Boiler Piping: Leave it or Change It

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Old 09-26-17, 01:14 PM
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Boiler Piping: Leave it or Change It

When I ran the piping for my boiler I miss understood the term "pumping away". I put the expansion tank before the pump but I also thought that part of "pumping away" was to put the pump on the supply side of the boiler so it would pump away from the boiler also. Do I drain the water and change the pump to the return side of the boiler or leave it as is?
I originally had the piping set up as a direct feed system but changed it to a primary/secondary system with the webstone closely spaced tee manifold with the valve between so I would have an option to run it both ways.

Anything else you guys would change while you at it

Boiler is a HTP MC120

Thanks in advanced for any suggestions, tips and/or advice
 
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Old 09-26-17, 03:25 PM
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No, you have it in accordance with modern doctrine. Not to worry. The standard approach has changed over the years, and many millions of successful installations have the pump on the return and the expansion tank on the supply side. Relax.
 
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Old 09-26-17, 08:25 PM
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Looks like you have the exp tank on the primary boiler side .. The exp tank needs to be on the secondary loop with that circ..

You may have a mess on your hands if so..

The documentation here is pretty straight forward and laid out very nice.. Not sure how one could mess it up really, but it happens..

Although its hard to follow the piping with pics I cant zome in on, I believe I followed it correctly..

My eyes are old...

I dont think that air scrubber will do you anygood there...

Let us know...


http://www.htproducts.com/literature/lp-171.pdf
 
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Old 09-27-17, 08:01 AM
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It really make no difference which side of the pump tank is on.

Water is non compressible and expansion due to temperate changes in a hydronic system might cause major problems. Air in expansion tanks is compressible and avoids that problem.

There are a lot comments and posts that which side of pump does matter, but lack facts and are contradicted by the key law on the subject:

Pascal's law (also Pascal's principle[1][2][3] or the principle of transmission of fluid-pressure) is a principle in fluid mechanics that states that a pressure change occurring anywhere in a confined incompressible fluid is transmitted throughout the fluid such that the same change occurs everywhere.[4] The law was established by French mathematician Blaise Pascal[5] in 1647–48.[6]
 
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Old 09-27-17, 08:39 AM
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It really make no difference which side of the pump tank is on.
But I believe he has the exp tank and air scrubber on the boiler side? Secondary and not the primary heat loop...
 
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Old 09-27-17, 03:40 PM
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I have to admit - I don't really know all I'm looking at in that photo. But, my "expertise," such as it is, isn't with wall-hanging, condensing, foreign boilers.

I wonder about the clearance between the boiler and the enclosure? How will one get reasonable access for maintenance? At first, I thought that perhaps the enclosure could be easily removed - but there are things attached to the enclosure. What about the unprotected electrical cables? Is that kosher?
 
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Old 09-27-17, 04:04 PM
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The third pic is the heating loop.. You see the close tees coming from the boiler..

All thats in that 3rd pics is a circ on the loop with the tees.. The exp tank should be on that loop..

The first pic shows the other circ with the exp tank. Those pipes come from the boiler in/out..

Its all wrong.. If anyone tells you its OK they are wrong.. Its not to manufacturers instructions.. All warrantys void im sure..
 
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Old 09-27-17, 04:54 PM
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Ahh, so. I see, said the blind man.
 
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Old 09-27-17, 05:00 PM
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Well, I think it looks neat and compact anyway . . . . someone took pride in their work.

If that's a Pressure Relief Valve in the corner that feeds into the downward pointing copper pipe near the Circulator, would it be a violation to place a bucket at the floor to catch if and when it ever spurts ?

I don't know what's behind the fibreboard wall.
 
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Old 09-28-17, 07:24 AM
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Yes, it appears that the discharge from the relief valve is just open in mid-air. It should be piped down to a few inches above a floor drain. If there is no floor drain, then a hot-water boiler shouldn't be installed in that location.

Is that a valve in the inlet line to the relief valve? That would be a big no-no.
 
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Old 09-28-17, 03:33 PM
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The original poster, Bryan, has, like Elvis, seemingly left the building, a drive-by. He has another, very similar thread going on "Heating Help": https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discus...t-or-change-it

Perhaps he has found the response there he was looking for? But, I'm through here.
 
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Old 09-28-17, 04:10 PM
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Yeah I posted over there as well so those guys dont get the run around..
 
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Old 09-29-17, 05:34 AM
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Sorry fellas I did not blow you guys off I just have been busy with work stuff. I am very appreciative of any help I get from you guys. Just so you know I posted on both this site and heatinghelp.com at about the same time.

@lawrosa : I'm in the process of changing the piping to the way it is layed out in the manual with the air eliminator in the secondary loop and the primary pump pumping towards the boiler. Does the air eliminator have to be higher than the boiler or does it not matter?

The relief valve you are seeing in the upper left hand corner is going to be removed as its not needed, there is already one on the supply piping for the boiler. The PVC pipe sticking up with the cap on it ties into my floor drains and is where I am going to pipe my relief valves to.

I did get the answer I wanted from "lawrosa". I was not trying to step on anybody's toes by posting on both sites.

Thanks for the info fellas
 
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Old 09-29-17, 11:42 AM
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Does the air eliminator have to be higher than the boiler or does it not matter?
It does not matter. Its a srubber.

I did get the answer I wanted from "lawrosa". I was not trying to step on anybody's toes by posting on both sites
Oh no worries.. Its just I dont think those guys followed the piping scheme and know what was going on there..
 
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