Need nailing advice - wooden window screens

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Old 12-05-07, 10:14 PM
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Need nailing advice - wooden window screens

Hi,

I'm fairly new to the site, so I hope this is the best forum to post this question.

I have a drafty old Victorian which has several leaky old original windows, for which there are no storms or screens. To kill two birds with one stone, I am building wooden frames on which I intend to install screen, and then wrap in plastic for the winter.

The outside edge of the window frames have about a 1" to 1 1/4" inset all the way around that could accommodate the screen frame, so I decided to use pine 1x3's for the frames. (Cost is a factor).

Now that I'm actually assembling them, my dilemma is that I don't know what size/type nails to use that are long enough to make these butt joints without splitting the wood. The 1x3's are about 2 5/8" wide, so to do this as I imagined in my head would require at least a 3" nail or more. ( )

1x2's just seemed too flimsy and crooked for the task.

I built a bunch of these with my Dad about 35 yrs ago when I was a little kid, but unfortunately he's passed and can't guide me. I've already cut down most of the wood, so changing the design would be a major bummer at this point.

Any help on this is truly appreciated!

Thanks....
 
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Old 12-06-07, 04:42 AM
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Check with your local hardware store for corrugated fasteners. My Dad used these for the same purpose (let's not say how many years ago ).

Here's what they look like:

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/f...s/fastener.jpg
 

Last edited by George; 12-06-07 at 04:55 AM. Reason: add photo
  #3  
Old 12-06-07, 05:28 AM
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Screen Frames

Another idea is to use flat L-brackets attached to the inside surface of the frame corners with 3/4 inch screws.

Pocket screws and glue also make a strong joint, but requires specialized tools - a pocket hole jig (about $40).

Good luck with your project.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 06:49 AM
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I agree that pocket screws and glue will be your best fastening method. A Kreg pocket hole jig, a stepped bit, a square bit driver and a box of pocket screws is about $40, like Wirepuller said. You will not be disappointed with the results.



image source: Rockler.com
 
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Old 12-06-07, 06:49 AM
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You can drill holes 1 1/4 deep the size of the head of the screw then use 1 1/2 inch screws. Once in the window the holes would be covered and therefore not allow water to get into them. or just caulk the holes full after screwing together.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 09:56 AM
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Thanks so much for the fast replies and great advice guys! At first I was thinking the corrugated fasteners might be my cheapest and fastest option, but then I remembered I have a drill press. Two actually. (I rent the house from a mechanical engineer).

With the drill press and a stepped bit, I could do the pocket hole route without a jig, yes? Also, is it really necessary to drill the holes at an angle in the first place? The press in my nice warm basement (where I'm building the frames) is an old clunker -- it looks like I could adjust the angle of the table, but I can't get the nut off that holds it in position. I'd like to just keep it as simple as possible and get this knocked out.

I have a combination mill/press/lathe in the garage that looks like it could do just about anything, but it's far more intimidating looking (it's also 20 degrees out there).

Lastly, are pocket screws known by another name? What are my options if I can't find those per se?

You guys are awesome.
Thanks.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 10:15 AM
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Sometimes referred to as face frame screws. Here's a few choices:

http://www.rockler.com/search_result...et+hole+screws

The Kreg Weather-Resistant Pocket Hole Screws look to be right up your alley.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 10:31 AM
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You could probably figure out how to do it with just the step bit if you can angle your table. The thing the jig helps with is the angle and the distance the hole is from the edge of the wood- which is critical when figuring the length of the screw needed. There's a fine line between threads that hold, threads that won't hold, and a screw that pierces the stock because either the hole is too deep or the screw is too long. I've seen a single hole mini-Kreg jig and step bit with stop collar for $19.99. (Amazon) The bit alone is $16.99. Around here, Lowe's and Menard's carry the jigs and screws. Home Depot does not. But if you want to save yourself a couple bucks and use the trial and error method on some wood scraps, suit yourself.

Pocket screws usually have a flat head that's almost like a washer, not a tapered or bugle head like a drywall or deck screw. The washer head pulls the material together tightly, while a bugled head screw has a tendency to crack the wood as it tightens up. The step bit is designed to work with pocket screws. A 1 1/4" pocket screw would normally be used to join 3/4" thick stock together. 1 1/4" deck screws would work, but you'd have to be careful as you tightened them down not to overtighten.

If you wanted to forget the advice and the Kreg jig, you could probably predrill some straight 3/8" holes through the side stiles that would allow you to insert screws through the stiles and into the rails. Then maybe plug the holes with 3/8" wooden plugs after your assembly is complete.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 11:46 AM
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I am a pocket screw fan. i have a couple of the Kreg jigs. However, to do what you want to do just drill some pilot holes sized to the screw, counterbore them to recess the screw head and use either pocket screws or cabinet screws for the reasons XSleeper mentioned. A little exterior glue before assembly and you'll have a very strong joint.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 02:34 PM
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Pocket Holes

The angle of the pocket hole drill to the face of the stock is 15 degrees.

I have made a "poor man's" pocket jig which utilizes a 3/8 in. straight bit mounted on a router. The router travels on a 15 degree ramp to cut the slot. I then drill the pilot hole as a separate operation. I would rather have the Kreg jig. Maybe Santa will hear about this.
 
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Old 12-06-07, 02:43 PM
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Ken,

Would setting your desktop background to a picture of the Kreg kit be too subtle?



image credit: kregtool.com
 
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Old 12-07-07, 04:45 AM
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Desktop

What a neat idea, XSleeper!

I copied the picture. It's going on my desktop as soon as I sign off. Thanks.
 
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Old 01-16-08, 08:15 PM
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This is just an update, in case anyone who offered their help subscribed to responses on this thread. After dinking around with the corrugated fasteners for a bit, I soon got frustrated with that and just went and picked up a Kreg jig.

Mission accomplished. I can't say it's the most precise thing I've ever used (I got the R3 kit), but it certainly did the trick. I was a little disturbed to find little curly bits of the blue plastic of the jig being expelled along with the sawdust whilst drilling the holes. I'm hoping this is just temporary while the unit "burns in".

I have a million other projects around the house for which i think it will come in quite handy, so it's $50 well spent in my opinion.

Thanks again to everybody who offered their advice -- I appreciate it.

Karnsie
 
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