daughters attitude towards him and her duplitious actions, highlighting the fact that he too doesn't need to put up with her abuse.
Also you're not building a lot of confidence in your peers with your procratination. "Funny you should mention, I bought a journal about t week ago to document her behavior! I haven't started using it yet."

Parenting is PRO-active...

However you're RE-active... as in the following:"As a result she is loosing for one week: internet, phone, and boom box. I gave her the option of geting one privilege back IF she gave my wife a sincere appology.She did so. I gave her the phone privileges back. Big Dan's the only one who calls her!!! How poetic."

Bartering for respect?

Sounds like you and Big Dan have a lot in common....

By the way, when my daughter was the same age as yours, my wife and I fought with her tooth and nail.
I'm not going to go into detail, but believe me your situation IS NOT UNIQUE.

We ALL got through it together by the advice that has been provided, AND by my wife and I working together.

Also, I deal with convicted felons every day. I run a In-Patient Co-Ed drug rehablilitation center for OCC and DOC clients (read clients: warm fuzzy term P.C. generated to mean inmates...........)

Bottom line, get a grip, grow some stones, and find a new Therapist
 

Last edited by pucker factor; 11-16-04 at 03:27 AM.
  #17  
Old 11-17-04, 06:51 AM
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I don't personally have the experience, as a parent, of dealing with a teen similar to your daughter. However, my brother had some of the behaviors identical to what you describe from your daughter (hateful toward family, etc.). And I watched with sadness and anger for years as he made my mother feel incapable of helping him.

I too have turned to user groups in times of trouble with my six year old son. While he is not the same as your child, he was more and more frequently exhibiting hateful behaviors that were completely unacceptable for children of any age. After years (since he was almost 4) of counseling, I finally agreed to take him to a psychologist. He’s been diagnosed with some ADHD symptoms (although he’s nearly two grades ahead of his peers academically) and depression. Wellbutrin was the prescribed med and our lives are so much better now!!! Yes, depression can easily cause angry (and situational - eg. only toward family) outbursts – and aggression. THAT is something I have experienced (with my son & my brother). Your daughter needs your help and the best way to give her help is to get others involved.

You can’t keep letting your daughter physically and emotionally hurt you and your wife. It’s simply not healthy for you and it’s very probable that your daughter will eventually treat her other life-long relations (e.g. spouse) in much the same way. Is that what you want for her? If so, and you can tolerate how her behavior effects other areas of your life, then you should do what my mother did: live with it.

If you’re really ready for positive change for your benefit and your daughter’s benefit, you will have to reach out to others near you, in your city, your neighborhood, your family, your doctor, councilors, teen mental hospitals, anyone and everyone! As I said, I have also turned to various user groups on the ‘net. But what I found is that it truly does take a village to raise a child and that village needs to be physically present.

My advise: Get local support that you and your wife need to see you through this – and do it quickly. You will need the encouragement and strength of others who are there to see your faces, stand next to you when your daughter fights (emotionally/physically) back against you, and to look you in the eye and tell you you’ve done the right thing. Continue to read what others have done ( “Chicken Soup for the Parent’s Soul” has some strikingly similar - one almost exact - examples of what your going through, including some practical solutions, in it’s chapter entitled “Overcoming Obstacles”). You will find a common thread in any situation involving angry, self-destructing, rebelling, or other problem teen/parent relationship – all of the parents who were successful in helping their children were those who turned to others who were physically present for help in their times of need.

Good luck.
 
  #18  
Old 01-02-05, 04:40 PM
Lizzie409
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THE TAKE EVERY THING WORK...i hate 2 admit it but mi fokes did it 2 me a few months ago they took every thing! they took mi computer my cell fone and they put a lock on the land line they took my cd's my radio! every thing in my room there was a bed and a empty desk wit a few school books on it! every thing was gone even mi posters! and it woked it realli made me love what i did have! and they did it just in time as well as soon as i started gettin voilent with other people! and now i love my family!
another thing is...mabey you daughter is doing it 4 attention? i do some times.. wen eva she shouts walk away! it will drive her nuts.. if she asks 2 b taken sum where say NO! TUFF LOVE!
 
