Argo Industries AR842 Relay

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  #1  
Old 02-25-07, 01:04 PM
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Argo Industries AR842 Relay

To All,

I'm looking for some help regarding the "proper" wiring of an Argo AR842 Switching Relay w/Priority.

My system is as follows:

1) Weil-McLain HE II gas fired boiler.
2) Weil-McLain indirect fired water storage tank.
3) 3 heat zones: 1- First floor, 2- Second floor, 3- Future (basement).
4) All 3 heat zones are supplied via a single Taco 007-F4 circulator through 3 Honeywell zone valves, one valve for each zone.
5) Hot water is moved through the storage tank via a second Taco 007-BF4 circulator.
6) All of the switching is done via an Argo Industries AR842 Relay w/Priority.
7) Currently there are 2 thermostats, one for zone 1 and the other for zone 2.

Here is my problem...when Zone 1 calls for heat the zone valve opens but the circulator fails to kick on. Since the zone valve opens I assume all of the Argo relays are working fine but, as a precaution I switched the T1 relay with an unused one. When Zone 2 calls for heat the circulator kicks on just fine.

I don't think this is a new problem because zone 1 has always been cold. I think the Argo was wired wrong when I built the houses several years ago.

I fully understand that no one can troubleshoot the above problem with only the above supplied information. I understand that more info and pictures will most likely be requested. With that being said, if your kind enough to assist me please let me know what further info and or pictures you need to help me resolve this issue.

Thank you VERY much!

Bob
 
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Old 02-25-07, 02:02 PM
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Can't you just analyze zone 2's wires from stat-Argo-zone valve-circulator and duplicate it's wiring?..since zone 2 is making the circulator turn on the way IT should?

I don't know the wiring off hand, but common sense would tell me that incoming zone 1 juice would be doubled up somewhere with zone 2's incoming juice, so no matter which zone was calling for heat, the proper thermostat would energize it. Obviously it is doing so through the zone valve...but you don't have this doubling up between the zone valve and the circulator pump, as I would GUESS that you perhaps should...so that the circulator can work on the feed coming from either zone valve.

My diagnosis has more to do with in my own mind's common sense thinking based on general knowledge and wiring than it does specifically with your unit.

I have always been pretty good at figuring out stuff like this on electrical appliances when I know nothing about them, by analyzing stuff with the thinking I just mentioned.
 
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Old 02-25-07, 03:23 PM
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Sounds like a zone valve problem, try swapping the powerhead from the unused zone onto zone 1 and see what happens...

I went looking for I&O manual for the AR842 ... I did find ARM842, and thought they might be the same. The panel I'm looking at is for circulator zoning, not zone valve zoning. Is the AR different than the ARM ? ... gonna look some more ...

Is that the correct and full model number for your control ? AR842 ?

Reading your post again, you say that you have an INDIRECT water heater?
Are you sure that's not a tankless coil with a storage tank ? Reason I think this is because the pump on your water heater is bronze...

Pics needed, yes. As many as you can take... post 'em up on photobucket.com and let's have a look.

I'm assuming that you have an aquastat on the HW storage tank, and that's running to the priority circ on the ar842. The heating circ is on one of the normal circ terms. Your room t'stats are going to the zone valves, and the endswitches on the zone valves are wired together and going to one of the t'stat terminals on the ar842 ...
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-25-07 at 04:12 PM.
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Old 02-25-07, 07:53 PM
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Trooper,

I swapped the zone valve powerhead from zone-3 onto zone-1 and it appears as if that did the trick. Since I'm not an HVAC professional by trade I just "ass-u-me-d" that if the zone valve for zone-1 was opening properly when the zone-1 thermostat called for heat that the entire valve (including the powerhead) was working properly. I didn't know that the zone valve powerhead actually triggered the ciculator.

The paper-work I have reads: Argo AR842, I hope that helps.

Yes, there is an aquastat on the storage tank and yes, the HW storage tank is on the "priority" relay. The theromstats are wired to the zone valves and yes, the zone valves are wired together going to a thermostat terminal on the AR842.

Here are some pictures, please let me know if you would like some more:

http://www.lipowerweb.com/images/Boiler_1.jpg
http://www.lipowerweb.com/images/Boiler_2.jpg
http://www.lipowerweb.com/images/Boiler_3.jpg
http://www.lipowerweb.com/images/Boiler_4.jpg

Thanks for all of your help!

Regards,

Bob
 
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Old 02-25-07, 08:56 PM
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Great, easy fix, I like that!

Since it's fixed, we don't need more pics.

It does look like you were correct though about the DWH being an indirect. In that case, the pricey bronze pump really isn't/wasn't necessary. If you ever replace that one for any reason, you can use standard pump and save some bucks.

Yes, the zone valve opening is what tells the boiler to run. There's an "endswitch" in that head. When the valve opens, it actuates that switch, so if the contacts are dirty on the switch, no signal to boiler.

I think the ARM842 might just be a newer model number, cuz it appears to be the same panel. I found the PDF file of that control on Argo's website, under the "literature" tab, down at the bottom. It apparently has been discontinued though...
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-25-07 at 09:09 PM.
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Old 02-25-07, 09:59 PM
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Trooper,

What, exactly, are the 2-red and 2-yellow wires for on the zone valve. I assume the red ones are for the thermostat to connect to and I assume the yellow ones are for the "endswitch" to the Argo (in my case)?

Once again, I appreciate your help

Bob
 
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Old 02-26-07, 03:09 PM
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I think you are describing the " E " version of the Honeywell 8043 zone valve, right ? So, each valve has a pair of RED and a pair of YELLOW wires, yes ?

On that valve, the yellow wires are the thermostat and control transformer wires. The reds are the end switches.

[according to I&O manual on honeywell website:
http://customer.honeywell.com/honeywell/ProductInfo.aspx/V8043A1003
go to bottom and download the 5000 series installation PDF for wiring diagrams]

When the thermostat energizes the yellow wires, the valve opens and when it's all the way open, a cam pushes the endswitch closed. The endswitch closing is the signal the 842 panel uses to tell the boiler to fire, and which circulator to run.

The reds on each valve should be tied together, and going to (probably) zone TWO (marked probably as thermostat connection) on the argo panel.

If EITHER zone valve opens, you want a "heat call" to the argo panel, and with the endswitches in parallel, either(both) zone valve(s) will cause the argo to fire the boiler.

That argo panel isn't being used to it's fullest, you should have both zones 3 and 4 not wired to anything, correct? It's only being used to set up priority for the indirect heater.
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-26-07 at 06:24 PM.
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