Basement


  #1  
Old 02-17-03, 08:25 AM
Maggie56
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Basement

We have just torn out a old basement suite built in the 50's. The subfloor 2x4's were completely rotted there was a leak from the water meter line (a steady drip, don't know how long that had been going on). We will clean with bleach to remove molds and bacteria hopefully. There is the white effervesence around the walls about a foot from the floor. I think this is from improper drainage on the exterior which we will fix in the spring time. The cement on the floor is crumbling stones coming out of it it has a real slant from the outside walls to the drain. We need to break into the concrete to install new drainage for a toilet and a shower.

Now the questions:
What can we do to fix the concrete floor?
Any ideas fro the mold cleanup I've checked out various sites, would like to hear from someone who actually did it!
Should be put a vapour barrier up under the insulation and then a on the wall board side as well.
Any all sugetions greatly appreciated.
Maggie
 
  #2  
Old 02-17-03, 08:42 AM
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Maggie56,

Due to the age of the home, I imagine that we have low ceiling to begin with. Trying to install sleepers and subflooring will rob you of space. If you are going to remodel this area, you can acquire floor levelers at Home Depot or Lowes - not cheap and then you have to mix and pour. Alternative to all this work is to use this product, again not cheap but provides excellent results;

http://www.maxxon.com/product_detail.asp?ID=2

How to clean up mildew, check out this link;

http://www.familyhandyman.com/200003...orks/main.html

The issue of insulation and vapor barriers, read the following for better insight as to how and where. I guess this is the best and most economical way to construct walls that would be placed on the exterior. I prefer to see 2x4 but as mentioned by others they can get 2x3's. You still need that W/T plate. Doing the framing 16" O.C. provides a solid base for your 1/2" drywall. If using traditional framing method, frame your new wall 1" from the vertical block/masonry surface if using R-13. The reason to keep the wood out from the walls is the moisture that could damage them. If using insulation like R-19 and only 2x4 studs, the insulation would touch the walls. I have stated before that if a homeowner did put thicker insulation in, and the wall was only 1" from the masonry surface, I have recommended hanging a vapor barrier between the back of the wall and masonry surface. This doesn't allow for the insulation to touch the wall and air movement is not restricted but at least you won't create damage to the insulation or wood. If you do want to increase the R value, move the wall out further or use the R-13 and then apply a rigid insulation over the studs (warm side) then drywall (not paneling) *Code advises a 15 minute fire rated material over any rigid insulation - 1/2" Drywall*..

Kraft Faced insulation is fine to use in the above scenario. No need for the poly and you can do everything easily. You may find this easier and I would do this versus unfaced and vapor barrier because I don't like to play with it any more than I have to.

Let me add one other thing, rigid insulation used on a concrete/masonry surface is fine. Considerations to make in using this is;

1. If you are just using 1 1/2" rigid and furring strips - A. You need W/T strips to protect the wood. B. The strips can be adhesively applied but they must be solid - mechanical anchors may have to be used to insure that if shelving is installed it will hold. Problem with this is, the penetration into a sealed concrete/masonry surface is damaged and subject to leaking. C. Any electrical boxes will have to be shallow - sometimes makes it hard to wire. D. You must use a fire retardant material over this as per Code.

(Most books, articles about rigid and furring strips fail to say anything about the use of W/T and this will get destroyed and be a good source for mold/mildew with the slightest hint of moisture)

2. Alternative which does add cost is to apply full rigid sheets to the concrete/masonry walls, adhesively applied, then place frame wall against the rigid, then insulate between studs and cover with drywall. The Rigid insulation does then act as a the vapor barrier. Do not tape/seal the seams.

Hope this helps!
 
  #3  
Old 02-17-03, 11:57 AM
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Doug,

I just found this site and must say I am quite impressed with what I have read so far.

Anyway, I am redoing the basement of my mid-50s bungalow with block foundation and I just wanted to confirm my reading of your #2 suggestion.

I read it as applying rigid insulation (untaped) to the foundation, frame against the rigid, use FG batts in the framing, apply a plastic vapor barrier, and then drywall to complete. Is this correct?

I am asking because I have seen various suggestions for basement construction which seem to say to use 2 vapor barriers - one against the foundation wall (poured or block) - and one between the framing and the drywall.

I am confused about the need for the second VB directly against the foundation.

Thanks for any help you can give in clearing up my confusion,
Dave
 
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Old 02-17-03, 01:02 PM
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Dave,

Your first question is responded with a yes.

The second is the 2nd vapor barrier is used as I indicated in my posting if you were to install thicker than normal insulation in a 2x4 wall if it was only 1" out from the block. Some municipalities require 2, but again you can call the City to verify the application they desire. I have attached one link that says this but bear in mind, different regions of the country will not use this alternative application.

http://www.whitebearlake.org/Buildin...ent%20Info.htm (Note #15 - sorry, I am from Minnesota but live in Michigan) This is a good guide for basement remodeling, in general.

Main reason is to keep the insulation and wood dry. We have some folks that place plain 2x4 stock wall studs directly against the block walls which in cases of moisture/condensation will create problems in time. It is considered a safety barrier.

Hope this helps!
 
  #5  
Old 02-19-03, 08:37 AM
Maggie56
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Basement

Doug

Thanks for the speedy reply! and for all the great info and the sites to check out.
Was good to know that it helped answer someone else's questions.
Thanks
Maggie
 
  #6  
Old 02-19-03, 09:24 AM
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Maggie,

You're very welcome! If you have any need for further assistance, the forum is always here willing to help and give the right advice for any situation. With the help of fellow members and our Moderators, we strive to provide the best answers to resolve any issues that you and others may undertake.

Thanks for the feedback!
 
 

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