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Old 01-25-05, 03:42 PM
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Kids will do what you allow them to...I know of what I speak, because I have 2 girls. Taking her priviledges for a week won't fix anything....she didn't learn the behavior in a week. I would start by taking everything out of her room...everything, only leaving her a bed, pillow, & blanket. You already know the things she values....the phone, tv, music, her friends....after good behavior for a predetermined amount of time...she will earn one priviledge at a time....I would start with a month. She has to be retaught what her boundaries are. And believe me...kids DO want boundaries...no matter what they tell you. It shows you care what kind of person they become. You also have the final say as to what kind of people she hangs around with. Also...as the child, she has no say whether she see's a counselor, you're the parent. Family counseling is what is needed to fix your family.
 
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Old 02-14-05, 06:15 AM
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It’s been a long time since this thread started, I bet I know how it turned out.

IMHO which of course is meaningless, nothing changed and this kid is still running the household. Mom and Dad were never going to work together and that’s probably the root cause of their problems today. Unfortunately it’s probably too late for the parents to have any affect on this kid especially since they will handle it the same way they have since the kid was born.

Mom was wrong yes, but if my kid used that F ** ing language to my wife this kids life would immediately change and for a lot longer than one meaningless week and there would be no bargaining after the fact. I have no doubt that this would not happen in our family because we treat our daughter with respect and have always demanded nothing less in return.

Oh, and as soon as this kid displayed violence of any sort, any illegal actions at all, the police would be called and she would be on her own.

This kid was 17, maybe 18 by now, if she is going to change, it will have to be society to do it. She is not going to listen to her Mom and Dad now, she’s an adult, responsible for her own actions and will have no choice but to live with the results of all her decisions.

Have a nice day.
 
  #21  
Old 03-07-05, 09:44 PM
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I related to the original poster not too long ago. It took me taking a long hard look at what I was doing about the situation. School wasn't important, but the friends were. We were trash, and the rest of the world was gold. I was the stupidest person that walked the earth.

That last incident I woke up. She left the house in handcuffs in the back of a squad car. She's a juvenile and hadn't hurt anyone at that point so they called me that night to come get her. I refused.

When I finally went and got her, she came home to a room with no door, no telephone, no tv, no radio, no pictures on her walls...

She was also withdrawn from school and place in a private extension school (some deem it homeschool, but its not).

Its been a hard run for us. I'm not doing as well in school myself now, and the house isn't neat as a pin BUT she has her things back, is allowed to go out with a few of her new friends, and even has a boyfriend. She is 17 and in the 10th grade, but will be moving into the 11th grade at the end of this month. If she stays on task, and I stand true, she will be graduating high school with honors in January 2006. My grades are coming up, and our family is acting like a family again. I no longer have to set the house alarm just to alert me as to when she is sneaking out. I don't have to hide my car keys anymore or my wallet, cellphone, etc.

It has taken my 'village' (family, neighbors and friends) to accomplish this. I could not do it easily alone without sacrificing the rest of my family. The greatest growth has come within me. Realizing that if I truly love my daughter I will do WHATEVER it takes to get things back to 'right' or protect the rest of the family from her. Even if that meant having a few neighbors help me hold her down to wash her mouth out with soap, then that's what happened or having the police bring control to the situation when I couldn't. I needed help, she needed help and we got it by whatever resources are/were out there.

I know that sounds odd, but if a 17 year old is going to act like a wild 2 year old, then that is how I will treat them. I'm not abusive to my children other than I cannot bring myself to physically discipline them. I'm not a spanker. Two of my children take advantage of this fact, the other two don't seem to do things that require any drastic punishment.

Bottom line: if you love your children, you move heaven and earth to do your job. Take your responsibility to your children seriously. Quit making excuses. Being aware of the problem makes it your problem. Deal with it. Sternly, quickly and consistently.

