Can I DIY zone valve?

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Old 02-24-09, 05:00 PM
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Can I DIY zone valve?

Hi all.
I have recently started doing some handyman work for a property management company. I do most repairs around my own home also.
One of the occupied units has heat all the time. Changing the thermostat has no effect. The apt is crazy hot.
If I go to a vacant unit and move thermostat up and down, I can hear that Honeywell thing (which I am told is a zone valve) making noise.
In this other apt, moving thermostat has no effect.
I was told by plumber at Home Depot, that this is more than likely the valve, not T-Stat.
I have the part number, and know where I can buy it, should I do it myself, or tell property owners to call a plumber/HVAC tech?
Thanks in advance
Oh yeah... and I saw where it looks like you could manually open it, but not sure how to change it.
It looks as though you would have to put something long in there because where it says "manual open", there is nothing right there.
 

Last edited by SomeGeek; 02-24-09 at 06:39 PM.
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Old 02-24-09, 05:32 PM
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What is the model of the zone valve?

You should be able to change the powerhead yourself... if you are reasonably handy.

Are you sure someone didn't manually open the valve and leave it that way? Is there a lever on the valve?

Do you own a multimeter and know how to use it?
 
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Old 02-24-09, 06:36 PM
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Zone valve

Originally Posted by NJ Trooper View Post
What is the model of the zone valve?

You should be able to change the powerhead yourself... if you are reasonably handy.

Are you sure someone didn't manually open the valve and leave it that way? Is there a lever on the valve?

Do you own a multimeter and know how to use it?
I am reasonably handy. I do have a multimeter and know how to read voltage. Been 20 years since I had to read ohms / resistance. I know we are looking for A/C current.
I am not sure, but suspect this should be a 24V application?
The model is Honeywell V8043D1197
The valve is about $90 and install was quoted at $220.
Thanks for the reply
 
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Old 02-24-09, 07:41 PM
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Oh yeah... and I saw where it looks like you could manually open it, but not sure how to change it.
It looks as though you would have to put something long in there because where it says "manual open", there is nothing right there.
There should be a metal lever in that slot... are you saying that there is just a 'slot' but no lever?

The valve itself might be OK, and just the 'powerhead' needs to be changed... $220 is pretty steep to change a head... takes about 10-15 minutes...

There's instructions here how to change the powerhead:

V8043 Install / maintenance
 
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Old 02-24-09, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by NJ Trooper View Post
There should be a metal lever in that slot... are you saying that there is just a 'slot' but no lever?
exactly, just a slot, no lever
is the lever part of the head, or the valve?
Thanks for th link.
I will look there now
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-25-09 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 02-24-09, 10:00 PM
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That link does not include the 8043 D, which is normally open according to the manual.
And I am still not sure if I have to shut off the water if I were to change the head only . Since the valve is only closed when energized, and I am guessing that energized means a voltage applied?
Also, if a normally open valve is closed when NOT energized, does that not indicate that there is no power coming from the t-stat? Maybe t-stat could be problem?
I understand completely the difference between a n/o and n/c circuit when it comes to electronics, but when there is water there also.....
I would like to be sure.
The manual does not indicate if manual lever is on valve body or head either
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-25-09 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 02-25-09, 03:31 PM
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Hang on... hit the brakes, hard!

Why is there a normally open valve installed?

What if someone accidentally or carelessly installed the wrong valve? Normally OPEN means there will be heat ALL THE TIME! No wonder the unit is so hot!

All those valves are the same... you do not have to drain any water to change the power head...

but what I do NOT know is whether or not the normally OPEN valve uses the same BODY as the normally closed valve.

In other words, just changing to a normally CLOSED valve POWERHEAD may not fix it if there are differences in the BODY of the valve as well.

AND, perhaps there is a reverse acting thermostat installed, or maybe WAS installed, and someone changed that out not knowing...

So, WHY is there a normally OPEN valve installed there?

Also, if a normally open valve is closed when NOT energized
That's backwards... Normally OPEN means OPEN when NOT energized. Same as a relay contact...

The lever is part of the powerhead. Maybe the NO valves don't have the manual lever? I dunno, never seen one.

Try this PDF... shows the D model... but for the most part, they are all the same thing...

V8043 - C - D - F - G
 
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Old 02-25-09, 03:39 PM
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Also, if a normally open valve is closed when NOT energized, does that not indicate that there is no power coming from the t-stat? Maybe t-stat could be problem?
USUALLY not... but don't overlook that possibility. I suspect some persons have been 'hacking' at a problem for a while there and done some things maybe they should not have... like put the wrong valve in... or wired something wrong... or put a wrong thermostat in...

The normally OPEN valves POWER CLOSED... and the thermostat doesn't actually provide the power to the valve, that power comes from a TRANSFORMER, and the thermostat is simply the 'switch' that turns it on and off...

So, AFTER it's determined whether or not the valve is the wrong one, and that problem is solved, you MAY have ANOTHER problem too... maybe a bad transformer, or thermostat, or wiring... but you have to check that zone valve and make sure that's the correct valve before you go any further.
 
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Old 02-26-09, 01:04 AM
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So, AFTER it's determined whether or not the valve is the wrong one, and that problem is solved, you MAY have ANOTHER problem too... maybe a bad transformer, or thermostat, or wiring... but you have to check that zone valve and make sure that's the correct valve before you go any further.

All the units have n/o valves. All the units have manual lever removed so tenants dont mess with them. There IS a reverse acting t-stat installed.
I called the plumber today. He came and said there is no power to the zone valve. We went to the boile room and checked transformer. NFG. He days he has replaced it many times, keeps blowing. May be a short in the walls, which is possible, since one of the top floor units had a flood, and it is still dripping down to the basement 2 weeks later. (not heavily)
He says we have to check for a short in every unit.
Seems to me that it might not be a better idea to ask other tennants if they ALSO have full heat, rather than checking every unti @ $100/hr.
I see that there are 4 transformers for the whole bldg, so they are obviously shared. Only one unit couldnt have the problem right? Wouldn't it make sense to start with other units on that transformer, rather than check every unit?
These people seem to know and trust this plumber, but I am not so sure...
What do you think?
 

Last edited by NJT; 02-26-09 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 02-26-09, 03:52 PM
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We went to the boile room and checked transformer. NFG.
I'm not surprised at the diagnosis... I been standin' here pointing at the transformer... but maybe you couldn't see me from there?

Usually those transformers are 40 VA jobs, and can generally power four valves safely... Depending on how many zone valves there are on the circuit, the transformer could be overloaded.

I'm not sure why they would use N.O. zone valves... but maybe it's a 'commercial property' thing, where if the valve fails they want it to fail HOT rather than cold... no freezing tenants ya know?

Thing with that is that MOST of the time the valves are POWERED... and using electricity (waste $)... and putting a near constant load on the transformer (could overheat more easily)...

Every one of those valves is like a ten watt light bulb that rarely gets switched off...

It's easy enough to put an ammeter on the 24V line and see how loaded the transformer is... a quick 'finger test' will tell you if it's overly hot... if it is too much current, some rewiring should be considered to shed some load to another transformer, or another transformer added. I wouldn't wanna see much more than say 1.5 A draw on the secondary...
 
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