Trane heat and air system

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  #1  
Old 03-19-09, 12:30 AM
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Trane heat and air system

I just recently won a trane heating and air conditioning system from a local company. They are charging labor and other parts which might come out to $3500 or so. I was wondering what kind of questions should I ask? I'm assuming it's a good deal. He stated the trane system cost around 5K. I don't know nothing about this so hopefully I can get some good feedback. Thanks. I have a one story home and the furnace is located in the garage and the air cond. system is on the side of the house. My house is about 1200 to 1400sq ft.
 
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  #2  
Old 03-19-09, 05:43 AM
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I would start by asking for the equipment specs. what are the M#'s of the heater and A/C. Saying you won a Trane system is like saying you won a Ford, lots of possibilities. Also, how are they going to size it ? Will they do a load calc ?
 
  #3  
Old 03-19-09, 06:37 AM
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I'm with Dun on this.

Specs?

Are they going to do the Manual-J (Load Calc) on your home to find what size equipment your home needs?

Not knowing where you are out of, i'd say no more than 60k furnace, and no more then 2ton A/C.
 
  #4  
Old 03-19-09, 11:59 AM
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My bad. I didn't get to ask the guy what model number. I just talked to him about 15 min ago. He said the model number for the Trane model number is an XR. I just want to know if the XR model is a good brand or not.

He said he would inspect my house to see what size I would need but the sq footage of my house I may need a 2 to 3 ton system.
 
  #5  
Old 03-19-09, 12:43 PM
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The Trane XR is a good middle line model, nothing high end about it..

Here is Trane's Website if you haven't looked over there.

Are you getting the 90% or 80%?

Where are you out of, and sq ft of the home/age?
 
  #6  
Old 03-19-09, 02:19 PM
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What do you mean by the 90 or 80%?
I live in the Sacramento, CA area. My sq footage is about 1400sq maybe a little more or less. I just called the guy and he said the air conditioning unit is a XR 13 and the furnace is a XR 80 whatever those numbers suppose to mean! I went to the website and the air cond. unit is in the high efficiency class which i assume is a good one. What would something cost for those 2 units w/o installation. I guess it's not the highest end but getting it for free I guess I can't complain about it. But he did state the installation of the units will cost about $3500 or so. Maybe more or else. What are your thought about it and what do you think of the model units? Do you think I should go for it. The current furnace I have is a carrier and it's original to the house (about 35 plus years old). I assume that's really old LOL. I will have to let him know by later today. Again I really have no knowledge about these kind of stuff. Jay11J Thanks for your help.
Originally Posted by Jay11J View Post
The Trane XR is a good middle line model, nothing high end about it..

Here is Trane's Website if you haven't looked over there.

Are you getting the 90% or 80%?

Where are you out of, and sq ft of the home/age?
 

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  #7  
Old 03-19-09, 02:36 PM
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80% XR13 did not cost any were close to $5000.00
 
  #8  
Old 03-19-09, 07:02 PM
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The XR80 is 80% efficiency furnace. Means, that 80% of the heat the furnace makes will go into the home and 20% up the chimney. That's okay for your area since your winter temps are pretty mild.

XR13 A/C is 13 SEERS unit, depends on your local electric company, you may get a rebate from them on the A/C.. Your dealer should have the forum for your power company.

Equipment sizing, I'd say 2.5 ton may be good for your home (depends on your walls/windows), and furnace, I'd say no more than 60k.

As for Air's comment about the 5k, it may sound high for some people, but things are known to be higher in CA. so I can't say for sure if that in the game or not.. Prices are all over the board in every state and cities.

If I were you, for a piece of mind, may not hurt to ask for the 10 years parts and labor warranty on your equipments.
 
  #9  
Old 03-23-09, 12:10 AM
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No, it's for both the air cond unit and the furnace. He said that both the units cost about $5k. Like I said earlier i won the system for free and I'm just being charged for labor which he quoted me about $3500. It maybe less or maybe more. He is coming to my house to do an estimate.
Originally Posted by airman.1994 View Post
80% XR13 did not cost any were close to $5000.00
 
  #10  
Old 03-23-09, 05:07 AM
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Sounds iffy to me. Get his quote and then get at least two other quotes. His price should be ALOT less than the others. Proceed with caution in my area $3500 is about the right price without winning any "prize". Sounds like it could be a marketing gimmick to me. Espeically if you don't even need a new system.
 