Kay
 
  #22  
Old 08-08-05, 07:28 PM
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I'm 20 years old and I was one of these "teenagers". Though I'm not a girl. I believe the best way to do it is to take control, and ground her. If she refuses and doesn't listen, find an in-patient mental hospital program (for teens who have tried to kill themself, hurt others etc) and get her in there for hurting your wife.

That's what happened to me. My parents actually lied and said I tried to kill myself, and I was put in there instantly. The thing is like a mental prison, and there are pretty tough people in there -- and I soon learned that my problems are petty compared to the other people in that place.

Thats my advice, take it or leave it.
 
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Old 08-09-05, 09:20 PM
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I completely agree with jon_k. I'm 18 AND a girl so I know what I'm talking about. When you're at this age, there is absolutely no excuse for this kind of behavior and if she is not taught at home, the lesson will be even tougher in the real world. But understand that all you can do is your best and don't feel too guilty about her actions. After all, she is a human being and always has a choice. She most definitely cannot blame it on teen angst for the rest of her life. If you can't handle it yourself, definitely get professional help. Sometimes it's easier for people who aren't as close to you to get under your skin and identify the real problem. I mean, I get irritated at my family sometimes too, but your situation definitely sounds serious if she's violent about it. If you really do love her, then put your foot down now so she doesn't make a major mistake with her attitude in the future.
 
  #24  
Old 12-01-05, 07:51 AM
Katherine Ellis
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You described me

The story you tell about your daughter was me about 8 years ago. I was a horrible teenager and I put my parents through hell. I thank god that they didn't give up on me. I had to learn everything the hard way and did exactly the opposite that everyone told me to do. I got pc'd (protrctive custody), grounded and everything else. Now in my mid 20's I'm married with two kids I have a great job and we just bought our first house. There is hope. You need to tell your daughter that you love her (not saying that you don't) that no matter what she does you'll always love her. Voicing your opinion on her friends will only bring her closer to them. Tell her maybe you were wrong about them, that you don't know them and if they want to hang out at your house it would give her a chance to prove that they are good people. Yes they will probably smoke cigaretts out back when your not home and maybe they will sneak a beer but we all did this as teenagers i'm not saying that this is o.k. but try to put yourself in her shoes for one minute. Shes your oldest so you haven't been through this before. She is in the middle of high school, You couldn't pay me to go back!! This is such a tough time in her life and she feels that the only people who understand her are her friends. She has college to think about and thinking about what you want to do with the rest of your life when all you want to think about is the shirt your going to wear on friday night is a little overwhelming. I'm not saying she is right but military school or a mental hospital is not the way to go. She will never forgive you !!!! Tell her your starting over with a clean slate that everything up untill this point your bad and hers is null and void. Tell her it hurts that you don't have a good relationship and you want to try at making it better. No yelling no swearing and no pointing fingers. This is the beginning then put the ball in her court. Try try try over and over again. You sound like a caring parent if this is rock bottom theres only one way to go. When you start to move up again you might fall. Thats o.k. just keep trying don't give up!!Good luck (by the way my parents are my closest friends now)-Katie
 
  #25  
Old 12-17-08, 11:18 AM
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i'm new, just joined today, mostly because my google search found your thread. i realize you posted over four years ago. your story sounds almost exactly like mine. my husband and i are at our wits end dealing with a 16-yr-old daughter who is hateful toward her family and is wreaking havoc in our lives. she has no respect for her father and i and can't stand her little brother. we have virtually no pleasant moments with her, unless maybe we're talking about something she wants. she thinks her so-called friends are great; we worry about her choice of friends. she also has never suffered any type of abuse whatsoever. i am so eager to hear how things are for you and your family today. we need the right help after years of evals; we don't know what to do next. we also love the kid and don't want to kick her out.
 
  #26  
Old 12-17-08, 01:14 PM
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Previous posters have made some good points, some of which may be helpful to you. Have you had your child evaluated by a psychologist? Have you talked with a family therapist?

Does she have a learning disability? ADD/ADHD? ODD (Oppositional Defiance Disorder?) Depression? Mood disorder? Other?

