No hot water

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  #1  
Old 03-09-15, 05:35 AM
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No hot water

I have an oil burning furnace that heats the house and hot water. I have 60 gallon hot water tank located right next to the furnace. Both furnace and tank are located in the middle of the basement away from any walls. Few days back I started getting barely warm water and now I have no hot water at all. There is a thermostat attached to the water tank that was set to 120. I moved the dial to 140 but no change. There are three zone valves. One for 1st floor heat, one for 2nd floor heat and one for the hot water. The insulated pipe that comes from the zone valve to the water tank is hot near the valve but barely warm near the tank.

My guess is either the zone valve or the thermostat in the hot water tank is not working.

Any help on how to properly diagnose/fix this issue is appreciated.
 
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Old 03-09-15, 07:50 AM
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My guess is either the zone valve or the thermostat in the hot water tank is not working.
Sounds like a good guess.

Do you own and know how to use a multimeter?

What's the make/model of the indirect water heater and the zone valve?

Might as well tell us the make/model of the BOILER as well.
 
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Old 03-09-15, 08:52 AM
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What type of zone valves?
Geo
 
  #4  
Old 03-09-15, 05:20 PM
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Hi, sorry for the delayed response...I was at work.

Here are some answers to the questions:

-zone valve brand is Taco. Not sure what the model is. I pulled the lever up on the valve but nothing happened.
-the hot water tank is superstor ultra.
-the boiler brand is carier
-I do not own a multimeter but I can get one.

I will try to upload some pictures soon.
 
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Old 03-09-15, 05:24 PM
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Here are some pictures...
 
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Old 03-09-15, 05:36 PM
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Here are some more pictures...
 
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Old 03-09-15, 05:38 PM
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D,
Push the lever down. If it's not calling there will be resistance. If there is no resistance when pushing down, the zone valve is responding to a call for hot water and the pump and then the boiler should start.
When they are working normally although the plunger inside the ZV goes down but the lever, although resistance free will stay in the upright position.
When the tstat on the tank calls it sends power to terminals #1&#2 on ZV which makes #2&#3 onZV which starts the boiler.
Your tstat on tank is 24v. Take cover off and jump the 2 screws together, no danger, if everything starts it's your tstat.
Jumpers or needle nose pliers will do to jump. It will take about 30 seconds or so for the ZV to open so be patient.
 
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Old 03-10-15, 02:45 AM
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Hi Spott, the lever on the zone valve was down all along. Before taking the pictures I pulled it up to see if it started the boiler but nothing happened. I pushed it down later on.

Now I am not quite clear on what you mean by "Jump the two screws" and how to do it. Can you elaborate a little more please?

Also I don't if it means anything but the head of the zone valve is really warm, much warmer that the other two working valves. And the lever is really hot.

Thanks
D.
 

Last edited by duha71; 03-10-15 at 04:03 AM.
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Old 03-10-15, 06:25 AM
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Now I am not quite clear on what you mean by "Jump the two screws" and how to do it. Can you elaborate a little more please?
If not clear, of course DO NOT DO IT! It is being assumed that you have previous knowledge of troubleshooting this type of setup. My suggestion is to forget for the moment that Spott suggested that, because.........................

I don't if it means anything but the head of the zone valve is really warm, much warmer that the other two working valves. And the lever is really hot.
Yes, this DOES mean something, most likely that the thermostat in the water heater is in fact calling for heat, and that the zone valve is being powered and is probably open. ESPECIALLY if the lever moves freely without any resistance.

I believe that the trouble is that the ENDSWITCH in the zone valve is not making contact and not calling the boiler to fire up.

Now is the time that I would suggest testing with a multimeter.

But, if you feel comfortable using Spotts suggestion to "jump screws" you can apply a short piece of wire between terminals 2 and 3 on the ZONE VALVE. This is LOW VOLTAGE, and there is no danger in doing this, as long as you ONLY touch terminals 2 and 3. Do NOT accidentally slip and touch terminal 1.

If when you connect terminals 2 and 3 the boiler fires up then the solution will be to replace that power head on that valve.
 
