Baseboard not getting hot

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Old 11-16-12, 07:33 PM
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Unhappy Baseboard not getting hot

The boiler is running fine. The pressure guage reads 15psi yet i do not have heat in the house. Some of the baseboard are warm at best, and some are stone cold.

When i try to bleed the baseboard, hot water comes out of the bleeder, but the baseboard remains cold. Cold water comes out of another baseboard. I am confused and i need help. Anybody has any idea what could be the problem? The system is 1 zone.
 
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Old 11-16-12, 07:44 PM
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Does your system have a circulator pump ? You didn't mention one. That would be the place to start. Pictures of your setup are always a big help too.
 
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Old 11-16-12, 07:52 PM
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Never trust your pressure gauge.

http://www.doityourself.com/forum/bo...ure-gauge.html

Cast iron baseboard?

Make model of boiler and what does the temp say on the boiler gaige?

Yes check the circulator. Let us know if its running. Sometimes you need to feel them for vibration to know that they are on.
 
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Old 11-16-12, 08:11 PM
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The baseboards are not cast iron. The circulator is working but the oil man told me that the circulator is too small and i need a bigger one. I don't want to spend the money and find out later that was not the problem. The temp read 180F This is a burnham and the burner is beckett.
 
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Old 11-16-12, 08:20 PM
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Here are some pictures
 
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Old 11-16-12, 09:33 PM
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I see your fill valve to the boiler is closed. If its still closed from 2008 you have issues.

I would say you need to verify your gauge as in the link I posted in #3.

Do not open that valve ( If its still closed..LOL) until the boiler cools some. You could crack the boiler maybe. You may just need to add water. ( Yellow handle in last pic)

But who knows what happened i since 08.

If your gauge is off and there is not enough pressure in the boiler the water will not move.

What is the # on that circ and how many floors do you have?

This is a burnham and the burner is beckett.


Funny your burner says carlin. Possibly you got a new burner since 08?

Please post new pics.


 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:16 AM
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Presumably the pump has been there since at least '08....has there been any problems with cold baseboards since then? Or is this the first heating season that you are having issues?

If the water fill valve is still shut, and if you've been bleeding water out of the baseboards and the gauge pressure hasn't gone down any, then the gauge is probably faulty.

Is this a one-pipe "diverter tee" system?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:35 AM
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I took the pictures last nigth (i am using an old camera with a wrong date stamp). The valve was always open until last week when the guy i contracted to clean the boiler told me that the valve should remain closed.

the pump is 1/4 HP, 0.70 Amp, 115V.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:38 AM
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The baseboards used to work fine until lat week. The problem started after i changed the expansion tank
 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:47 AM
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The water doesn't return in the same pipe.The pipe coming out of the boiler has a Y. The left side of the Y goes to the left side of the house (5 radiators) and the right side of the Y goes to the right of the house (5 radiators). The 2 pipes meet in the middle and come back to the boiler. The house is one story.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:53 AM
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Sounds like an air pocket somewhere since you just changed the expansion tank and introduced a bunch of air into the system, right? I assume you drained the boiler when you did this?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 04:55 AM
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i bleed the system like crazy, still can't get rid of the air. My question is: do i need to bleed with the water fill valve open?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:10 AM
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you have to introduce new water into the system to bleed it...should read at least 12psi if the gauge is working and the boiler is cold...does the gauge move when you introduce water or try to bleed it? do you have an auto fill valve?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:16 AM
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Yes you need to open fill valve and increase pressure to 20-25 or so while doing it. More pressure will push the air out better.

But you also need to do one side at a time. Are there valves after where the Y splits?

Dont let the PSI get above 30. The relief valve will blow. Then when done bleeding drain enough water so the psi stays at 12-15 psi cold boiler.

Also take a pic of the air elimination device for the boiler. And the expansion tank area. Take more overall pics of the boiler. Take pics of where you are bleeding the system from.

It will help us help you.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:21 AM
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yes the gauge moves when i introduce new water. The gauge reads about 12 psi when the boiler is off. i am going to take more pictures ...thanks
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:24 AM
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will take more pic. Could it be a flow problem not an air? because when i bleed water does come out, but it's cold water.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:29 AM
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We can answer your questions when you show us pics. You will get water out when bleeding and not necessarily push the air out.

Like I said we need to see where and how you are bleeding from. And pics of the air elimination device at the boiler.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:43 AM
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each baseboard has a bleeder and this where i am bleeding (see pic)




 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:46 AM
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I look at the pipe and there is a venturi for each baseboard. The water flows from left to right (see pic)


 
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Old 11-17-12, 05:58 AM
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You need to bleed from the boiler. There should be a purge station. But unless you take many pics of the boiler I cant help you find it.

Post 18 pic #2. Is the cap on that air vent on top of that green item loose? It should be loose and not on tight. If water comes out when you loosen it will need to be replaced before you go any further....
 
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Old 11-17-12, 06:57 AM
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The cap is loose now and no water is coming out. I still can't locate the purge station....





 
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Old 11-17-12, 07:09 AM
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Try to locate any boiler drains in the piping. Anywhere!!!

I see the one for the tankless coil near the mixing valve, but that will not help.

Also I see another air vent on-top of the boiler. Loosen that also. If water comes out close it. Let me know.....
 
