Tekmar 260 install questions


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Old 02-28-08, 05:42 AM
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Tekmar 260 install questions

I seem to be confused as to how the 260 should be wired into my system. I have Erie 4 wire zone valves, one of wich is used for the DHW tank. After tracing the existing wiring I see that the two red wires on the zone valve go to the aquastat, one black goes to the t-stat and the remaining black goes to the C terminal on the 24v ac tranformer. I'm using the Tekmar wiring instructions (A260-2). I'm not sure how the zone valves hook up to the 260's boiler demand inputs(1 & 2). To me it seems that the zone valves have too many wires. Please help.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 07:21 AM
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I think the implication of the wiring diagram where the end swiches tie together is that some sort of zone valve control would be used. Something like a Taco ZVC. There might be a way to do it with just the existing wires, but I'm electrically challenged. The ZVC is simple to wire and would make things pretty easy.

Note that a valve for DHW means that DHW priority is not available.

If you can add an indoor sensor (search around here for a few relevant threads on the hows and whys), that drastically improves the performance of the control.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 08:39 AM
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xiphias, I have the indoor sensor, was smart enough to read about the benefits of having one here . About the zone valves, are you thinking because mine are 4 wire that the Taco ZVC is needed ?
 
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Old 02-28-08, 08:47 AM
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Have you emailed Tekmar or Erie? They would probably know which two of the four wires to connect for the boiler demand. The user and application files for the 260 on Tekmar's web site don't show anything and there are no related service bulletins.

Now wiring a DHW circ would be easy enough... wanna start changing the piping a bit?
 
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Old 02-28-08, 09:41 AM
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I'm thinking along Who's lines: it's which wires do the end switch. And to be honest, I don't have a clue about how 4-wire valves work. A ZVC would just make it easier for someone like me who is electrically challenged: hook all stats and valves to the ZVC and run the ZVC TT output to the 260.

Like this: http://www.taco-hvac.com/uploads/Fil...ry/102-090.pdf

You might also contact the tekmar rep for your area and see what they suggest. In northern Jersey, tekmar's site says it's Thermco in Clifton.

You might also ask them if using the priority on the ZVC would allow the tekmar to be set to use DHW pump, which would give you priority. The ZVC would shut off the space heat, open the DHW, and the tekmar wouldn't know the difference: it would just know there's a DHW demand. (Have no idea if that is rational or do-able!)
 
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Old 02-28-08, 10:17 AM
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One caveat against the DHW zone valve being wired to a common ZVC would be that the supply temperature on a domestic call will be affected by the outdoor temperature. The DHW needs 180 water which is why it has those connections.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 12:34 PM
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We're both right. I think. Take a look at the Taco link above. There's a separate end switch out of the ZVC, so you could run the space heat zones on TT to 1&2 on the 260, and the DHW zone to 3&4. I think.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 01:02 PM
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Thanks guys for all the help. I will contact Tekmar and Erie about the 4 wire valves. I was looking at the ZVC and was wondering how the DHW would work, I would like it to be on some type of priority setup.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 01:13 PM
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I think the separate end switch out of the ZVC would do it. The ZVC would shut off the space heat zones, and open the DHW zone. In the process, the extra end switch on the ZVC closes terminals 3&4 on the 260, which generates the DHW demand and the supply target automatically goes to 180F.

This may not work, and Thermco should be able to say whether or how it could. One trouble spot I see is if the 260 tries to limit the DHW call, which it does at very cold outdoor temperatures (it's hedging against space temp falling too much). It would try to restart the heating zones but the ZVC might still see a demand on the priority zone, so the space heating zones wouldn't open until the tekmar let go of the DHW call, which it wouldn't do until the ZVC let it go. Almost like an infinite loop!

The bulletproof option is to change the DHW zone to a circulator and wire direct to the 260.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 01:48 PM
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Now wiring a DHW circ would be easy enough... wanna start changing the piping a bit?
Originally Posted by xiphias View Post
The bulletproof option is to change the DHW zone to a circulator and wire direct to the 260.
What's that echo?

...................................

Actually there is domestic priority override setting on the 260. It even overrides based on outdoor temps. It'll override in less time when the outdoor temps are cold.

Smart controller!!!
 
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Old 02-28-08, 02:03 PM
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Actually, looking at the ZVC link that xiphias included I think he's right. The switch for the DHW circ is on the neutral side not the hot side so I think it would work.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 04:08 PM
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Thanks guys, I really appreciate your help. I am contacting Taco, Tekmar and Erie to see what they have to say. If I did swap the DHW zone valve for a circ just how complicated of a job would that be ? I can sweat pipe and work with black iron but I'm not sure about the physical layout. I guess I should tackle one problem at a time though.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 06:06 PM
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Let's see some pics of the boiler and adjacent piping so we can venture a guess at the scope of work.
 
