3 Heat Zones + AC and tstat questions


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Old 10-10-06, 08:52 PM
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3 Heat Zones + AC and tstat questions

I been looking over the forum for three nights and have not found an answer to two questions, hopefully someone can help.
My System: Weil McLain Oil fired boiler in the basement with 3 zones. All zones are using Taco 007 circulators and the control is Taco SR 503.
Zone1; Heating Zone to an Air Handler in the attic with AC. Ducts run to rooms in the second and first floor for heating and cooling.
Zone2: A new zone of 26' Hydronic Slantfin 30 baseboard on the first floor with about 25' of return.
Zone3; SuperStor Ultra 45 gal indirect water heater.

My Questions: It appears that when both zone 1 and zone 2 are calling for heat only one circulator activates at a time. I installed the baseboard on the first floor because the air handler was not heating the 1st floor from the vents in the ceiling. I was hoping that the baseboard would come on at the same time as the forced air to augment the 1st floor heating.
Now the tstat questions.
If I move the current heating and AC tstat to the second floor the AC will only be able to be adjusted from the 2nd floor (not ideal), If I instll a new tstat on the first floor and both floors call for heat the upstairs will run then the downstairs loosing the effect of both heaters heating the space. Ideally I'd like to keep the AC controls on the 1st floor and have that tstat control the baseboard, install another tstat on the 2nd floor to control the forced air heat from the air handler. I have two Honeywell CT3200A VR tstats.
As I'm typing this I think I answered my tstat question, now how to do it? I will have to determine what wires control AC and heat from the air handler then break them off to appropriate tstats.Right? anyone know what wires to move? How could I handle the fan for AC and heat from two different tstats?
Thanks for any and all help!
Eric
 
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Old 10-11-06, 03:35 PM
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Zone Problem

On the SR503, is the jumper between terminals P & ZC in place? If removed, it will make zone 1 the priority zone & shut down the circulator for zone 2 whenever zone 1 calls for heat. Normally, the priority zone is dedicated to the indirect.

http://www.taco-hvac.com/uploads/FileLibrary/SR503102-083.pdf

Before going to a bunch of trouble with thermostats, check the wiring against the diagram in the above link. Post back with results.

Since this deals with a boiler, I'm moving the thread to the boilers forum.
 
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Old 10-12-06, 07:51 PM
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Wired as a Cold Start Boiler

According to the diagram for the Taco SR 503 I have it wired as a cold start boiler. There is no jumper P to ZC but there is a jumper ZC to H. All other wiring is exactly like the diagram. I can not tell from the Taco document, can multiple circulators run at the same time if the thermostats are calling for heat? What is the difference between cold start boiler and tankless? I thought I had a tankless but with the indirect water heater does that change?
 
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Old 10-12-06, 08:18 PM
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Jumpers

With the P-ZC jumper removed, zone 1 has priority over any & all other zones. If zone 1 is calling for heat the control shuts down zones 2 & 3. I suggest you rewire it to put the indirect on zone 1. It would be easier to just install a jumper between P & ZC. The downside to this is it does not give any zone priority which in your application may not be a completely bad thing. If you don't have the original jumper, a piece of 14 gauge wire will do fine.

When using an indirect, most boilers are set up as cold start.
 
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Old 10-12-06, 09:03 PM
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I will try that!

I still have some questions concerning the tstat's. I don't think I explained in my original post that the air handler was doing the heat for both the 1st and 2nd foors the tstat was located on the 1st floor. I installed 26' of baseboard on the first floor because it was always warm on the 2nd floor and cold on the 1st. It cost me $800.00 a mo. in oil and electricity every mo. last year from Nov to March and we were cold! Now with this added zone of baseboard I was going to install a tstat on the first to run the baseboard and AC, then put the second Tstat on the second to control heat from the air handler. I am not planning on closing the vents on the 1st floor because I'm not so sure 26' of baseboard is enough to heat the 1st floor alone. Do you think it will work to split the AC and heat from the Air Handler? How about controlling the fan? The current tstat has 4 wires white, W, yellow, Y, green, G and red to R with a jumper to RC. Ihave the same model Hneywell CT3200a for the 2nd floor.
 