If at wit's end, it's time to seek some professional help.

Tough Love(tm)

Defiant Children

TEENS WITH PROBLEMS: Conduct disorder vs. Oppositional Defiant Disorder

Article, Kids Directory, Family, Kids Education

There are lots of resources online as well as books at the library and bookstores. Just by your posting here is a proactive step in the right direction to educate yourself about how to properly cope with a defiant teen. Do your homework.
 
  #27  
Old 12-18-08, 12:27 PM
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thanks for your suggestions. she has been evaluated multiple times over the last 10 years by pediatric neurologists, psychiatrists, psychologists. she does have ADD and anxiety. so far no doctor has diagnosed her with depression but i believe she definitely has that too...it runs in mom's side of the family. we're in the midst of having her evaluated AGAIN. just yesterday the possibility of RTC came up at psychiatrist appt. she's been to see many therapists too but none of them could get any info out of her except that her ("fantasy") world is peachy. we just started family therapy a week ago.
 
  #28  
Old 12-18-08, 10:35 PM
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I’m going to be very judgmental; there is a good chance I’m wrong in what I’m about to say. Please take it as constructive criticism; out of concern for you, your family and your child. I realize that much of this may not apply to you but feel it should be said anyway. So please take with a grain of salt.

I think there are some people that have legitimate debilitating learning disabilities and mental disorders; however I feel the vast majority of children nowadays there are labeled as such are enabling the behavior, and amplifying it and I think it is often used as a copout/con (whether it be out of laziness, sympathy; ect…).

I am moderately dyslexic, and have some form of ADD and OCD. I do have some depression and anger issues; it’s not so much that I’m mentally ill it’s that it is frustrating and depressing that some things are so difficult and hard for me and hard to keep focus on some things; yet for others can do some of the same things so fast and easily. From what I have seen almost everyone has some form of learning disability; and everyone that I’ve ever gotten to know has had some form of mental illness. I think it’s normal to have a little bit of learning disability and a little bit of mental illness. The fact is that in some way it is tough for everyone; you just try to find that meets your interests and skills and do your best that you can to be productive in society and your family. Unfortunately nowadays there seems to be more of a victim mentality ( dependence mentality); rather than the independence (can do) mentality.

There are times for counselors and psychologists and shrinks; however they often make things worse.

I was never violent with my parents and not prone to violence. I am old and have only resorted to physical violence twice in my life and those two times I was physically attacked and was violent only as what I thought was the last reasonable resort in self defense and did not provoke the situation (I could‘ve withstood the pain of being hit; but I thought I should stand my ground and defend myself and fight back). Of course I’m not counting things like wrestling for fun. Anyway I feel that in most cases that if someone is acting out violently inappropriately that I would be skeptical if it is related to a learning disability ( unless it is an extreme situation).

I wouldn’t normally blame someone’s violent behavior at home for being picked on at school; it seems somewhat of a stretch to me. I was picked on a lot at school because my reading and writing skills lagged far behind; and I was a scientific mechanical nerd; yet I never physically attacked my parents.

I feel most children today are somewhat spoiled in many aspects. This seems to be the “all me”, “all now“, “instant gratification“; generation. Most children today don’t seem to appreciate delayed gratification, hard work, and work ethics; let alone basic ethics. Money, food, shelter and employment is not an entitlement; it’s a privilege.

I feel that your daughters violent and abusive behavior toward you is because she is spoiled and it is her way of controlling you to get what she wants. Have you seen the dog whisperer?

Regrettably by the time they become teenagers this type of behavior issue can be very hard if not impossible to correct. I feel that most of the children’s behavioral problems and learning disabilities are self-imposed and enabled by society ( governments, families, schools, churches, and is often out of political correctness). Dr. Spock told us we couldn’t spank our children; I think it’s no surprise that there was an explosion of behavioral problems and learning disabilities after that became politically correct. My parents told me if they couldn’t pound it into one end, that they would pound it into the other end. In other words they would use kindness, forgiveness and logic however if I abused their kindness and forgiveness that there would be consequences. I feel the spoiled kids of today expect all the freedoms (expect the freedoms of adults) yet they don’t want the consequences of being an adult. I feel that if a child wants adult freedoms that they have to demonstrate the responsibility of an adult first. I think that often learning disabilities and mental illnesses are being used as copouts to try to get out of consequences.

