Basement floods
#1
01-12-04, 06:05 PM
Built in a cliff!!
Our house is 8 years old. We bought it 6 years ago. When it rains the basement floods. I don't mean damp, it gets soaked.
I spoke to the builder (also the seller) about this problem. He told me they blasted out the bottom part of a cliff and set the foundation there. The back half of the basement is partially dirt and mostly cliff rock(which you can see) 6 foot crawl space, the furance, water heater, electrical box, and most of the water lines and drainage pipes are in here. The front half is the finished part with 2 bedrooms and a bath and is about a 3 foot step down from the unfinished part. About 10 to 15 times a year when it rains hard water comes under the foundation (through the rock) and back up through the unfinished part and drains straight down into the 2 bedrooms and bath from under the middle wall that separates the finished and unfinished parts of the basement. Builder says there is no way of putting drainage system outside of home and with the rock inside no way of digging with any success in there either. Any suggestions? Should we just get out now and forget it?
I spoke to the builder (also the seller) about this problem. He told me they blasted out the bottom part of a cliff and set the foundation there. The back half of the basement is partially dirt and mostly cliff rock(which you can see) 6 foot crawl space, the furance, water heater, electrical box, and most of the water lines and drainage pipes are in here. The front half is the finished part with 2 bedrooms and a bath and is about a 3 foot step down from the unfinished part. About 10 to 15 times a year when it rains hard water comes under the foundation (through the rock) and back up through the unfinished part and drains straight down into the 2 bedrooms and bath from under the middle wall that separates the finished and unfinished parts of the basement. Builder says there is no way of putting drainage system outside of home and with the rock inside no way of digging with any success in there either. Any suggestions? Should we just get out now and forget it?
#2
01-12-04, 09:20 PM
You are most likely getting water from two sources: through the rock/wall interface and through fissures in the rock. The rock/wall interface can be exposed an waterproofed and in some cases, capping the exposed rock keeps the water out from the fissures(worked for my neighbor). Your situation is beyond the typical realm of basement waterproofing contractors, perhaps an engineer would be your best aproach.
#4
01-13-04, 11:01 AM
Well, I'v been there, I did these kind of jobs many many times.
I am truly amazed again and again why people in your country think this is an unsolvable situation.
Frankly, if I was in your area I would go ahead and buy your house as it is, for probably a wonderful price....
The only way to solve the water problems is to do the job from the inside. I am doing this kind of jobs regularly, and yours is not as bad as other situations that I have handled. (On some jobs I had to use diving as the first step...).
Its a bit of a trick to tell you from here what should be done. I can do my best explaining, if you wish, but need more pictures (and a better english...).
Generally, the inside plasters of the walls has to be taken appart.
Than a proper waterproofing with Hidraulic Cements should be done all over the related walls. Special treatment should be done on joints and cracks. Its a bit hard to tell you the exact steps, unless you send me a picture.
But know that it can be solved. One can solve ANY and ALL water proofing problems and there is ALWAYS a solution. For example, you might even need to do injections of special cements into the rock and into the walls.
Purhaps go to the SIKA web site and ask your closest distributor
for a hot shot waterproofing contractor who is experienced with their products. The web link is:
http://www.sikaconstruction.com/con/con-dis.htm
good lack/
I am truly amazed again and again why people in your country think this is an unsolvable situation.
Frankly, if I was in your area I would go ahead and buy your house as it is, for probably a wonderful price....
The only way to solve the water problems is to do the job from the inside. I am doing this kind of jobs regularly, and yours is not as bad as other situations that I have handled. (On some jobs I had to use diving as the first step...).
Its a bit of a trick to tell you from here what should be done. I can do my best explaining, if you wish, but need more pictures (and a better english...).
Generally, the inside plasters of the walls has to be taken appart.
Than a proper waterproofing with Hidraulic Cements should be done all over the related walls. Special treatment should be done on joints and cracks. Its a bit hard to tell you the exact steps, unless you send me a picture.
But know that it can be solved. One can solve ANY and ALL water proofing problems and there is ALWAYS a solution. For example, you might even need to do injections of special cements into the rock and into the walls.
Purhaps go to the SIKA web site and ask your closest distributor
for a hot shot waterproofing contractor who is experienced with their products. The web link is:
http://www.sikaconstruction.com/con/con-dis.htm
good lack/
#5
01-13-04, 09:18 PM
Ed
The home is a split foyer. There is no exit to outside in basement.
There are 2 bedrooms--one on each side of the house with the bathroom and stairs to upper level in the middle of the front half. The unfinished (crawl space) is exactly half of the basement and mostly under ground. There is a flood drain built on the unfinished side of the wall (does not work--drains straight into house, tested it with a water hose), but it is a foot higher than the semi-make-shift concrete floor that is now crumbling from all of the water. I guess builder thought the water would jump up and into the drain-ha-ha. I have a tremendous amount of mold in the bedrooms. I've tried to clean it, but it is in the sheetrock. No use replacing it until the water problem is fixed, it'll just come back.
There are 2 bedrooms--one on each side of the house with the bathroom and stairs to upper level in the middle of the front half. The unfinished (crawl space) is exactly half of the basement and mostly under ground. There is a flood drain built on the unfinished side of the wall (does not work--drains straight into house, tested it with a water hose), but it is a foot higher than the semi-make-shift concrete floor that is now crumbling from all of the water. I guess builder thought the water would jump up and into the drain-ha-ha. I have a tremendous amount of mold in the bedrooms. I've tried to clean it, but it is in the sheetrock. No use replacing it until the water problem is fixed, it'll just come back.
