Hydronic Boiler Temp

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  #41  
Old 01-07-14, 04:51 PM
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Yup....................... exactly what we're thinking now... let's hope it's something that simple!
 
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  #42  
Old 01-07-14, 04:52 PM
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Oops, replied and saw someone else was thinking the same.
 
  #43  
Old 01-07-14, 04:53 PM
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No prob Thomas! The more eyes the better!
 
  #44  
Old 01-07-14, 05:04 PM
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This would explain why he needed to turn down the boiler temp and also why it would get cold in the house (since he turned the temp down, it could not maintain a warm house on colder days)
 
  #45  
Old 01-07-14, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by runner
I have a stupid question......

Is the little lever on the left zone valve hooked into the manual position???? It looks like its angled off to the left and the one in the middle is towards the right....

Patrick
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These are the two valves currently in use.

The valve with the A/M and M selected, is used for the zone I am having 99% of the issue with.

Should this be set to A instead of M?

The other valve, is my slightly unused zone. It does not have an A/M just an open indicator? Should this be set where it is? Or in open?

The capped off valve is in A. Should this be changed?

As for the air vent, it is installed, it was just covered in junk that was still in place from the electricians that installed it.

I am very, very hopeful!

- As for the wiring, it does look to be wired correctly.
 
  #46  
Old 01-07-14, 05:14 PM
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I'm guessing that the 'A' is for automatic and 'M' for manual. You would want to be in automatic mode so it runs off of the thermostat.

Right Trooper?

Patrick
 
  #47  
Old 01-07-14, 05:15 PM
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Should this be set to A instead of M?
YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The capped off valve is in A. Should this be changed?
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it was just covered in junk
Is the cap on top loose?
 
  #48  
Old 01-07-14, 05:19 PM
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Hey NJ.

I swapped it to A.

The other one, that only has an open indicator, should it be set to open or left as is? (This is actually the main zone, I had it backwards in the previous post).

Cap is on tight.
 
  #49  
Old 01-07-14, 05:29 PM
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Suggest turning both zone thermostats all the way down. Make sure both zone valves are closed. See if the pipe on the other side of the zone valves start to cool (over some time).
As someone else suggested, get a helper to do this while watching/listening for zone valve opening closing.
 
  #50  
Old 01-07-14, 05:31 PM
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should it be set to open or left as is?

Leave it like it is.................
 
  #51  
Old 01-07-14, 05:32 PM
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Hey Thomas,

This is the plan as soon as my wife gets home (she is on a 12 hour shift at the moment), and will be awhile.
 
  #52  
Old 01-07-14, 05:34 PM
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Push the lever on the zone with the open only lever.. Is there resistance and the lever hard to push?
 
  #53  
Old 01-07-14, 05:37 PM
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Lawrosa, no resistance at all. It won't even stay down into the open position.

Does that mean it needs to be replaced?
 
  #54  
Old 01-07-14, 05:38 PM
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One way to tell by yourself would be to turn them all down and see if some of the lights that were on before have gone out. If I'm reading the manual correctly, there should be one light that stays on indicating power.

Then go and turn the thermostat back up. More lights should come on.

Patrick
 
  #55  
Old 01-07-14, 05:39 PM
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This is with the t stat off for that zone right? The lever justs moves back and forth freely?
 
  #56  
Old 01-07-14, 05:40 PM
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That is correct lawrosa.

kayaking, right now, thermostats are down. Both lights stay on. If I max both tstats out, the two lights stay on. Nothing changes.
 
  #57  
Old 01-07-14, 05:43 PM
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Both zone valves are stuck open.. Seems like a wiring issue...

I have to check the manual... to see what can be amiss..

Can you trace something or take pics of the t stat wiring and tell us where its all wired too?
 
  #58  
Old 01-07-14, 05:46 PM
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I failed temp sensor in the boiler possibly its going into freeze protection.. Opens the zones and runs the circ... Umm but I need to read if your boiler even has that... Just throwing stuff out there...
 
  #59  
Old 01-07-14, 05:51 PM
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Hey Mike,

Worth noting, since I have switched the bottom zone to auto, one light has now went out on the boiler, and the elements have went cold!!!

Step in the right direction. Now to deal with the big problem. The top zone.
 
  #60  
Old 01-07-14, 05:52 PM
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Posted while other posts were flying... don't do the below just yet, I'm going to let the dust settle a bit... too many chefs in the kitchen.


First, look carefully at the T T terminals and make sure there are no wire 'whiskers' across the terminals.

If not,

Disconnect one of the T T wires at the boiler and move away from the terminal so it can't touch.

Might be wise to shut the breaker off at the panel before you do this.

After wire is disconnected, turn back on boiler.

Both lights out?
 
  #61  
Old 01-07-14, 05:54 PM
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Maybe you did not notice that it actually WAS calling for heat?

If its cooling down now, this might be working properly. When the light is off, does the lever for the zone valve with the "open" position move freely, or does it have resistance to it?

Patrick
 
  #62  
Old 01-07-14, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Kayaking
Maybe you did not notice that it actually WAS calling for heat?
I'm honestly not sure what you mean? Both tstats are turned down all the way currently.

For the valve with the open indicator (I'll call Zone 1 from here on); there is still no resistance, nor does it stay into the open position. That said, it is not for the same zone that is cooling.
 
  #63  
Old 01-07-14, 06:00 PM
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Ill step back troop... I be monitoring... Ill be on for a while.. .. Ill take over if you go nite nite....
 