  #11  
Old 03-23-09, 07:09 AM
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Danger Will Robinson

I don't care where you are for a 1200 sq. ft. house $8500 ($5000 GRAND PRIZE + $3500 Install) Sounds to me like they are still trying to make 15% or so which I guess is OK just a little disingenuous.
The system for your home is going to be somewhere holf a ton either side of two tons so for $8500 with a two ton system you would be able to get Tranes new XL20 with a clean effects, whole house dehumidifier and somebody to carry your golf clubs on Saturday, I'm just sayin'.
 
  #12  
Old 03-23-09, 10:18 AM
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From the 1st time I saw this post it sounded a little "to good to be true" to me as well. $5000.00 for that furnace and a/c system is way high. I would be carefull, can they just give you the equipment or do THEY have to install it ? That would tell me all I need to know.
 
  #13  
Old 03-23-09, 12:52 PM
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Ok. I did ask him if I could just keep the system but he said he couldn't because you have to have a certified installer to install it. Basically he is just charging me only for the labor fee and the both the systems are free. I assume he might inflate the labor a bit to make a little extra. He said both the furnace and the air system cost about $5k. I'm only getting charged for labor. I know this sounds to good to be true but he is coming out later today to give me a final quote of what will be the final quote to have it installed. He said it does come with one year warranty on his part and then there is the manufactory warranty.
I do need a new system but I do agree with you guys that it might be some sort of scam but that's why i'm here to ask you guys what kind of questions to ask him. So, I don't know what to do yet.
Originally Posted by dun11 View Post
From the 1st time I saw this post it sounded a little "to good to be true" to me as well. $5000.00 for that furnace and a/c system is way high. I would be carefull, can they just give you the equipment or do THEY have to install it ? That would tell me all I need to know.
 
  #14  
Old 03-23-09, 12:55 PM
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But regardless i'm still getting the system for free! I'm still saving money. If I were to buy both the system and for install that would probably cost me closer to 10k or more. I still save money regardless. But I hear what you guys are saying.
Originally Posted by mike n View Post
I don't care where you are for a 1200 sq. ft. house $8500 ($5000 GRAND PRIZE + $3500 Install) Sounds to me like they are still trying to make 15% or so which I guess is OK just a little disingenuous.
The system for your home is going to be somewhere holf a ton either side of two tons so for $8500 with a two ton system you would be able to get Tranes new XL20 with a clean effects, whole house dehumidifier and somebody to carry your golf clubs on Saturday, I'm just sayin'.
 
  #15  
Old 03-23-09, 01:01 PM
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He said that it does have the regular manufacture warranty, but he has his own 1 yr warranty. I will call other places to see what it will cost me to have the same models bought and install.
Originally Posted by Jay11J View Post
The XR80 is 80% efficiency furnace. Means, that 80% of the heat the furnace makes will go into the home and 20% up the chimney. That's okay for your area since your winter temps are pretty mild.

XR13 A/C is 13 SEERS unit, depends on your local electric company, you may get a rebate from them on the A/C.. Your dealer should have the forum for your power company.

Equipment sizing, I'd say 2.5 ton may be good for your home (depends on your walls/windows), and furnace, I'd say no more than 60k.

As for Air's comment about the 5k, it may sound high for some people, but things are known to be higher in CA. so I can't say for sure if that in the game or not.. Prices are all over the board in every state and cities.

If I were you, for a piece of mind, may not hurt to ask for the 10 years parts and labor warranty on your equipments.
 
  #16  
Old 03-23-09, 01:05 PM
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Just wondering how will I know if his is a new system? I wonder if this is a used system or a refurbish!
 
  #17  
Old 03-23-09, 01:33 PM
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No HVAC guy...as the regulars know..but...

I've seen this other places..."You have won XXX, just pay us for delivery and install". And you could prob buy the whole thing outright for the same price.

Did you know winning a contest is taxable? Just like winning on a game show. Did you fill out a form or anything..or did you just get a letter or phone call? I can't find the references right now..but my wife won almost $2000 last year in contests, so we claimed it. And its based on MSRP..not what you can actually buy it for. They should give you a 1099(?) for your taxes.

Also, do you currently have A/C and Heat? Will they be replacing ducting? How about the A/C lineset? I know CA is more expensive, but $3500 just for labor seems high..esp in these days.

