Brand advice for wall hung boiler
#1
01-11-08, 11:10 PM
Brand advice for wall hung boiler
Hi
I have been without central heat since I pulled out my old broken oil fired boiler since I have spent so much time in research. I plan to do some rough work on the install and get a licensed contractor to finish. I have been researching some brands and I have been offered a monitor MZ. I have also looked at munchkin, NTI Trinity, Viessmann 100, Triangle tube, Baxi, and embassy as being in my price range. I am at least as interested in the space savings of a wall mount as the energy savings of a condenser. I have already put in a rinnia hot water hear. The heat load on my 2100' house is 56,000. All and any suggestions welcome.
Jon
I have been without central heat since I pulled out my old broken oil fired boiler since I have spent so much time in research. I plan to do some rough work on the install and get a licensed contractor to finish. I have been researching some brands and I have been offered a monitor MZ. I have also looked at munchkin, NTI Trinity, Viessmann 100, Triangle tube, Baxi, and embassy as being in my price range. I am at least as interested in the space savings of a wall mount as the energy savings of a condenser. I have already put in a rinnia hot water hear. The heat load on my 2100' house is 56,000. All and any suggestions welcome.
Jon
#2
01-12-08, 08:15 AM
The MZ Boiler has a fixed firing rate of 95 MBH. Your heatloss is 56 MBH and don't be surprised if your true heat load is under 40 MBH. My Manual J was 56K and if I clock my boiler at design, it's under 38 MBH input, so even a bit lower for the net heating output. That MZ will be short cycling. From everything I've heard it is a very solid boiler, but with its high fixed firing rate and minimal controls you'd have to add a buffer tank and external controls to make it work seamlessly for your home.
I really like the Prestige I had installed last winter. Under 100 watts for electricity all in when heating piped direct and a nice simple self cleaning heat exchanger design. It came to that, a Vitodens 6-24 or an Ultra 80... actually the Prestige wasn't considered until well after those, but I was glad I did. I was worried that it didn't modulate as low but it shined everywhere else.
I really like the Prestige I had installed last winter. Under 100 watts for electricity all in when heating piped direct and a nice simple self cleaning heat exchanger design. It came to that, a Vitodens 6-24 or an Ultra 80... actually the Prestige wasn't considered until well after those, but I was glad I did. I was worried that it didn't modulate as low but it shined everywhere else.
#3
01-13-08, 12:57 PM
The Burnham Freedom FCM70 modulates from 70k down to about 30k. That will get you fairly close on the upper side and close to the lower side. They include the concentric (polypropylene) vent material for wall hung straight through the wall, boiler circulator and outdoor sensor.
The Munchkin has been around for a long time. The important part of this endeavor is the installation and sizing. Sounds like you have the sizing down. The installation can take a great unit and make it a lousy or a fair boiler and make it more efficient.
The Munchkin has been around for a long time. The important part of this endeavor is the installation and sizing. Sounds like you have the sizing down. The installation can take a great unit and make it a lousy or a fair boiler and make it more efficient.
#4
01-13-08, 09:40 PM
Thanks for the input
Hey,
Thanks for the replies. I had the same concern about a non modulating unit. It even occured to me I might be better with a non condensing modulator then a condensing non modulating it is just that I had a good deal on a monitor. I am trying to get a green compact heater within my budget. I think the prestige looks like a good unit but I am not sure there are any distributers or any contractors familiar with it in my area. I was hoping to find a unit to buy direct within my budget and have help installing it. I live in NJ at zip 08330. If I could afford it I would have someone do all the work and put in a Boderus. but the prestige, munchkin, crown, viessmans 100, trinity, Baxi, Riva are more within my budget. Everone around here carries weil mcclain but I am not sure about that one. I just got a quote for someone to do the whole installation of a new product by bosch that is within my price but I am not sure what this is. I was hoping to buy the unit direct and then have someone hook it in. Thanks for your time.
Thanks for the replies. I had the same concern about a non modulating unit. It even occured to me I might be better with a non condensing modulator then a condensing non modulating it is just that I had a good deal on a monitor. I am trying to get a green compact heater within my budget. I think the prestige looks like a good unit but I am not sure there are any distributers or any contractors familiar with it in my area. I was hoping to find a unit to buy direct within my budget and have help installing it. I live in NJ at zip 08330. If I could afford it I would have someone do all the work and put in a Boderus. but the prestige, munchkin, crown, viessmans 100, trinity, Baxi, Riva are more within my budget. Everone around here carries weil mcclain but I am not sure about that one. I just got a quote for someone to do the whole installation of a new product by bosch that is within my price but I am not sure what this is. I was hoping to buy the unit direct and then have someone hook it in. Thanks for your time.
