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covering dark brown stained trim/doors on interior - products to use

covering dark brown stained trim/doors on interior - products to use


  #1  
Old 01-08-14, 09:40 AM
R
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covering dark brown stained trim/doors on interior - products to use

We just bought our first home and we just started painting the master bed. In doing that we had to start figuring out how to prepare all of the trim, which is all around the house, for latex paint. The baseboards we are just going to buy new as it will be easier. So what I had heard was that I needed to sand first, but then I learned about Zinsser Cover Stain and then I learned about Sander Deglosser. Both of these are exciting as I would love to skip the sanding step, because it is super messy and takes so long by hand (we don't have a sander and you can't use a sander on door way trim anyway). Then I am hearing about A-100. Then I read that somebody sanded after the Zinsser Cover Stain....huh??? There are mixed reviews about the Zinsser Cover Stain. I have got about 9 doors and doorways that are going to need latex paint, not to mention 4 closets. Phew!

The only thing I can see agreement on is cleaning the surface and laying down painters tape. Check!
Do I need to sand first?
What kind of primer would you recommend to cover dark stained trim?

I have a good quality oil brush by the way.

Also, the Zinsser Cover Stain is really an awful smell. Since it is in the interior and I have a 3 yr old I am wondering if there are other items that would do the job, without killing so many brain cells.

Thanks for your input!
 
  #2  
Old 01-08-14, 09:52 AM
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Welcome to the forums and congratulations on becoming a home owner!

I'll assume the stained woodwork has been finished with oil base poly/varnish. To get latex paint to adhere well you need to sand and coat the wood's finish with a solvent based primer. You don't have to go crazy with the sanding, basically just a scuff sand to give the primer more tooth. Liquid deglosser will do the same thing [I usually use it along with sanding] It softens and cleans the oil base coating to help with adhesion. The softened paint/varnish will harden back up after awhile - read the instructions. Liquid deglosser does have a potent odor. There are a few latex primers that claim adhesion to oil base enamel/varnish but as an old school painter - I don't trust them.

Most any interior oil base primer will work well. If you need the primer to dry faster, you could use a pigmented shellac like Zinnser's BIN. A-100 is an exterior line of paint. While the oil base A-100 wood primer would work, it dries too slow and isn't formulated for interior work [it will outgas fumes not recommended for enclosed areas] Latex paint can be applied over any of these primers.

For a professional looking job you'll want to caulk the woodwork [everywhere 2 pieces join together or to the wall] You'd use a siliconized acrylic latex caulk between the primer coat and the 1st coat of enamel. Generally it takes 1 coat primer and 2 coats enamel to get full coverage on stained wood.
 
  #3  
Old 03-06-14, 08:55 AM
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I have the same problem as Raven Chaplin. I want to paint over all of the poly/ varnish coated wood trim in the house. With a 2700 sq. ft., 5 bedroom house, I want to make the job as easy as possible. It may take several years to complete! I, too, have small children and would like to cut down on fumes and time spent doing this. So, Raven Chaplin, have you done any of your trim yet? I was wondering if the deglosser saved the step of sanding and what types of primer and paint you ended up using. I did one bathroom already about 4 years ago. I used TSP to clean the wood and then hand sanded. Then I used an oil based Kilz primer and topped it off with 2 coats of a Lowe's brand oil based white paint. There are quite a few spots on the trim and cabinets that have been dinged/chipped off from bumping into them with laundry baskets and vacuums. I'm aware that I do need to buy a better brand of primer and paint. So can I use a latex paint of the oil based primer? I was always under the assumption that this would cause pealing and chipping, but since my way resulted in chipping anyway, I would much rather use a latex top coat. I do like the result of the trim on other spots where no chipping occured. I also have a problem with mildew building up on the window frame and sashes that I painted in the bathroom. Will this be less likely to occur if I use a latex top coat?

Painting the trim is such a big decision and I want to get it right. I've been back and forth between just leaving the wood trim as it is and painting it ever since I did the bathroom 4 years ago. Mainly because of the work involved and I'm afraid I will mess everything up! I hate the trim though. Its a blah builder basic oak that exactly matches the blah builder basic oak cabinets in all the bathrooms and the kitchen. It also matches the blah oak floors! It's oak overkill! The house is only 14 years old, but looks much more dated. We've lived here for 6 years and I can't really take it anymore!
 
  #4  
Old 03-06-14, 10:26 AM
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Welcome to the forums jnaderer!

Is the wood trim oak? or just stained to look like oak? Normally real oak trim is only used in the high end custom homes - far from being 'blah'

It's hard to say how much of your paint failure was from improper prep and how much from inferior coatings but I'd lean towards improper prep. I'm not big on using TSP on the inside as failure to remove all of the detergent's residue can result in adhesion issues. I like to use a liquid deglosser as an added step as it helps to remove any sanding dust and softens the old coating temporarily
helps with adhesion.

In order to successfully apply latex paint over oil base enamel you need to sand and then use a solvent based primer .... just like you would when painting over the poly. Latex paints can be applied over oil base primers.
 
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Old 03-06-14, 11:00 AM
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Thanks for your help! It is definitely stained oak and not real oak trim. I think for now I am going to just leave what I already did alone and start with the rest of the house. So do I clean, sand, and then use the deglosser? Or clean, deglosser, then sand?
Also, is it recommended to paint the trim just regular white white, or an off white? I've tried looking at pictures online, but it's hard to tell. The majority of my wall colors are light to medium colors in the bedrooms, and a light tan throughout the rest of the house. Thanks again for your help!
 
  #6  
Old 03-06-14, 11:16 AM
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If there is any wax/polish on the wood it should be cleaned off first. Then you sand, the deglosser is used prior to applying the primer. Besides cleaning the wood it also softens the poly/paint [oil base only] for a short while. Primer applied while the existing finish is softer will bond better - read the deglosser label. After enough time the softened finish will harden back up.

What color to paint the woodwork is a personal decision. Obviously you want a color scheme that goes together but there are too many choices to pick one for someone you don't know or a house you've never been in. Don't be afraid to experiment with colors, it isn't that big of a deal to change the color if you don't like it. IMO it looks best if all/most of the woodwork is painted the same but there are no rules!

2/3rds of my house has painted woodwork [SWP's Dover White] and the rest stained. For the most part those areas are separate. While pure white is probably the most common trim color, I've painted woodwork a wide range of colors including darker than the walls. The main thing is as long as it's pleasing to your eye - it's good!
 
  #7  
Old 03-11-14, 12:14 PM
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Thanks again for all of your previous help. I have spent the last few days retouching the bathroom trim that I did 4 years ago and it actually wasn't as bad as I thought. I wanted to note problem areas so that I didn't make the same mistakes again! There wasn't actually any peeling, just the nicks on the corners. But with 4 kids under the age of 9, I will expect this all over the house once it is completed. I've started sanding my daughters bedroom trim and want to go buy the primer and paint next. I used Kilz oil based primer in the bathroom. Do you recommend that brand? Being in northwest Ohio, warmer temps don't seem to be in the near future so long term ventilation may be an issue. Therefore, I don't want to use anything with a strong smell in the bedrooms. I don't remember the Kilz being too bad and have read that the shellacs are really strong. I have also read bad reviews on latex Kilz so I wanted to know if the oil Kilz was okay to use or if I should just try a different brand.
 
  #8  
Old 03-11-14, 01:31 PM
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Oil base Kilz will be ok.
 
 

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