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Old 03-10-15, 12:45 PM
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OK, I will try connecting the terminals when I get home. Now looking at the picture of the zone valve, which end is 1 and which end is 3?
 
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Old 03-10-15, 01:23 PM
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In the pic, the left end is 1 and the numbers are stamped next to the terminals.
 
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Old 03-11-15, 04:00 AM
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I shorted terminals 2 and 3 and the boiler started withing 3 seconds. So the question now is can I leave it shorted until the zone valve power head is replaced?
 
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Old 03-11-15, 05:28 AM
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I wouldn't. It would be like your tank is constantly calling. Scalding water.
You can switch it with a good one from another zone so you'll have control of your hot water and then put that on the heating zone with the lever down and when one tstat calls it will heat both zones and there's no danger.
You don't even have to wire it up. Put the head on and push the handle down.
 
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Old 03-11-15, 02:53 PM
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Yeah, ditto that... you'll have 180F water coming from your taps... unless you have a tempering valve in line... and a terrible waste of fuel.

Swap the heads in the meantime as Spott suggests, but plan on replacing the bad one:

555-050RP - Taco 555-050RP - Zone Valve Power Head (Series 570)
 
  #15  
Old 03-12-15, 02:38 AM
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Thanks to everyone for all your help. I will post an update once I replace the power head.
Feel free to share any "trick of the trade" or pitfalls I should be aware of.
 
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Old 03-12-15, 03:10 PM
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It's a pretty easy one for one swap.

TURN OFF POWER to the boiler first!

You should carefully LABEL ANY WIRES as you remove them from the valves.

DO NOT trust your memory, especially since you have multiple whites and reds at the valves!
 
  #17  
Old 03-14-15, 08:26 AM
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OK, so while the power head is on its way, I thought I would get some hot water by shorting the terminals for a while. The boiler started for about 5 min. Temperature gauge read 240 when the boiler stopped. But after couple of hours there is still no hot water. What's going on?
 
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Old 03-14-15, 09:27 AM
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You need to get that multimeter and do some testing...

You boiler should most definitely NOT be getting to 240! That is CRAZY HOT! and indicates that there is some other problem.

I'm going to review your thread...
 
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Old 03-14-15, 09:31 AM
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See that gray box on the boiler above the oil burner?



You need to turn off power to the boiler and slide that cover off and tell us the settings of the dials inside.
 
  #20  
Old 03-15-15, 04:52 AM
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The temperature setting inside the box is 240. Also I will get a multimeter today. Keep in mind that I've never used one before when you give me instructions.

Thanks,
D.
 
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Old 03-15-15, 09:26 AM
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The temperature setting inside the box is 240.
OMG!... go down there immediately and turn that down to 180F !

Let me know when you get the meter... it's pretty easy...
 
  #22  
Old 03-15-15, 04:25 PM
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I got the multimeter and also set the temp to 180.
 
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Old 03-15-15, 04:31 PM
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OK... what's the model of the multimeter, would be easier to tell you how to use it...

The meter should have a knob position for AC VOLTS. Might be a squiggly line, what they call that, a 'tilde'?

Set the meter to that position.

With the water heater NOT calling for heat, you should read ZERO volts between 1 & 2 on the zone valve.

When the heater IS calling for heat, you should read approximately 24VAC on terminals 1 & 2.

When the heater is NOT calling for heat, and NO OTHER ZONES are calling for heat, you should read approximately 24VAC between terminals 2 & 3.

When the heater OR ANY OTHER ZONE is calling for heat, you should read ZERO volts between terminals 2 & 3.

It's best to turn the other thermostats ALL THE WAY DOWN, or OFF, before you start so that they don't interfere with the readings that you get on 2 & 3.
 
  #24  
Old 03-16-15, 03:42 PM
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I turned off the two heating thermostat so they won't be calling for heat. Since I have tank full of cold water it's always calling I guess.

The reading between 1 and 2 was 24 which is expected. But the reading between 2 and 3 was 28 which should've been 0. Does this explain why I did not get hot water when I jumped terminals 2 and 3?
 
