Load Bearing Post?

I own a colonial house with a partial basement. There is a 8.5 ft wide opening between the kitchen and family room that is separated into two openings (3 ft and 5 ft by a post. The opening is 81 in high and ceilings are 8 ft high. The family room is on a slab and 7 inches lower than kitchen floor. Kitchen is built above the basement. I am trying to determine if I can remove the post.

The joists above and below kitchen run parallel to the wall/opening that divides the kitchen and family room. The beam in the basement running perpendicular to the joists is not underneath the post. The middle/peak of the roof runs perpendicular to the wall/opening in question however there are four sides to the roof (the majority of the roof slopes up from front and back with a smaller portion sloping up from the left and right). If you're looking at the house from the front the part that slopes up from the left begins above the second floor wall directly above the wall/opening in question.

Any guidance would be appreciated. Thanks and I apologize for yet one more load bearing question.

 

If there's a post there, it's bearing.

 

I peeled away the casing/trim and drywall. Stretching the entire 8 1/2 ft opening are 2 2x12s with plywood spacers. Does this suggest that the opening may have been originally designed to stand on its own and that the post was decorative. There was a rail across the larger of the two openings corresponding to where the eating area in the kitchen is. Any opinons?

 

What is the post sitting on?

If it is sitting on a real support (double joists,etc.) then it is probably load bearing.

If it is sitting on the subfloor and hanging out over a single joist it is probably not load bearing and was put in to divide the span architecturally and have something to attach the railing to.

Dick

 

There really isn't enough information here to give an approproate answer.

We'd need to know whether this is an interior or exterior bearing wall, how many stories above, and the width of the structure to even begin to give any accurate answer.

That said, the only way 2 2x12s is sufficient to act as a header for a span of 8'6" is if the header only bears the weight of a roof, has snow loads less than 30psf, and the building width is 20 ft wide or less.

This means your header was probably undersized to begin with and was found to be deficient and the post was added during a later renovation.

The bottom line appears that the existing header cannot self support (unless the wall is entirely non-loadbearing) and the post is necessary.

 

The post consists of 2 2x4s. They sit on the subfloor. Below the subfloor would be the piece of wood (band joist?) that sits on the edge of the basement foundation. The "wall" where the opening and post is is directly over the basement foundation. The opening leads to the family room that is constructed on a slab. Directly above the "wall"/opening in question is the second floor wall. The family room does not have a second floor above...only the roof. A small portion of the second floor wall above the opening is "exterior" and ends at the second floor roof.

As discussed above the majority of the roof above the 2nd floor has trusses that run from front to back. A small portion of the roof on the left and the right has a slope to it and has (in the attic) 2x4 construction that attached at a perpendicular angle to the trusses. The trusses in the space above the family room run from front to back.

The joists in each of the rooms run from front to back (parallel to the wall/opening in question and the joists in the basement run parallel as well. The beam in the basement would be about 5 feet away from the post in question.

I appreciate the help and feel free to ask for more information or clarifying remarks.

 

Still insufficient information...

But because the 2nd story roof is a 'hip roof' it makes this wall an exterior bearing wall....and 2 2x12s are insufficient to bear the loads of a 8'6" span unsupported. Max span would be approximately 5'6" unsupported.

If the roof of the family room is a 'shed roof' that attaches to the the wall above this header at the high point of the rafters, this header becomes and interior header with a maximum unsupported span would be less than 5'6".

If you have higher than 30lb snow loads and rafters in the family room that have drywall on the underside, the spans would be considerably less.

Doesn't look good for this header and it appears you would need an engineered beam/girder to replace the 2 2x12s if you want to clear span the 8'6" opening.

 

Thanks for all your help. The roof over the family room is a gable roof. The house is located in a northern climate abd the house is about 25 ft wide.

I guess I am surprised that 2 2x12s can't do more than you have alluded to.

 

Ok, for a roof and ceiling only with a width of 25 feet, 2 2x12s can only span somewhere around 7'10" unsupported.

No matter how you play this one, it just doesn't look like this header can do the job unsupported and hence the reason for the center bearing post.

Minimum to span the distance looks like 3 2x10s considering the loads....or an engineered beam.

 

If the roofs are framed (assuming I understand "front to back" correctly) with trusses parallel to the beam and the second floor is also framed in that direction, two 2x12's spanning 8.5 feet would be more than enough support for the wall opening. The beam should be adequate even if it supported the main house roof trusses, assuming the truss span is 25 feet and the roof total load is 40 psf. Of course, that would not be true if the beam carried additional load from the second floor or the family room roof.

Of course, the only way to know is to hire a structural engineer and I recommend that you do that rather than rely on information from internet forums.

Whatever the structural condition, three 2x10's will not carry any more load than two 2x12's since both beams would have almost the same Section Modulous and the 2x12's would have a 20% greater Moment of Inertia giving it that much more deflection resistance.