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Old 10-13-06, 06:14 PM
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Stats

Let me see if I understand what you have & what you want to do:
(1) Stat #1 is going to be for the baseboard on the first floor.
(2) Stat #2 is currently on the first floor also & it controls the A/C as well as the Hydro-Air system which supplys heat for the second floor as well as some for the first floor.
(3) You want to keep a stat on the first floor for A/C (tied to stat #1).
(4) You want to put a stat on the second floor to control heat from the Hydro-Air.

If all of the above is correct, here is a way to do it. Use the wire from the SR503 to RH & W on both stats. Obviously, the baseboard circulator's thermostat wire goes to Stat #1 & the thermostat wire from the circulator for the hydro-air goes to RH on stat #2. You will need a double throw relay in the air handler. From the normally closed side, wire the fan thru a strap on aquastat on the discharge of the hot water coil. Set it to close at about 160º. This will bring the fan on whenever the pipe gets to 160º thus giving you heat. The normally open side of the relay will close on a call for cooling & bring on the fan. Wire the air handler to RC, Y, & G on the downstairs stat. If the air handler has a circuit board, you may have to eliminate it & use a simple fan center. This is really a lot easier than it sounds.
 
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Old 10-15-06, 10:09 AM
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I don't know the Lingo

Grady,
Unfortulnately I've been looking up your recommendations and can not understand what the terms mean. Maybe if I tell you what is wired now you could explain what wire needs to go where.
On 1st floor Tstat:
W - connected to W on Air Handler
Y - Connected to Red wire to A/C Compressor Outside
G - Connected to G on Air Handler
R - Connected to R on Air Handler
On Air Handler in the Attic:
R - R on 1st tstat
W - W on 1st tstat
G - G on 1st tstat
Brown - connected to White wire to A/C Compressor Outside

Orange - capped off
violet - R to the SR 503 zone 1
Orange - capped off
violet - W to the SR 503 zone 1
The Air Handler is a FirstCo Model 36MBXB-HW
there is a wiring diagram here:
http://www.firstco.com/WiringDiagrams/L33041A.pdf

I'm thinking I could use the two Orange wires to control the baseboard from the first floor tstat, would it work to wire a new tstat on the second floor and wire it to the R, W and G as well as the 1st floor tstat?
All assumptions in the last post were correct (I'm surprised you understood what I was talking about).
 
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Old 10-15-06, 01:43 PM
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Wiring

I will try to make this as clear as possible but if you have any questions please ask before turning the power back on:

Turn off the power to the air handler & to the boiler.
From R on A/H to RH on upstairs stat & RC on downstairs stat. REMOVE JUMPER BETWEEN RH & RC ON BOTH STATS
From W on A/H to W on upstairs stat.
End of wiring on upstairs stat.

One violet on A/H to zone 1 (red) on SR503
Other violet on A/H to zone 1 (white) on SR503
From C (brown) on A/H to white on outdoor unit.
End of wiring on Air Handler

From Y on downstairs stat to Red on outdoor unit.
From G on A/H to G on downstairs stat.
From RH on downstairs stat to Red on Zone 2 of SR503
From W on downstairs stat to White on Zone 2 of SR503
End of wiring on downstairs stat.
Questions? If none, turn power back on & try the heat.
 
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Old 10-21-06, 03:04 PM
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It Works Great!

Thank You so much Grady... You Da Man!
I had to wait for the weekend to run a new wire to the 2nd floor thermostat, that was the hardest part. I followed your suggestions exactly and everything works as planned. I'm hoping to save hundreds with the new heating source. I also saved thousands because I was able to install the baseboard myself and with Grady's expert advice, wire the thermostats so it works as planned. What a great service this forum provides!
 
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Old 10-21-06, 06:12 PM
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Thumbs up It works, GREAT!

Way to go. Thank you for the kind words. I simply told you how to do it. The important part is YOU listened. When people will do as we say, we usually can talk them thru a problem. Congrats on a job well done.

Now do yourself or anyone else who may work on the system a favor. Write down what each wire on each thermostat, the air handler, & outdoor unit for the A/C goes to & put a copy on the air handler & one on the boiler.
 
 

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