What is this method called and how to work around
#1
08-07-12, 03:13 AM
What is this method called and how to work around
I am in the beginning stages of planing a possible room in the attic over my garage and am trying to do research for reinforcing joists and what not and looking around in my attic right through the middle of where my room would be i have a 2x4 flat on top of the joists with what looks like a 2x6 on each side of it standing up. what is this method called and how can I work around this building a floor. Can I just brace between each joists and remove this. This is all still in planning so I am open to pretty much any ideas. Here is a picture if it helps explain what I am talking about
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j3...807_043957.jpg
thanks!
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j3...807_043957.jpg
thanks!
#2
08-07-12, 03:35 AM
Welcome to the forums! It is most likely a "stiffener" for the ceiling joist for the garage. Not a good one, and only half way done at that. My concern is that your garage is most likely floored to store Christmas trees and hats that no one wears. The structure won't support a live load of personnel and furniture. With the limited photograph we can see much of your infrastructure so we would be guessing at this time. Is the roof done with trusses, or is it stick built? What size ceiling joists are those in the garage? What is the clear span across those members?
The advice here would be sketchy since we are not on site. I would have a structural engineer look at the project just to see if it is feasible with the structure as it is. They can also recommend modifications to make it happen. You're not talking a bunch of money to have them come out, but if it fails without their blessing, your insurance may not pay to fix it. Besides, you gotta get permits anyway.
The advice here would be sketchy since we are not on site. I would have a structural engineer look at the project just to see if it is feasible with the structure as it is. They can also recommend modifications to make it happen. You're not talking a bunch of money to have them come out, but if it fails without their blessing, your insurance may not pay to fix it. Besides, you gotta get permits anyway.
#3
08-07-12, 04:23 AM
its an interesting setup to say the least because there are several area's in my house with vaulted ceilings. but the span is around 14 ft. the roof is stick built. the ceiling is 2X6's 16inch on center. I will take some more pictures tonight when I get home but I had already planned on sistering with atleast another 2x6. at each joist I was planning on calling a engineer just was trying to get some idea's to see if it was even possible.
#4
08-07-12, 09:03 AM
Good process. You'll know when the engineer gets your report. He'll let you know if there is more vertical support needed for the span or if sistering larger lumber would work. With 14' clear span you would have to graduate to at least 2x8 lumber to handle it. 2x6 can only span 11'6" in most types of lumber.
#5
08-07-12, 06:32 PM
here are some more pictures. I am kind of confused it looks like the joists are just kind of nailed to that huge beam that goes from the inside (living room wall to the outside of the house wall ) kind of like a deck ledger board or something spans all the way across the garage that seems like it could complicate things...
attic project pictures by briandabest - Photobucket
thanks for all your input by the way
attic project pictures by briandabest - Photobucket
thanks for all your input by the way
#6
08-08-12, 03:32 AM
It's called LVL (Laminated Veneer Lumber), and it can't be moved or cut. It is the support for the entire run of joists. They put it there because you can't span any further with 2x6 lumber. Too bad they didn't use joist hangers. The fasteners they used don't give very much vertical support on the beam except for its intended purpose of holding sheetrock.
#7
08-08-12, 04:21 AM
So I guess we will see what a engineer will say. I wouldn't be opposed to ripping most of the sheetrock down in the garage and replacing the 2X6 joists from one side of the lvl to the the other wall.(the area i want to build over anyways) Does that LVL really hold that much with no support from underneath? I would probably take the safer route if it did have the capacity to hold and use 2X10s with joist hangers on the lvl and completely remove the 2X6's
#8
08-08-12, 01:46 PM
We hold second floor houses up with 20+ spans with double LVL's with no settling problems. Standard dimensional lumber (2x's) have longitudinal grain only. LVL has 360 degree grain as the wood is laid in all directions, glued and heated under pressure to form the board. Very strong. In the plant where they make it, they cut it off in 53' lengths. I asked why one time....that's how long a railroad side load car is 
Otherwise there is no need to cut it as it comes from the plant. It could theoretically circle the earth, since it has no starting or stopping place.
Otherwise there is no need to cut it as it comes from the plant. It could theoretically circle the earth, since it has no starting or stopping place.
#9
08-08-12, 05:15 PM
It could theoretically circle the earth, since it has no starting or stopping place.
#12
08-09-12, 05:37 PM
Not really. He has to do a lot of calculations, inspections, recommendations....it's his name on the line and it must be right, so IMO it isn't too much for peace of mind knowing the job is as perfect as can be.
#14
08-10-12, 03:23 PM
Member
Make sure his P.E. license is current in your state, and that he is willing to show you verification that he carries current E & O, liability and workman's comp insurance.
And is the $500 a lump sum price (including a written report), or is that hourly? If it's the latter, keep looking for an engineer.
And is the $500 a lump sum price (including a written report), or is that hourly? If it's the latter, keep looking for an engineer.
#15
08-10-12, 04:08 PM
the 500 was a flat fee and included a report. the guy was having to drive around a hour to get to my house both ways. However as frugal as I am I kept looking and found another company that has done it for me. I live in a small town and the guy that is doing the evaluation actually does the structural inspections for the City I live in. He mentioned if there was anything wrong with it upon inspection he was the one that would be saying that something is wrong with it. He is only charging around 100$! In addition I told all of my measurements to a local lumber company and they also ran the numbers with span charts and said as long as I used at least 2x8's I would be good to go. I am still using 2x10's just because that's how i am. So today I also got my building permit and ran the engineers name by the codes inspector when obtaining the permit. He told me the guy was a really good guy. so I am waiting for the final report but he was pretty sure on initial calculations that 2X10's on the lvl would be more than enough!
#16
08-11-12, 06:38 PM
I live in a small town and the guy that is doing the evaluation actually does the structural inspections for the City I live in.
Are you actually in Hendersonville, or Dickson, or...? Just curious, but it also bears on how the work will be inspected.