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Old 11-17-12, 07:24 AM
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there is a drain at the back of the boiler at the very bottom....i loosen the the vent on top and no water came out, but there is a lot rust ( i guess it used to leak at some point)
 
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Old 11-17-12, 07:38 AM
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Boiler drain at bottom of boiler will not help. look around some more.

If no drain anywhere else I might suggest turning the boiler power off and increasing the boiler pressure close to the 30 psi mark. You do not want to trip the relief valve.

Then go one rad and bleed. Bleed it enough not just a small cup. Open the bleeder as open as you can.

Then go raise the pressure in the boiler back up and continue to the next rad. This may be a long process, but thats all you got right now.

The best method IMO is to shut the burner down so it does not fire but allow the circ to run. The circ will help move the water and air out while performing the steps outlined above.

When all is complete the air vents should take over once you get the water moving.

Make sure you lower the psi back to 15 psi when your done......

Note: You should probably change both those air vents.....
 
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Old 11-17-12, 07:47 AM
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can i remove the 2 wires that power the boiler and live the circ pump connected while i am bleeding the rads?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 07:58 AM
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The first thing you need to do is VERIFY THE PRESSURE GAUGE! You are wasting your time if you don't KNOW FOR SURE what the pressure in the boiler is.

This is a MONOFLO system, and monoflo systems are notoriously difficult to bleed properly.

NO, it is highly doubtful that the pump is too small, although it may be 'marginal' for a monoflo system the fact that it has worked for years and years tells us that it's not the root cause of the problem.

[I see that mike has already gone over this, so I'll just drive the point home...]

After you verify the pressure gauge, raise the pressure in the system as high as possible without the relief valve opening and WITH THE PUMP RUNNING open the bleeders on the rads.

YES, leave the water feed valve OPEN when you are bleeding, and you also need to monitor so that as you are bleeding the pressure does not drop too low.

Since you have monoflo, finding and using a purge station may, or may not, help. Even with a purge station it is 'possible' that even a power purge won't help. It probably WOULD, but adding any more fresh water to the system at this point will be counter-productive.

An air blockage in a system is as effective as a CORK (or a potato chip bag... it has happened!)
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:00 AM
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can i remove the 2 wires that power the boiler and live the circ pump connected while i am bleeding the rads?
Yes, possibly.

Is there a 'jumper' wire across the T T terminals on your Carlin primary control? If so, you can simply remove that jumper wire. That's easier than removing the AC supply to the burner.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:02 AM
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'ang on a sec...

I just looked back at your pics...

You seem to have a Carlin IGNITOR and may or may not have a Carlin primary control.

The primary control is the device that's on the box directly above the burner motor.

Can't see in the pics...

But look for a T T jumper on that control box.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:08 AM
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Thanks Troop!!! !
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:24 AM
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i disconnected the boiler and i started the bleeding but now i am stuck on 1 rad. no air or water want to come out....seems the circ pump won't stay on although the thermostat says the pump is on
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:28 AM
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after i bleed each rad, i make sure i raise the pressure back to about 30psi....should i tight the bleeder on the baseboard after bleeding or should i keep them loose?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:30 AM
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Before you go ANY further, you need to verify your pressure gauge.

You should get SOMETHING out even if the pump is not running.

Either the bleeder is clogged up, or you don't have enough pressure in your system because your gauge is lying to you.

A bad gauge will cause hours and hours of head scratching. Trust me... that's where all my hair went.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:32 AM
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Tighten the bleeder when done with each rad.

To get the pump to come on you will need to go in the aquastat and adjust the lo. Remember where its set so you can return it to the same temp.

Turn the lo until the pump comes on.

Edit : Sorry Troop. If you will be on I will let you take over on this post.


But yes if you get water out of some and not others I would say clogged and need to replace them.

http://i357.photobucket.com/albums/o.../boiler023.jpg
 
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Old 11-17-12, 08:43 AM
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No problem Mike, you were doing a fine job till I butted in ! I'm going to be doing some chores around the Ponderosa so will be in and out during the day to check on things...

Carry on!
 
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Old 11-17-12, 09:17 AM
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i have steady water coming out of all the radiators. What's next?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 09:51 AM
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You raised pressure during bleed at every rad?

Was circ running or not when you did this?

Is the pressure stable at 15 psi?

I would say adjust the aquastat back to where is was and fire it up. ( What are your settings in the aquastat?)

I would say fire it up and give it a try.


Let us know. If it does start circulating let us know if you here air hisses out of those two air vents also.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 09:55 AM
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i have steady water coming out of all the radiators. What's next?
You need to pay attention to what these guys are telling you. You have not verified your gauge to be reading accurately. Stop asking for more advice as to what to do until that is completed. Any more information given without that being resolved will be useless.

A bad gauge will cause hours and hours of head scratching. Trust me... that's where all my hair went.
^^^^Pay attention to those words of wisdom.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 09:58 AM
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Yes as droo said but let us know when you raised the pressure did the gauge successfully go up? And then go down as you bleed the individual rads?
 
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Old 11-17-12, 10:01 AM
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i raised the pressure to 30 for every baseboard/bleed. I bleeded each rad twice going on a circle with the circ running. Now the pressure is at about 25psi. Should i manually open the safety relief valve to get the pressure back o 15 before i fired up?

I adjusted the aquastat back to 170 where i found it.
 
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Old 11-17-12, 10:04 AM
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yes i set the pressure to 30 before each bleed and it goes down to about 25 after each one
 
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