JMO
 
  #18  
Old 03-23-09, 05:07 PM
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He came out and did an estimate. He said he already taxed me for the syste. I asked and I dont need to fill out any forms. The total cost including all misc. materials labor and taxes "would" of cost $9125, but since I won the heating and air system the final total cost will come out to $3850.

I do have a/c and heating. The heating unit is probably about close to 40yrs old and the a/c unit probably around 10yrs old. I assume it needs to be changed out since it's so old.

I asked him about the duct work and he asked if there is any problems with the duct work like if it's not blowing air right in the bed rooms and what not and I told him i'm not sure. To me it seems fine. I will have to turn on the A/C and heater unit and go check all the ducts to see if air is blowing out smoothly or not. He also said main line or whatever you call where the blower blows the air throw, "the hole" on this old unit might be smaller. So, it may blow air out of the ducts better if the new system is installed. But the cost is only for putting the heating and air cond unit he didn't say it includes duct work.

So what are your thoughts. I'm still thinking about it and I need to ask my dad to. He said go for it but he wanted a final estimate. I feel like it's a good deal since I don't have to pay for the units but the labor does seem a little high. I assume that because he included the tax for the units. Maybe that's why it's higher in labor.

Now, when you do get a new air and heat system do they have to change out the duct work? Is that extra charge for labor?

Thanks for all your help fellas. This is a big investment I just want to make sure I don't get one over me. He said that he does include 1 yr warranty and that the trane system come with there regular manufacture warranty of 5yrs.

Originally Posted by Gunguy45 View Post
No HVAC guy...as the regulars know..but...

I've seen this other places..."You have won XXX, just pay us for delivery and install". And you could prob buy the whole thing outright for the same price.

Did you know winning a contest is taxable? Just like winning on a game show. Did you fill out a form or anything..or did you just get a letter or phone call? I can't find the references right now..but my wife won almost $2000 last year in contests, so we claimed it. And its based on MSRP..not what you can actually buy it for. They should give you a 1099(?) for your taxes.

Also, do you currently have A/C and Heat? Will they be replacing ducting? How about the A/C lineset? I know CA is more expensive, but $3500 just for labor seems high..esp in these days.

JMO
 
  #19  
Old 03-23-09, 08:07 PM
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Allright already

You obviously want to do this and we are having a hard time talking you out of it so go ahead but please you already have a model number just call atleast one other company tell them you want a new system and don't tell them anything about your "grand prize" I am betting you will get the same system from another company for about the same price that guy priced you labor and materials. Like I said the numbers that guy is throwing around for a two ton system would get you a top of the line system with limousine service to and from work the rest of the year!!!
 
  #20  
Old 03-23-09, 09:17 PM
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I have to admit, if that was the price for the whole system if that what that guy changes, YIKES!

I had my system changed out 4 years ago with a XV90 two stage variable speed furnace with A/C, Media Air Cleaner, Two stage t-stat, and 10 years parts and labor warranty for about $4,000
 
  #21  
Old 03-24-09, 01:06 AM
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I did call at least 3 different company. I told them I was looking for the same systems for both the air and heating unit and they all quoted me $7 to 9k.
Originally Posted by mike n View Post
You obviously want to do this and we are having a hard time talking you out of it so go ahead but please you already have a model number just call atleast one other company tell them you want a new system and don't tell them anything about your "grand prize" I am betting you will get the same system from another company for about the same price that guy priced you labor and materials. Like I said the numbers that guy is throwing around for a two ton system would get you a top of the line system with limousine service to and from work the rest of the year!!!
 
  #22  
Old 03-24-09, 01:09 AM
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Wow you got a good deal. I called at least 3 companies told them what it will cost me to have the same brand and model (trane xr-80 and xr13) for about $7 to $9k. So 3800 sounds like a good deal. I'm sure he is jacking up the labor cost to get a little extra.
Originally Posted by Jay11J View Post
I have to admit, if that was the price for the whole system if that what that guy changes, YIKES!

I had my system changed out 4 years ago with a XV90 two stage variable speed furnace with A/C, Media Air Cleaner, Two stage t-stat, and 10 years parts and labor warranty for about $4,000
 
  #23  
Old 03-24-09, 06:02 AM
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If the other 3 guys are coming close to what the first one said, then I'd say go for it.

Take some photo for us to see the before and after set up.
 