#5
01-13-08, 10:21 PM
I'm not sure about the Bosch. To me it sounds like someone is using an on-demand tankless water heater. Bosch actually owns Buderus and the Buderus GB142 is actually sourced from an outside company IIRC. I think part of the price of teh Buderus is that it comes with a pre-built primary-secondary manifold arrangement. To me, the controller was a bit odd (only had indoor reset at first), I prefer steel piping (the pre-built manifold is all copper) and didn't want the increased water chemistry maintenance requirements associated with an aluminum blocked boiler. Their reputation in the field seems very good I must say.
I would have a licensed contractor hang the boiler, vent it, wire it and do a combustion analysis. If you don't, you'll be in a bad spot for warranty coverage. You can bring the piping to a certain point but then after that I'd pay to have it done - cheap insurance in the long run.
You should be able to find out who installs Triangle-Tube is your area by contacting the area representative.
If you wanted to pipe to a large buffer tank and add an outdoor reset controller for the central heating piped directly off the buffer tank, you could make a pretty sweet system with the MZ.
I would have a licensed contractor hang the boiler, vent it, wire it and do a combustion analysis. If you don't, you'll be in a bad spot for warranty coverage. You can bring the piping to a certain point but then after that I'd pay to have it done - cheap insurance in the long run.
You should be able to find out who installs Triangle-Tube is your area by contacting the area representative.
If you wanted to pipe to a large buffer tank and add an outdoor reset controller for the central heating piped directly off the buffer tank, you could make a pretty sweet system with the MZ.
#6
01-14-08, 10:34 PM
bosch
Yes I was wondering about the bosch. The contractor did say that bosch owns bodelis. He said that this unit was a brand new product from bosch that he only got the brochure on that week. It is a condensing unit so not a tankless heater in the normal sense but is it a condensing water heater, I don't know. This is a large contractor with three locations. I don't know about a buffer tank. The whole point was to free up space in the basement. The bocsh comes with a good warranty. I pulled the old oil heater out and the pipes are just sitting there. Triangle tub is definitely in my price range. Is anybody familiar with viessman's lifetime warranty.
#7
01-15-08, 06:05 AM
Does it carry the "H" (Hydronics Institute certification) stamp. Most states require the "H" stamp for for heating equipment. Some equipment from Europe does not and some inspectors are starting to shut them down.
Here are a few links so you can see what I mean
http://www.buderus.net/LinkClick.asp...id=108&mid=647
Here are a few links so you can see what I mean
http://www.buderus.net/LinkClick.asp...id=108&mid=647
#8
01-15-08, 07:02 AM
Bosch
I looked further into the Bosch. It is a condensing water heater and not recommended for heating. The contractor agreed to this and said he did not know why the bedurles rep recommended it. The Buderlus install was out of my price range. I can not find anyone who knows anything about the trinity. That leaves me with the munchkin and the weil mcclain ultra. I am still looking for a installer for a unit I choose that is familiar with wall hung installations. Thanks so much for your time and feedback.
#10
01-15-08, 08:43 PM
trinity
By the way, thank you Mr. Who for your input. I had already emailed NTI for a lead and someone emailed me back with a name of a supply house in Cape May. I called them up and not only had they not heard of Trinity Tub but know nothing about wall hung boilers in general. I have yet to try your recommended person but the other person who replied had the same email domain. If I want to find someone with some experience with a previous installation it will probably come down to a munchkin or ultra.
#11
02-14-09, 11:08 AM
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anybody can install trinity
I have a hard time to find an experience technician who can install trinity boiler, the person referred by the company asked too much money to install it. Definitely need a phone number to call in NJ area asap if you know somebody. thanks
#12
02-15-09, 06:39 PM
I would steer from Monitor boilers as they are just about to close the doors I hear, Trinity (NTI) has continued to have serious issues, the Munchkin uses the Giannoni heat exchanger that has had numerous failures at 5 years and anything aluminum is not lasting (Weil McLain, Utica, Dunkirk).
Your best choice would be the Triangle Tube Prestige Boiler.
Your best choice would be the Triangle Tube Prestige Boiler.
#13
02-27-09, 06:17 PM
Does anyone have a recommendation on a wall hung boiler that can be used for heat and domestic hot water. I have a small 12 unit apartment building I'm reneovating. Each unit consists of about 550 square feet and I would like to have separate utilities for each unit. The building is in a flood zone and the new building code won't allow me to put mechanical systems in the basement so I need something small to be put in each unit. Any ideas - cost, reliability, ease of installation, and space are all important factors. Thanks for your help and to those that have replied to this forum, I've already learned a lot.
