ES2 boiler run time indicator

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Old 01-17-14, 12:09 PM
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ES2 boiler run time indicator

Does anyone know what the run time indicator (hours) on the ES2 boiler control tracks? I don't see anything in the manual to explain it.

I was under the impression that it indicated the amount of time that the gas is on.

I am doing some input-output-heat loss comparisons and getting some strange results (like getting way more output than either the run time x input rating or the amount of therms consumed in a day). This is leading me to believe that the run time indicator is tracking the amount of time that heat is being called for whether the gas is firing or not. I think it is continuing to add time while TT is showing ON when the burner has cycled off due to HL.

I can only see this result from daily readings because the timer is in hours and I can't sit there all day watching for it to change.

Your help is appreciated. Thanks.
 
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Old 01-18-14, 07:33 AM
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Thinking more about this I have to revise my opinion about the boiler possibly tracking TT ON time with burner off.

I am seeing 3 to 10 hours of run time per day depending on outside temperature. I have the (air temperature) thermostat for bathroom radiant floor set to run 9 PM to 11 AM. The zone circulator runs continuously and the relay panel calls for heat that entire time. It is a very small load and the boiler operates on the HL and DF (or possibly the ODR) settings to satisfy it.

If the boiler control was measuring TT ON time it should be showing higher run times like 10+ hours per day every day not just on the cold days.

The possibility that the ODR is limiting that call for heat (and reducing the run time) is small since overnight temperatures have been low.

I am still interested to know what the run time indicator measures, but I will be starting another thread about the input-output-heat loss comparisons since the results are very strange.
 
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Old 01-18-14, 07:47 AM
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but I will be starting another thread about the input-output-heat loss comparisons since the results are very strange.

Its beneficial to keep posting to this thread then start another...

I will look into the timer.. Give me a moment...
 
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Old 01-18-14, 07:58 AM
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And what shows on the display for this time tracker????
Here are all the codes.. Could it be boost time your seeing?

http://cdn.usboiler.net/products/boi...tion-sheet.pdf
 
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Old 01-18-14, 08:10 AM
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TT time is the amount of time the t stat is engaged from what I read...
 
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Old 01-18-14, 11:55 AM
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Where did you read that run time is the amount of time the t stat is engaged?

I do not have the IQ ODR. Mine is a separate Dayton model from years ago with the boiler temp sensor mounted in my supply manifold. See Picture #7 in http://www.doityourself.com/forum/bo...s2-boiler.html.

This is the one (rUn Run Time Hours) that I am looking at (from page 13 of the ES2 manual.) I am trying to use run time to calculate cycle times as well as input for comparison with gas meter readings and output for comparison with calculated heat loss.
 
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Old 01-18-14, 01:11 PM
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TT is thermostat. That is the device that requests heat...

Your #'s you are getting are most likely the time the T stat contacts are closed...

You can perform a test to find out I am sure...
 
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Old 01-18-14, 01:19 PM
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Checking run time vs. firing time

I just connected an hour meter onto the system circulator wire in the boiler JB and made a note of the run time indicated by the boiler control. Tomorrow I will compare the two. If the amount of time on the hour meter and the run time delta agree then I will know that the run time is not an accurate indicator of firing time.

Since that is likely to be the case, any ideas about how I can measure the firing time independently?
 
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Old 01-18-14, 01:32 PM
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Get a little 10" gas meter for $90 bucks....

3/4" pulse output gas meter pgm-1 read gas remotely
 
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Old 01-18-14, 01:43 PM
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NJ Trooper had some sort of strange difference between the IQ control Run time and the hour meter he installed on his system. Can't recall the details but it would be in his thread about th einstallation of his MPO.
 
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Old 01-19-14, 10:24 AM
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Today's observations

drooplug: I found NJ Trooper's MPO thread and the run time info he posted. It looked like the difference between his hour meter and the run time indicator remained almost constant.

NJT: was there any resolution or other conclusions you have reached with additional operating time?

lawrosa: I am currently reading the gas meter to obtain usage info. The meter is only a few steps away from the boiler in the basement so I don't really need a remote reading meter, but thanks for the info.

I was away last night and set the main house t'stat for 65. I took my readings when I returned this morning. The boiler run time indicator showed 3 hours added and my hour meter also had 3 hours logged. This seems strange to me because the thermostat for the bathroom radiant should have logged at least 10 hours of call for heat overnight. I did confirm this morning that the ODR is blocking the TT signal as it should based on outdoor temp but it went down to 29 degrees overnight and I doubt that the temp up there (3rd floor with a door at the stairs) got high enough to satisfy that t'stat at night. I'll be here tonight to look at it.

I am trying to come up with a way to measure actual firing time. I am thinking of using a cad cell (like the ones used in gas dryers to confirm flame) that could be connected to a run-time meter to accomplish that. I haven't done any research yet, but it would be really "hot" (pun intended) to find one that produces 12 or 24 volts and can be paired directly with a compatible hour meter. If not then I'm sure I can come up with a battery powered or 120v solution.
 
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Old 01-19-14, 11:02 AM
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Duh! No meter required!

I have been messing around with the information I am keeping in a spreadsheet relative to my boiler operation. I think I have found a simple way to determine boiler firing time.

The boiler is non-modulating so the input is constant. Since I know the constant input rate (140000BTUH) and I am reading the gas meter* I can determine the firing time by the following formula:

Therms x 100000/140000 = hours firing time

Using that result, I can determine total daily BTUH input and output for comparison with calculated heat losses. (Preliminary observation is that my heat loss calculations are higher than actual.)

* Usage before conversion to gas heat was less than 1 therm per day for DHW, cooking, clothes dryer, gas fireplace so I am ignoring those for now and using the assumption that total gas usage is for heating.
 
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Old 01-19-14, 01:31 PM
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Yeah. You just look at how much gas is consumed over a measured time period. You can determine your actual heat loss of the house this way as well by multiplying the usage by your burner efficeincy: 85%.
 
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Old 01-20-14, 11:15 AM
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Today's readings

Time since last reading: 22 hours
Boiler run time: 6 hours (from IQ control)
Calculated firing time: 5.9 hours (8 Therms/140000BTUH)
Elapsed time meter: 15 hours (system circulator run time = TT on)

Conclusion: IQ Run time indicator is tracking firing time in hours but calculated firing time is a more accurate number to use in output vs. heat loss calculations comparison.

Consider this--boiler starts firing when the run time counter is at 1:59 and the readout is showing "1 hour." The boiler fires for 63 minutes. After two minutes the readout will show "2 hours" and then will show "3 hours" sixty minutes later. The boiler will have fired for 63 minutes but based on the readout the indication will be that it fired for 3 - 1=2 hours.

That's confusing!
 
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