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Old 03-16-15, 03:46 PM
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Does this explain why I did not get hot water when I jumped terminals 2 and 3?
No, not completely.

If jumping 2 and 3 did not get you any hot water it probably means that the zone valve, EVEN THOUGH IT'S HOT and HAS POWER, is not opening.

What happens when you MANUALLY OPEN the valve and THEN jump 2 and 3 ?

Will you get hot water then?
 
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Old 03-16-15, 03:46 PM
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There's two 'parts' to a zone valve.

There's the 'motor' that opens the valve, and the 'endswitch' that fires the boiler.

Two ways that these valves can fail are:

1. The 'motor' may not open the valve. There will be no flow and the boiler will not fire because the valve is not opening and activating the endswitch.

2. The valve may be opening but still the 'endswitch' may not make contact.

Your testing indicates that the water heater IS calling for the valve to open (that's the 24V at terminals 1 and 2), but it is either not opening, or the endswitch is bad. (that's the 28V at terminals 2 and 3).

Since jumping 2 and 3 did not get you any hot water, I'm going with #1 because if the valve WAS opening, jumping 2 and 3 would get you hot water.

When do you expect the new valve head to arrive?

I'm 99% certain that's your trouble...
 
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Old 03-16-15, 05:21 PM
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After manually opening the valve and jumping 2 and 3, I got hot water.

And the powerhead should be here tomorrow.
 
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Old 03-17-15, 03:15 PM
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In my haste, I think I ordered the wrong model of the powerhead. It looks like I need 572-2 but the one I got was 572-1. Can you confirm it is indeed 572-2. I don't want to make the same mistake twice.
 
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Old 03-17-15, 03:34 PM
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I think they all take the same head...

Is the head you ordered part number 555-050RP ?

OK, I think I see why yer confused.

What you see on the label there indicates 572 - 1"

It's not the model number, it's the pipe size. The 572 is a 1 INCH valve.

That -2 on your valve is a REVISION number. The new ones are -3 but still take the same replacement head.

I think you're OK.
 
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Old 03-19-15, 02:59 AM
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Yes, that is the model number. The reason I thought I got the wrong model is that, the golden color sphere you see inside the red circle in the picture is sticking out and so the two screws on the sides does not fit into the holes. So I can't twist it in. When I took out the faulty one, that sphere was way inside. Is it supposed to be sticking out like this?Name:  Optimized-IMG_20150318_184658.jpg
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Old 03-19-15, 06:51 AM
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Yes, you need to push down on the head.

From the install instructions:

6. Position new Taco replacement power unit on valve body, push down slightly and
twist counter-clockwise to assemble onto valve body.
 
  #32  
Old 03-23-15, 10:13 AM
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OK, I finally installed the powerhead and it's working fine. Thanks to everyone for all your help. I did have to get different powerhead because the one pictured above did not fit the valve.
 
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Old 03-23-15, 11:35 AM
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What part number did you need?

That other number came from Taco's replacement parts list for your valve...
 
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Old 03-24-15, 05:38 AM
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The one with model number 555-050RP did not fit the valve. I got another one with model number 555-050RD which did fit.

Thanks.
 
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Old 03-24-15, 07:48 AM
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I can find no reference to 555-050RD anywhere.

Where did you obtain that part?
 
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Old 03-24-15, 05:48 PM
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I got it from Lowes. See the attached pic for model number and the old powerhead.
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Old 03-24-15, 06:21 PM
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OK, something very strange going on here...

It appears that Lowes is 'branding' parts from other manufacturers with the name "Durst".

I see that part here:

Shop Heating & Cooling at Lowes.com!

along with products from Jacobus, Maid-o-mist, other Taco parts, Safgard, etc etc...

Here's the complete valve, CLEARLY a Taco valve... why does it say DURST in the title and not TACO?

http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?...llow&cId=PDIO1

If that other head that you had did not fit, it was either the wrong head in the box, or there was something wrong with it.

ALL of Taco's literature says that the 555-050RP is the correct head for your valve.
 
  #38  
Old 03-25-15, 05:30 PM
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My guess is that it was the wrong powerhead in the box. You never know what you get when you shop online.
 
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