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Old 02-28-08, 06:38 PM
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Here are some pics.





 
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Old 02-28-08, 06:41 PM
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A few more.




 
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Old 02-29-08, 10:23 AM
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First things first: 1) Pipe the pressure relief valve to within 6" of the floor. 2) Pipe the backflow preventer to within 6" of the floor.

You have a HeatManager on there already. Why the 260?

Is there a bypass that will protect the boiler from low return temps, or will you run it at ~130F min supply temp? If you're running at min 130F, then the reset range will be pretty narrow and it might be better to use the HeatManager.
 
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Old 02-29-08, 12:59 PM
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xiphias, I will make the pipe corrections you mentioned. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

I am going to take the Heat Manager out of the system. I do not have a bypass but would install one to get the most from the 260.

Here is the response from Thermco about the 260 and 4 wire zone valves, what do you think ?

Hi Joe,

Any zone valve that has an end switch would be compatible to make a boiler demand to the Tekmar 260 controller. The tekmar control is looking for a low voltage demand on terminals 1 & 2. Switch the 24v hot leg through the end switches to terminal 1, and connect terminal 2 to the common of that same transformer. This will create the boiler demand & in turn the 260 control will close the P1 contact, and fire the boiler based on outdoor reset temperature.



The zone valve motors need to be wired to your thermostats & a 24v transformer.



The heating zones themselves are not controlled by the tekmar 260 controller.



If you also are using a zone valve for an indirect hot water heater, that end switch would be wired to terminals 3 & 4 in the same fashion as above to create a 24v domestic hot water demand.



-Dave





Dave Parker

Thermco
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-29-08 at 03:35 PM. Reason: removed phone # and email - personal info
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Old 03-01-08, 07:19 AM
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Bump.


Taco was unsure about using the 260 and a ZVC406. They recomended using all Taco equipment for best results.
 
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Old 03-01-08, 09:14 AM
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And Tekmar said?
 
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Old 03-01-08, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Who View Post
And Tekmar said?
Hi Joe,

Any zone valve that has an end switch would be compatible to make a boiler demand to the Tekmar 260 controller. The tekmar control is looking for a low voltage demand on terminals 1 & 2. Switch the 24v hot leg through the end switches to terminal 1, and connect terminal 2 to the common of that same transformer. This will create the boiler demand & in turn the 260 control will close the P1 contact, and fire the boiler based on outdoor reset temperature.



The zone valve motors need to be wired to your thermostats & a 24v transformer.



The heating zones themselves are not controlled by the tekmar 260 controller.



If you also are using a zone valve for an indirect hot water heater, that end switch would be wired to terminals 3 & 4 in the same fashion as above to create a 24v domestic hot water demand.



End of statement.

Who, what do you think ?
 
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Old 03-01-08, 12:50 PM
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I feel compelled to research Erie ZVs, in particular what exactly each of those 4 wires does.

Nahhh... I'll resist it. You knowing their functions and applying that knowledge to what Tekmar just said gets my vote.
 
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Old 03-01-08, 03:45 PM
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I think the Erie's are very similar to the Honey's ...

The reds are probably the end-switches, and the blacks would be the yellows on the Honey ...

I think, therefore, I could be wrong...

Taco's got a "wiring guide" in PDF on their website somewhere that shows all kinds of interconnects and different ZV's ...
 
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Old 03-02-08, 05:16 AM
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Sounds like you've got enough info to do the basic install correctly. Have at it.
 
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Old 03-03-08, 05:49 AM
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Thanks guys for all your support. When I finish the electrical hookup and have everything working I would like to pipe in a boiler bypass.
 
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Old 03-30-08, 07:55 PM
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For a 4 wire zone valve, you can use a ohmmeter or a continuity tester to determine the wiring. With the wires disconnected, there will be two wires that always show continuity. These wires are the motor wires and when connected to 24vac will open the valve. The other two wires should show no continuity ( open ). If you manually open the valve with the lever, these two wires should now show continuity. If you get this far, these last two wires are the end switch wires, and the first two are the motor wires. They should be color coded in pairs, which should bear this out.
 
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Old 04-02-08, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by svenyonson View Post
For a 4 wire zone valve, you can use a ohmmeter or a continuity tester to determine the wiring. With the wires disconnected, there will be two wires that always show continuity. These wires are the motor wires and when connected to 24vac will open the valve. The other two wires should show no continuity ( open ). If you manually open the valve with the lever, these two wires should now show continuity. If you get this far, these last two wires are the end switch wires, and the first two are the motor wires. They should be color coded in pairs, which should bear this out.
Thanks for the tip, I will try that. I have not had time to hook this thing up yet, with 2 boys under age 5, me getting the flu and a death in the family the 260 sits next to the boiler waiting to be hooked up.
 
 

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