I don’t know if they actually still do this not now days; without actually getting in trouble with the law. However in the old days if you had an unruly child that was destroying the family it was possible to make the child a ward of the state. That was only done as a last resort because it was a typically only a one-way thing ( irrevocable). However the threat was often enough to scare the child straight. Nowadays it might not be much of a threat.

If she’s allowed to go down the path that she’s going now she will probably make your family’s life miserable and make herself miserable for the rest of her life. She will probably pair up to a guy and use him and bleed him dry (or pair up with another abuser); then she will probably move on to the next victim….

I think as time for some tough love. A teenager is a little old to physically discipline; if she’s bad enough she might try to turn it around into physical or sexual abuse . When she is abusive or irresponsible taker privileges away. Take away her phone, iPod, cell phone, car, etc… I wouldn’t let her hang out, date, etc… ground her; the only time she should be allowed out other than school is with parental supervision.

Regrettably I think part of the problem is women’s liberation. I’m fine with women having their liberation; however women’s liberation and the poor economy and people’s more greedy desire to live at a higher living standard has led to more children being less supervised by their parents because it is more common for both parents to be working. I think another part of the problem is the high divorce rate; the parent family is more common and has a lot to do with it being more common for kids to be unsupervised and unruly.

I think there needs to be clear and reasonable boundaries, rules and limitations as well as consequences for any significant improprieties. I suspect she also needs to have some more chores or work.

I had a lot of freedoms when I grew up; because I was very responsible. My parents conditioned me so that I learned the more responsible than I was the more freedoms and privileges I was allowed.

My parents and I are the type to tell our children not to touch the stove it is hot; as children do they will eventually get around to touching the stove. We could hover over our children and prevent them from touching the stove; however are tough love mentality is to let them get a small burn this can be several valuable lessons in one. 1: Stoves can be hot and what hot is and that it hurts. 2: It teaches the children to listen to their parents. 3: It teaches the children to take heed of their parents advice. 4: It demonstrates to the children that there are reasons for the rules and to respect the rules and the parents. 5: It teaches children that there is consequences to their actions.

I really like the dog whisperer. Though not all the techniques may be the same I feel there are many similarities. I feel a dog or person that is not getting enough exercise or does not have a job to do is more likely to have behavioral and emotional issues. As I said before I feel there needs to be consistency; rules and boundaries and exercise or and a job.

Teach your daughter responsibility and there is consequences; if your daughter gets into trouble at school, legally, or financially don’t be so eager to always bail her out; let her face some consequences and learn that there are some consequences to her actions; make her/let her appreciate it when/if you do eventually bail her out.

Be creative with your discipline and try to make a moral point when possible. One of my childhood friends got caught smoking a cigarette; his father like many decided the punishment should be, if is child wanted to smoke, he told his child to smoke and inhale and keep doing so until he said stop. After a couple cigarettes is child vomited; his father said that was enough. I don’t think his son ever smoked another cigarette again.

Your daughters problems could be a liability for you and your family. Since she is a minor, if she does something really bad that means that you may end up shouldering the burden.

I’m amazed at how pathetic and apathetic some parents are with their children. I saw a mother that was defending her children after they carjacked and stole a car; she said: “they were just having a joyride. kids will be kids”. She didn’t seem shocked that her kids did such a thing. She didn’t seem upset with her kids. She didn’t apologize or show any remorse for the damage her kids did and how it affected the victims. She just seemed upset that the media was inconveniencing her by asking some questions.

I really feel our country is becoming morally and financially bankrupt. I can’t help but feel there is a connection.

There’s a part of me that despises South Park, and there is a part of me that likes it sometimes. There is one episode that I absolutely love.

The dog whisperer versus Cartman.

