Need (Boiler Replacement) Advice

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  #1  
Old 09-26-14, 09:13 AM
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Need (Boiler Replacement) Advice

Hello All, I currently have an electric boiler, yes you read that right, feeding copper fin throughout my home. Home is about 1600 sq ft, lots of loss due to old windows that will eventually be replaced, talking 3 years down the road. So you can imagine, electric bills are very high.

I am converting to gas and am getting all sorts of conflicting advice from contractors.

Two contractors rated the house at ~83k. The other contractor did not perform a rating.


Contractor #1: Go with high efficiency Elite FT80 (79MBH), Triangle Tube 40gal Indirect water heater w/ outdoor reset control. $$$$$

Contractor #2: He states to not go with high efficiency or indirect water or outdoor reset control, not worth it. He suggests Crown Aruba 4 AWR140 cast iron boiler (102MBH) with a separate conventional 50gal gas water heater. $$$

Contractor #3: This one also states to not go with high efficiency or indirect water or outdoor reset control, not worth it. He quotes a Weil McLain CGI-5 (87MBH) cast iron with a separate conventional 50gal gas water heater. $$


What are your thoughts as I am leaning with going with contractor one, but having him go with a cast iron boiler, stick with the indirect heater and outdoor reset...

Need advice please

-John
 
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  #2  
Old 09-26-14, 09:49 AM
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It's been my experience that the indirect water tank is cheaper to own than conventional.

I'm not sure why there is such a huge difference in price between contractors 1 & 3, the two boilers are only about $500 apart in price.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 10:39 AM
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The experts will chime in shortly.

My opinion, go with the Elite FT80. Right now it is sized just about right for your home BUT the big difference is that when you do put in the new windows, etc., it will modulate DOWN to only the required output. As is, you don't need 87mbh MOST of the heating system. Yes the initial cost is higher but the payback should be greater.

The indirect has an advantage in that it can make MUCH more hot water than a conventional water heater. I have the Contender MC80 and can make 125 gallons of hot water/hour. The indirect is usually more efficient. You have a big chimney in that conventional water heater tank just losing heat, not so on the indirect. You may not need as big an indirect tank either.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 10:39 AM
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Hey Slade, yea it is kinda shady huh?

I forgot to mention earlier, we are a family of 6 now and live in Chicago. Would the indirect water heater be able to keep up with our family's demands? The contractors that didn't want to install them stated that they wouldn't work for my application either because the water in our area gets too cold during winter or it just plain wouldn't keep up with all 6 of us...
 
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Old 09-26-14, 11:15 AM
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I have a 45 gallon tank and a high flow shower head, and I get about 30 mins of hot water before it starts cooling and you have to peg the faucet all the way to hot to keep getting warm water. On my other shower with the standard shower head, I can get about 50 mins. The water tank temp is 140.

I don't see how the incoming water temp plays into anything, once the water has been in the tank for awhile you'll still have hot water. I mean how cold can it actually be anyways?
 
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Old 09-26-14, 11:37 AM
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30 mins is not going to cut it with 4 girls in the house...is that typical of an indirect tank?
 
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Old 09-26-14, 11:38 AM
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Probably not, like I said I'm pretty sure my shower head is just dumping water on me.

Someone else will chime in I'm sure.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 11:54 AM
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The indirect is the way to go. It can make much more hot water as it is a higher output than a stand alone tank.

I've never run out of hot water with 3 teens. As
 
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Old 09-26-14, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by jshamoon
". . . the water in our area gets too cold during winter . . ."
But it doesn't get below +32F . . . . right ?
 
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Old 09-26-14, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Vermont View Post
But it doesn't get below +32F . . . . right ?
That is correct my friend.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 03:38 PM
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You can put a mixing valve OK the indirect and crank up the water temp in the tank. You'll almost never run out. In directs are more efficient than a stand alone water heater. The other option could be an on demand water heater. I haven't used them so I don't know a lot about them.
As far as the boiler goes, I'm a big fan of buderus wall hung boilers. They use the outdoor reset. Great solid boiler. As long as you don't raise and lower your temp on the tstat the outdoor reset will work great. Set it and forger it. Don't go with a conventional boiler. You will regret it in the long run.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 04:02 PM
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Don't go with a conventional boiler. You will regret it in the long run.
My "conventional" gas-fired, hot-water boiler is 60+ years old, and still going strong. If some of the current advice posted here had been followed, we'd probably be on our third or fourth boiler? And, each would have been more temperamental, even if a tad bit more efficient. At today's gas prices, insignificant.
 
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Old 09-26-14, 04:48 PM
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I am on the fence between conventional and condensing , I did install 3 Viesman Viodents 100 and because I have an over radiant houses they do condense about 1 liter of water per cubic meter of natural gas burned . But a lot of systems were put in to operate on 180 f water and therefore they don't want to condense much and a conventional boiler is probably the best fit .
 
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Old 09-26-14, 05:10 PM
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Are we able to post prices on here?
 
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Old 09-28-14, 08:02 AM
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Ok, I think I have made up my mind for the most part. I am going to go with contractor #1, but go with a cast iron boiler instead of the mod con. I like the fact that he did a rating, offers the outdoor reset and wants to do the indirect water heater.

He wants to use a New Yorker CG40DNI which puts out 70k BTU and pair it with a Triangle Tube Smart 40. First off, between New Yorker and Crown, which would you recommend? Secondly, do you think this is somewhat undersized?
 
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Old 09-28-14, 08:52 AM
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You can definitely talk cost. No way to make educated decisions without it.
 
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