#6
01-13-04, 11:39 PM
Thanks, I got it better now. You have not mentioned leaks from other areas. I guess all areas adjacent to the exterior rocks / dirt should be checked out. However, if only those areas that you have mentioned are leaking, I would do the following:
1. Strip all loose materials from the walls (dirt,stones etc).
2. strip off the "semi cement floor" that you said is damaged. (probably its a very thin layer too).
3. Water proof the big leaks areas in the rocks with a fast drying hidraulic cement (Sika Rapid). This will stop the major leaks and is just the start.It is best to do this when the leaks are active (while its raining).
The thing to do now is to build the inside walls and floor in the needed places. We do this with cement additives, roughly in the following way:
1. Stick metal bars (50 cm long, 8 mm diameter) into the wall , inside the rock. Bond them with epoxy glue (Sikadur 31).
Cover the whole wall with metal bars (same diameter) and connect these to the bars. You should get a sort of a metal net, 15/15 cm spaces between the pieces.
2. Do the same on the floor.
3. Make a cement mixture of 2.5 sand, 1 cement,1 gravel (the smallest agregates you can find) and add a glue (Sika latex) 30 percent in the water ratio. Add another waterproof additive called Sika 1 Concrete into the water/glue mixture. Mix it all THOROUGHLY.
4. Make another mixture: Cement with water and Sika Latex glue (50/50 water-glue ratio). This is your primer layer.
5. Make the walls wet (if they are dry). Brush the primer layer into the walls, rocks, dirt and all.
6. While the primer is still wet or humid, pour the cement mixture on top of it and cover the entire walls. You must create a wall of at least 7 cm thick. This is done in layers, but should be done all in the same time without letting one layer getting dry. If you have troubles doing so- (cement falls off the walls after one or two layers) you can add a fast drying additive called (Sika 4A).
Push the mixture strongly into the wall/rock.
You have created a totaly waterproofed wall, but we can do a second waterproofing layer afterwards.
7. You now have the floor to do. You do it basically in the same method, but its a much easier job.
Before you pour the cement, you get a self adhasive material calles "Sika Swell ". This material comes in tubes (like silkon). It expands 12 days after the cement is poured on it and it remains flexible. We use it in the joints between the floor and the walls, in the middle of the thickness of the cement.
8. Once the floor and walls are finished, you cover them now with an extra waterproof layer. Brush 2-3 layers of hidraulic cement all over the area, and put a mesh in between the layers.
Basically you now have a bomb proof walls and floor. It will last forever.
Yes.....that sounds complicated to do if you are not familiar with the subject. But I have done it many times and never had to return to a customer for corrections etc.
And if it all fails, you can always just buy me a flight ticket... :-)
Gabi
1. Strip all loose materials from the walls (dirt,stones etc).
2. strip off the "semi cement floor" that you said is damaged. (probably its a very thin layer too).
3. Water proof the big leaks areas in the rocks with a fast drying hidraulic cement (Sika Rapid). This will stop the major leaks and is just the start.It is best to do this when the leaks are active (while its raining).
The thing to do now is to build the inside walls and floor in the needed places. We do this with cement additives, roughly in the following way:
1. Stick metal bars (50 cm long, 8 mm diameter) into the wall , inside the rock. Bond them with epoxy glue (Sikadur 31).
Cover the whole wall with metal bars (same diameter) and connect these to the bars. You should get a sort of a metal net, 15/15 cm spaces between the pieces.
2. Do the same on the floor.
3. Make a cement mixture of 2.5 sand, 1 cement,1 gravel (the smallest agregates you can find) and add a glue (Sika latex) 30 percent in the water ratio. Add another waterproof additive called Sika 1 Concrete into the water/glue mixture. Mix it all THOROUGHLY.
4. Make another mixture: Cement with water and Sika Latex glue (50/50 water-glue ratio). This is your primer layer.
5. Make the walls wet (if they are dry). Brush the primer layer into the walls, rocks, dirt and all.
6. While the primer is still wet or humid, pour the cement mixture on top of it and cover the entire walls. You must create a wall of at least 7 cm thick. This is done in layers, but should be done all in the same time without letting one layer getting dry. If you have troubles doing so- (cement falls off the walls after one or two layers) you can add a fast drying additive called (Sika 4A).
Push the mixture strongly into the wall/rock.
You have created a totaly waterproofed wall, but we can do a second waterproofing layer afterwards.
7. You now have the floor to do. You do it basically in the same method, but its a much easier job.
Before you pour the cement, you get a self adhasive material calles "Sika Swell ". This material comes in tubes (like silkon). It expands 12 days after the cement is poured on it and it remains flexible. We use it in the joints between the floor and the walls, in the middle of the thickness of the cement.
8. Once the floor and walls are finished, you cover them now with an extra waterproof layer. Brush 2-3 layers of hidraulic cement all over the area, and put a mesh in between the layers.
Basically you now have a bomb proof walls and floor. It will last forever.
Yes.....that sounds complicated to do if you are not familiar with the subject. But I have done it many times and never had to return to a customer for corrections etc.
And if it all fails, you can always just buy me a flight ticket... :-)
Gabi
#7
01-14-04, 06:48 AM
water water
You know I think I would go and talk to a lawyer about now. With all that is going on about mole. You say the guy sold you the home new about the water. Id get out of it now ED
#8
01-14-04, 07:34 PM
Ed
We did contact a lawyer and he told us that VA has no law saying a seller has to disclose any water problem. I could take the seller to court and may even go in front of a judge that sees the seller morally wrong, but maybe not. Our lawyer says we can get out of it--just a lot of paper and leg work. We hate to lose the home, but I have been looking for a place since August. I have 3 children and one of them is epilepic and has been on allergy meds for 10 years, so getting out is probably what we will do. Get this, the seller (also the builder of our home) is a preacher. Makes you wonder, huh? Thanks for your advice. Thanks to the rest of you guys too.