Clip
Cartman vs. The Dog Whisperer - Clips - South Park Studios

Full episode
South Park Episode Player


I like others can’t help but feel that possibly you are a victim of circumstance of your own making/volition. Your daughter seems to be using the disability/cop out/victimization role, since you apparently enable it, thusly you become a victim of your daughter.

If you watch the dog whisperer; the dog whisperer says that for the most part he isn’t a dog trainer, he’s training the owners. Most of dogs behavioral problems result from the behavior of the owner. 90-80% of successful “dog training” is not training the dog; it’s training the owner.

Exercise/work, rules, boundaries, limitations ( of course they have to be reasonable to have a chance to be successful),

However there are some dogs and some people that even if raised in perfect identical conditions can turn out to be bad or take some bad turns. So it’s not necessarily your fault.

While I and others have criticized you for possibly not being a perfect parent (not that any of us is perfect); for her to have major resentment to you seems to be unfounded. If you’re working to support her and your wife and if you and your wife is providing her a home/ lodging/food/clothing then she probably should be thankful because many people don’t have that privilege and luxury. Now days she’s lucky to have two parents.
 
  #29  
Old 12-27-10, 05:33 AM
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Teenbs1234, welcome to the forums! Hopefully in the past 6 years this teen is now an adult, and survived. Not disciplining your children is a disaster waiting to happen. Sending to a boarding school only gets them out of your hair. It does nothing to nourish the relationship you need with the child. Be firm, but fair. If that doesn't work, be firm and less fair, until it digresses to a situation of depriving them of their normal comfort zone. They will soon tire of it.
I told my son early on if he ever got arrested for cause, there would be no bail bond. Jail is not fun and it will sober your mind up quickly. Pavlov did it right. Conditioned reflexes. Stick your hand on a hot stove, you won't do it twice. Reward in the same manner to complete the cycle.
Your post may be deleted for the link or at least modified when the mods get here.
 
  #30  
Old 11-17-13, 08:17 PM
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i have a similar problem

my youngest daughter has always been what I consider a difficult child. I have read thru some of these responses above, but not all, so please forgive me if I am not saying anything new here. my 14 yr old daughter is quite a handful herself. if things are going her way, she is somewhat tolerable, sometimes even pleasant, but it seems as soon as things aren't going as she feels they should, she attacks and is a nasty, rude individual. honestly, I have to admit, there are days that as soon as I know she's up in the morning, I cringe. I mean she can just come up the stairs first thing in the morning, and i'll say good morning, or only just smile at her as I make her pancakes in hopes to help her start her day off right & she will just give me this evil look and say something like "don't talk to me". she has multiple issues that I won't go into here, but we have seen some improvement in our relationship since we got a hold of Parenting with Love & Logic books. Three main ones I suggest are Parenting with Love & Logic, Parenting Teens with Love & Logic, and From Innocence to Entitlement. you will most likely still need professional help...I personally suggest family counseling(we are about to embark on this journey ourselves - wish us luck) so that everyone is on the same page, so to speak. I wish you the best of luck as you struggle with your daughter...hopefully less and less over time. some things i can suggest are to make sure she owns her own problems (don't "rescue her" when she should be learning a lesson) & help her to think for herself by asking her lots of questions concerning decisions, as well as offering empathy and love when discussing consequences and concerns. try to learn techniques that help you calm down...tell her that you'll be happy to talk with her when she can be as calm as you are or tell her to take her nastiness to her own room because she's draining all your energy and if you don't have energy, you cannot drive her to her friends/cook dinner/insert here whatever you may need energy for...love & logic books have numerous examples of phrases you can use in a pinch that just help you in general with most difficult scenarios, such as "I love you too much to argue", and cover concepts such as going "brain dead" so you don't let anything she is saying really offend you or get your goat and make you angry which just results in wasting our breath as parents and guilt from not handling the situation "better". I feel your pain, and if you have found a "fix", do please share as I really want to help my daughter succeed in life & have a good relationship w her too! best of luck!!
 
 

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