Fix patio drainage with TOP N Bond

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Old 05-13-14, 08:05 AM
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Fix patio drainage with TOP N Bond

I have a patio problem, this is a small 10' x 5' entrance slab, poorly poured with improper drainage slope and 2 major low spots and bordered with brick. The slab is under an aluminum threshold / 3 door french door so pump jacking is not possible without removing the door. This also interferes with removing the slab and replacing without major sawing, sledging as well as cost of concrete.
My plan is to build a frame against threshold and brick sloping from from 1/2" down to 1/8" at the end/front of patio and resurface using sackrete TOP N' BOND. This should allow me to screed the slope in, trowel smooth then brush finish.

Am I being to hopefull or will this work ?

I know slope should be 1/4" per foot but threshold edge is only 1/2" water flows downhill, I hope !!

Should I fill the low spots 1st ?

Will Top n Bond work & hold in form to allow for and keep this slope ?
Are there any other products or methods that would work better ?
 
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Old 05-13-14, 09:27 AM
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I'm not familiar with that material specifically but I have used other resurfacing compounds with good luck. I would use the directions for your product as a guide as to filling in the low spots first or just doing everything in one layer/pour.

Unfortunately everything in life is not perfect and ripping out and starting with proper and new is not an option. I would insure that with your plan you can get fall to direct water away from the door. If you'll be cutting is closer than you'd like you can make a well protected area near the house almost level to save your elevation to use closer to the edge to create fall.
 
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Old 05-13-14, 10:23 PM
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I would move water away from the door and house using variable-depth sawcuts in the concrete. It's a messy, dusty job, but when I did it at a place we owned in CO, it worked extremely well. No more puddles, and the sawcuts only required blowing accumulated dirt out once a year with compressed air to keep them functional. Oh, and I wasn't responsible for the wrong-way concrete--that was done by a few klutzes working for the previous owner.

I made the cuts in a radial pattern, branching out from the door centerline in uniform increments. Most people who commented about it thought it was just fancy concrete joint work.
 
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Old 05-14-14, 05:25 AM
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we've had success using 'herculiner' [no $ interest] as a liquid waterproofing membrane in such situations,,, it will prevent water intrusion for small areas,,, obviously that won't negate puddling which the previous responders have addressed appropriately
 
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Old 05-14-14, 08:19 AM
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Thanks for all responses and interest, the water intrusion is mostly resolved except if the water level reaches above the threshold due to the poor drainage and the brick border which kind of forms a pond. the puddles are just an eyesore and inconvenience when we get a sudden hard rain which is pretty common here in southern Virginia.
A previous owner has tried the saw trick, but cut 2 pretty shallow grooves the length of the pad which do not help and are a real eyesore. If I had my way I would tear out and do it properly but cutting the pad out against the threshold seems improbable unless the make a sawsall that will cut 4" concrete. Now the pad is ugly, inefficient, and inconvenient. I have thought maybe a channel drain in front of the door with and just leveling with Sackrete Flowcoat or Quickrete resurfacer (these are thinner and can be poured or squeegeed on) so no forms or slope building but still the problem cutting close enough to the door/ threshold. My proposed option with top n bond, "trowel on" seems good in theory but best laid plans often don't work as planned. Wish someone who has tried a similar plan could input or improve on this approach. If it fails I'm only out about $50 and will have a date with a concrete saw, a sledge hammer and 30-40 bags of concrete.
Thanks for any and all input.
 
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Old 05-14-14, 09:53 AM
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Just another question here: If the brick border is creating a dam, will removing that solve your other issues?
 
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Old 05-14-14, 10:31 AM
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Pecos,
Although a decorative border, the brick also serves as a mini retaining wall so removing would leave a 4" high bare earth/grass exposed on 2 sides of patio. The other 2 sides are at grade or below. Whoever built this home back in the 1970's had poor drainage and grade experience, thus all these and more drainage issues. The bad part is we are on a hill so none of this was necessary and with proper planning there would have been no drainage issues at all. go figure? can't unbreak an egg. I just have to improve what we have....
 
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Old 05-14-14, 01:42 PM
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we have a similar plan & it was posted this am,,, it works GREAT but may not be to your liking,,, too bad we got another similar job this afternoon - same issue & same resolution.

if 'herculiner' @ 1/16" is too thick, top & bond is thicker for successful use,,, you could try aquafin - they have several products that will work AND they can be colored
 
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Old 05-14-14, 01:55 PM
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Staydry1, I will look into aquafin, I could not find anything on herculiner except a pickup bed liner, I will also look for your am post about similar plan. I do need the to 1/8th to 1/2" grade to ensure water runoff so water does not enter threshold when we get a gusher.
Thanks again for interest !!
 
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Old 05-14-14, 02:49 PM
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FWIW i have contacted Sakcrete customer service rep about using Top N Bond for this purpose and will post his response plus before and after pictures if I take this gamble. I may be lame but $50 or $500 + equipment rental + labor seems like a no brainer gamble to me. Our local building suppliers have deferred to HD and sLOES and anything except basics must be ordered which I can do myself.
I've poured a lot of concrete walls down in GA but never seen such poor concrete work as here in VA.
Our other patio has a pond to one side the cat and dog use for a watering hole. That's next on my concrete fix it list.... shew what I'd give for a good screed crew and fan, do rags and all.
 
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