  #64  
Old 01-07-14, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by NJ
Posted while other posts were flying... don't do the below just yet, I'm going to let the dust settle a bit... too many chefs in the kitchen.
Dude, you have no idea. I've done my stairs WAYYYY too many times today lol. I'm having trouble keeping up with the rate the replies are coming in. Don't get me wrong, its a good problem to have, and shows me I need to get back to the gym! lol
 
  #65  
Old 01-07-14, 06:07 PM
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A general knowledge question for me, if everything was working properly, do I want the Zone 1 valve to be in the open position?
 
  #66  
Old 01-07-14, 06:08 PM
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I've got to step out for a while anyhow...

Be back in around 11 for a short time to see where we're at...
 
  #67  
Old 01-07-14, 06:25 PM
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If both of your tstats have been turned down for a while...go back down those stairs and look at your temp gauge. Has the temp gone down?

Go to the tstat in the normal temp room and turn it up. Go to your boiler and feel the pipes after both zone valves. If both rooms start to heat up, something is wrong with the zone valve for your hot room (either bad or mis wired).
Please let us know.
 
  #68  
Old 01-07-14, 06:34 PM
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Temp on boiler has went down a tiny bit.

With zone 2, after switching to auto the pipes feeding that zone have cooled and are now warming correctly, with the tstat.

Zone 1, the hot room is still hot on the pipes. The tstat has been off for hours now.

Should that zone valve be open or closed?
 
  #69  
Old 01-07-14, 06:49 PM
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I believe it should be / stay in the unmarked or closed position. Moving the lever to the open position would be like opening a water faucet and letting the water pass thru. It's like the auto /manual on the other zone valve. It may be that that zone valve is bad. When your wife gets home, you will need to see if that zone valve makes any noise when the tstat is turned up or down.

I am surprised the temp did not drop further on the gauge since the tstats have been turned down for a while..and the system should not be heating water....how much is a tiny bit?

I will need to review the manual to see what controls the low limit water temp (if there is a low limit control).
 
  #70  
Old 01-07-14, 07:03 PM
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I did a quick review of the manual. It does look as if the boiler tries to maintain a fixed water temp at all times. So with both tstats turned down, both rooms should begin to cool while the boiler temp remains constant.

So if zone 1 is still hot, the zone valve is stuck open (or mis wired) and water may be flowing on its own even without the circulator running.

Perform the valve test when your wife gets home.

This chef is going to bed so I will be out of the kitchen the rest of the night!
 
  #71  
Old 01-07-14, 07:06 PM
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Also not sure if you can use that spare zone valve if your zone 1 valve is actually bad. One of the experts might be able to advise if you are able to re-wire. Not sure of your skill set.
 
  #72  
Old 01-07-14, 07:08 PM
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It dropped by 5f at most. It was not much.

Keep in mind, zone 2 has only 12 feet of element at most. The rest of the house has around 75 feet of element.

Will do. Thanks Thomas.
 
  #73  
Old 01-07-14, 07:19 PM
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Should that zone valve be open or closed?

That lever stays in the closed position... When there is a call for heat the zone will open... BUT!!! the lever will not move..

The only way to tell if the zone is open is to move that lever back and forth... If it moves back and forth freely its open.. If its closed that lever will take some effort as its spring loaded..

It would seem the valve is stuck open and the boiler is continually calling for heat...

We fixed one issue with the other t stat set for M... Its on A now and working per the t stat... Good

Now we want to try to get that other zone valve to close..


Kill power to to the boiler. is there an emergency switch??? Turn it off..... Now try the zone valve lever...

Whats it do?

Let us know...
 
  #74  
Old 01-07-14, 07:39 PM
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If my eyes are not deceiving me, there is a low voltage transformer on the celling.

If that is the case there MIGHT be TWO places where power needs to be turned off to get the entire system powered off. Hard to know for sure though without being there.

Patrick
 
  #75  
Old 01-08-14, 12:20 PM
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Hokay,

So we tested it. With Tstat off, and turning it up- I can feel the gears turning. When turning it down, I don't hear anything. It seems relatively obvious at this point that the zone control valve is shot.

The lever, no matter the power state, is always loose.
 
  #76  
Old 01-08-14, 12:53 PM
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Ya know... I would pop the cover off and just for the heck of it give it a shot of WD40 ... ya never know!

But yeah, in the end you'll probably end up replacing that one... which one is it? One of the Erie's? or the other?
 
  #77  
Old 01-08-14, 02:37 PM
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All three are Eries, just one is a slightly different model Erie. This is the one which is slightly different.

Gave it a blast of WD-40. No change.

Do I need a plumber to replace? Or could I tackle that as well?
 
  #78  
Old 01-08-14, 03:38 PM
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Need the model # off it.....Its possible the head just comes off... Give us the # off the other unused one too... You may be able to swap them...
 
  #79  
Old 01-08-14, 03:56 PM
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Hey Mike,

Model number is: 465B307-GA1
Unused model number: 648B307-18A1.
 
  #80  
Old 01-08-14, 04:57 PM
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It appears that this: 465B307-GA1

Has been replaced with this: AG23A02A

and is still available.

AG23A02A : ERIE ZONE VALVE HEAD, NORMALLY OPEN, WITH ENDSWITCH, 24V, 2WAY | Amre Supply

Quite a bit cheaper down here... but maybe you have to pay duty?

AG23A02A - Erie AG23A02A - 24V Normally Open PopTop Actuator w/ 18" Leads & End Switch

Good info in this PDF file:

http://s3.pexsupply.com/product_file...2A-Install.pdf

These numbers are for the actuator head only.

The other number brings up nothing of value via Google.
 
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