  #24  
Old 03-24-09, 07:00 AM
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As Gunguy mentioned, winnings are considered fully taxable under federal and state laws. I doubt your installer is going to pay your income taxes on your behalf. I think maybe he meant he paid the sales taxes on the units he is giving to you for "free" but I think you will still be liable for paying taxes on the $5000 winnings. Accounting for both state and federal income taxes, the additional taxes could easily cost you another couple thousand dollars! You need to check that closely, as your "free" system is already almost $4000.
 
  #25  
Old 03-24-09, 06:27 PM
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i'm pretty sure i'm not getting the systems for free. Cause he won't just give it to me. He want's to be paid for the installation. That tells you right there.
Originally Posted by Beachboy View Post
As Gunguy mentioned, winnings are considered fully taxable under federal and state laws. I doubt your installer is going to pay your income taxes on your behalf. I think maybe he meant he paid the sales taxes on the units he is giving to you for "free" but I think you will still be liable for paying taxes on the $5000 winnings. Accounting for both state and federal income taxes, the additional taxes could easily cost you another couple thousand dollars! You need to check that closely, as your "free" system is already almost $4000.
 
  #26  
Old 03-25-09, 09:37 AM
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Smells fishy. I wonder how many other people "won" a free system?

I would run from this one.
 
  #27  
Old 03-25-09, 12:40 PM
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I start to wonder that i'm being charge for the unit to. I'm having another guy come out to my house to give me another estimate. So far on the phone i've been quoted around 7 to 8k.
Originally Posted by jim-connor View Post
Smells fishy. I wonder how many other people "won" a free system?

I would run from this one.
 
  #28  
Old 03-25-09, 01:06 PM
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It still sounds like a pretty good deal..it's just not really free. I'm sure there are incentives to move equipment out the door. So they make no money on the equipment..just the labor.

As long as they don't start adding this and that and give you a firm price, it doesn't sound like some big ripoff. Not like the super cheap "tuneup" and then 2 weeks later you have no heat or A/C.

You have checked out the company haven't you? BBB and references?

Just don't forget the tax thing..may not apply if you did nothing to enter..I still can't find the exact info I was looking for.
 
  #29  
Old 03-25-09, 01:58 PM
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Three years ago this month I had a new Lennox 80% AFUE 2-stage variable speed gas furnace installed. It was a simple remove and replace and the next to lowest price was $2800. so Jay's furnace and air conditioning for $4,000. would have been a fantastic bargain in my area. If I had had A/C installed along with the furnace I'm sure the cost would have been more than $6,000.

As for the income tax issue...I'm not an accountant so take what I write with a peppercorn but if an individual can give a "gift" of $10,000 to anyone with no tax consequences why should a business not also be able to do this? I can understand if ck had entered a contest but if his name was selected at random from, say, the telephone book, there should be no income tax consequences for him.

Just my opinion.
 
  #30  
Old 03-25-09, 02:03 PM
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furd..thats why I was looking for the references. I think you are right..if you don't fill out an entry form or anything..I think you are in the clear. Just something I was bringing up.
 
  #31  
Old 03-26-09, 01:09 PM
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Ok so I had another guy come out to give me another quote. This time I went through SMUD (heating and gas company) they have rebate offer for their customers that want to install new units.
SO, the guy came out and asked me some questions and what not. I told him that the model I was looking into (xr-13 and xr80) were ok models but couldn't get a rebate offer through the smud company because those equipment aren't' energy efficient enough. But he said that if I were to use the same model as I said earlier he said it would cost around 6 to 7k because of permits, they would have to test out my ducts to see if there good some other things.
I told him that the guy who was going to install a new heating air unit was going to charge me $3800 that includes the unit, install, taxes and other misc parts. He said that that's not a bad deal. But this guy also said that he would do it under the table what not and that he has a better A/c unit which is a xl 14i and If i were to get a better furnace he would probably do it for the same price or even less. But I would get a better A/C unit (brand new).
To my original post about how I won the system I technically didn't win it because since the units are lower end models he probably included the price with the labor. He was making me think that this was a "free" item which is not. I asked him i can get a certified installer if you just give me the unit I can have it installed for cheaper. Of course he made up some BS.
The reason this guy is doing the job for cheap is because he not getting the permits, testing the ducts and whatever else that needs to be done by the "books". He said if I want to i can get the permits and what not but it will cost me more. Basically he's doing the job not by the "books" and that's why it's cheap. But he is doing things by the code at least.
What do you guys think. If I decide to go through should I go with the second guy that has a better A/C unit and get a better furnace, if he would do it for the same or cheaper should I go through with it? I mean I would get things in writing that he would give me a warranty and honor his part of the deal. He said he would do things by the code but of course not everything by the book to keep costs down. Unless I want to pay more and do things by the book. What are you thoughts?
Originally Posted by Gunguy45 View Post
furd..thats why I was looking for the references. I think you are right..if you don't fill out an entry form or anything..I think you are in the clear. Just something I was bringing up.
 
