Need advise on Kitchen heat

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  #1  
Old 11-10-05, 03:57 PM
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Need advise on Kitchen heat

I'll make this a simple as possible, and if you have any clue of what I'm saying please give me your suggestions.

I have hot water radiator heat on the main floor of my house,I was going to get all baseboard heat for the whole floor but after getting the quote I changed my mind real quick. I know I can do it myself for cheaper but thats not going to happen.
I desided to keep the radiators but I have a problem which is , I remodeling the kitchen and there is absolutely no room for a radiator. I do know that I can't put a section of baseboard heating in the same line of radiators.
My question is I was on Slant-fins web site and they sell this forced air under kitchen cabinet heater unit, I think it's called (the kicker). Would this work to keep heat in the kitchen? I'm thinking maybe it would work but only because the old radiator I removed from the kitchen was the last radiator on the line of radiators before the pipes started to head back to the broiler.

They also sell cast iron base borad heaters, whats up with that? Is this something I could use?
 
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Old 11-10-05, 04:14 PM
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Kitchen heat

I have used these toe kick heaters & they do work well when installed properly. Your problem is going to be getting enough hot water to the heater because of it being at the end of the line. Cast iron baseboard has about the same btu output as fin tube baseboard. The advantage to cast is most of the heat is transmitted by radiation rather than convection with fin tube.
 
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Old 11-10-05, 04:17 PM
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You could use cast iron baseboard but you may like the fan unit better. It could be somewhat ineffective if it is at the end of the line for hot water though. It takes about 130-140 degrees to trigger the fan and it won't provide any heat if the fan isn't running. It will work to heat the room even though it is technically finned copper. There are several manufacturers of those units so check around.

Ken
 
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Old 01-12-07, 09:02 AM
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Hi,

I too am designing a new kitchen in an old house with cast iron rads.

I just talked to the tech at slantfin about using their 'kicker' heater as a replacement for a cast iron radiator. He told me that it would have to run in its own zone (separate thermostat and circulating pump) in order for it to work.

This is because of the difference in temp required by radiating versus convection style heat. I barely understand this.

I am considering just customizing a standard base cabinet to have the rad in the back of it and ducting some air through the bottom and out through the top. There'd have to be small fan in there to move the air, and ideally there'd be a filter on the intake side. I doubt that the air will be very hot, but the fan should at least move the heat from the inside of the cabinet to the outside world. I was thinking rather than a thermostat, just hook the fan up to the circulating pump circuit.

Thoughts? Anybody done this?

Thanks
Nack
 
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Old 01-12-07, 01:34 PM
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Nack, I applaud you for thinking but in this case your thinking is flawed.
(YellowTang, this is also for you.)

Radiators work by radiating heat directly to objects in the room, including people. Radiators will work just as well, perhaps better in a vacuum. Enclosing a radiator and then using a fan to move air past the radiator changes the method of heat distribution from radiation to fan-forced convection. In other words, rather than heating the room and people directly you will be attempting to heat the air and then hoping that the air that is being moved by your "small fan" will heat the room. The usable output of heat will suffer greatly in this configuration.

Radiators have different temperature and flow characteristics than do fan-forced cabinet convectors, which is what a toe space heater amounts to. Most likely using toe space heaters in a system that has mostly radiators will indeed require a separate loop and circulator but this is not necessarily a bad thing. Usually a kitchen has far different heat loss/gain characteristics than will the rest of the house and having a different loop with its own thermostat will allow the kitchen heaters to function separately from the rest of the house. I guarantee it will be money well spent.
 
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Old 01-15-07, 08:01 AM
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Furd,

Thank you for the explanation.

What if I just replace the cast iron rad with an equal amount of pipe? Run the pipe around the radius of the kitchen island, just under it's counter top. The pipe would not be boxed in so it should still be able to radiate heat into the open room.

Bleeding air out of pipe would be a problem so we'd have to include a bleeder valve or faucet at the top of the loop I guess.

Am I dreaming?
Thanks again!
Nack
 
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Old 01-15-07, 08:23 AM
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Heatloss calcs?

Have you done a room by room heatloss calculation? I would do this before jumping into potential solutions.
 
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Old 01-17-07, 09:16 AM
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no i have not
I was hoping to just replace the rad in the one room with something equivalent.
 
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Old 01-17-07, 09:40 AM
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Nack, given what you want to do, I'd really try and nail down some numbers, otherwise it could be a costly guess.

See the "Do it myself" thread for some links to heatloss. It isn't that hard and it will give you a much better idea of what options you have and what you need to do.

As for running pipe, yes you can do that. Different piping materials emit different amounts of BTUs per lineal foot at different supply tempratures. For instance copper emits (leaks) far more heat than thread black iron. By knowing what your heatloss is and verifying that against what you have now, you'd be able to calculate how many feet you would need and at what kind of supply temperatures. Try to keep safety in mind. Having a strip of 200F piping running around your kitchen could be a hazard on a cold day.
 
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