  #32  
Old 03-26-09, 01:16 PM
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I haven't checked with BBB yet but I will do it.
Originally Posted by Gunguy45 View Post
It still sounds like a pretty good deal..it's just not really free. I'm sure there are incentives to move equipment out the door. So they make no money on the equipment..just the labor.

As long as they don't start adding this and that and give you a firm price, it doesn't sound like some big ripoff. Not like the super cheap "tuneup" and then 2 weeks later you have no heat or A/C.

You have checked out the company haven't you? BBB and references?

Just don't forget the tax thing..may not apply if you did nothing to enter..I still can't find the exact info I was looking for.
 
  #33  
Old 03-26-09, 03:30 PM
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Sounds like the second guy is going to do a better job, and going to do stuff by the book and code..

I'd call the other company back and say sorry, and pass up on the "Free" system.

so, If I were you, I'd go with the second guy since you can get rebates/credit.
 
  #34  
Old 03-29-09, 07:18 AM
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Which HACV is better

Guys,

I have a 16 yrs old ac/furnace. The ac is 3Ton 8 SEERS, not sure about the furnace. However the furnace makes alot of noise. I decided to replace everything. A guy Trane guy I know for 6 yrs quoted me $4,000 on an American standard system 100K upflow 80 AFUE on the furnace and a 3 Ton JXV on the AC. He said not to go with Trane but its more expensive and it the same as American Standard.
I then called up Home Depot and thier guy quoted me XL15i 3 Ton 15 Seers AC and XV80 80K BTU 2 stage vaiable speed DC motor on the furnace for $6679 or I can go with a 95% furnace XV95 for $8112 where I would get back a tax credit of $1500 - final cost $6612. I have 2 stories + finished basement and my wife complains that the basement is always colder than the rest of the house in winter. The HD guy said that the latter system will elimnate the problem. Any advice?
 
  #35  
Old 03-29-09, 10:51 AM
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I'd go with the XV95 since you can get tax credit, and also you are in the colder states where the pay back on the 95% furnace is going to be faster than on the 80% furnace. Also you may get credit from your gas company on the higher rating 95%

The two stage will give you better comfort, and also be sure to get a two stage stat to go along with it.. (I perfer the Honeywell IAQ)

Also if you don't have any returns in the basement near the floor, get them to help "pull" the cold air off the floor, and also with the Variable speed fan, you can run the fan 24/7 in the winter to help move the air around the house.
 
  #36  
Old 03-29-09, 12:09 PM
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Thanks Jay. But what do you think should i ask the first guy to get me the 95% in the American Standard or just stick with Trane?
How do I go about getting the credit from the gas company?
The system comes with thermostat. should i ask he to get me the Honeywell or could I
just get it at any store?
Is the price qouted ok?
 
  #37  
Old 03-29-09, 04:26 PM
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You can ask the first guy for a quote on the 95% unit, and see what they come back at.

Did any of them do a Manual-J (Load Calc) on your home?

What kind of t-stat? Model # given?
 
  #38  
Old 03-30-09, 02:33 PM
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The reason why these guys that were going to do the install are cheaper is because although they do things by code the technically don't do it by the books sort of speak. I told the first guy that i decided to I didn't want to go through with it. I told him how about giving me the unit and I can get someone else that is certified to install it. Of course he said no because they would get nothing out of it and he said he pretty much giving up a 5k unit. But my understanding is that those unit doesn't amount to $5k because they are not energy star cert. So basically i'm paying for the unit and the install and i'm not getting nothing for free. It's funny that he saids he a christian guy that won't rip people off or anything but yet he's technically he is.

I did talk with the second guy even though he goes through smud he's not certified. He said he uses he buddys contractor's license which is a red flag.
Also I wouldn't be able to get the rebate because I will have to get permit and they would have to test my duct which mean they would have to take out my duct to make sure its good, test them and what not which will probably cost me another $1k or so.
 
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