Phone Line Filters

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  #1  
Old 05-03-14, 07:17 AM
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Phone Line Filters

I switched from a cable company to Bell and now I was given these filter to plug to all my house phones (Microfiltre LNPA)

But trying with the filters or without I notice no difference on the call quality, actually I feel its better without these filters because my voice has an echo when I have the phone plugged to the filter and then to the wall outlet.

Should I leave these filters installed and what purpose they serve?
 
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Old 05-03-14, 07:20 AM
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The call quality won't diminish. DSL works at a range you can't hear. The filter takes the lower frequencies out and allows only the higher ones to your modem. Without the filters your broadband would suffer considerable slowdown.
 
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Old 05-03-14, 08:13 AM
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Thanks Larry, I will leave these filters installed
 
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Old 05-03-14, 10:57 AM
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Are you from Canada? Which other companies are operating in your province?
I would call Bell and tell them you would like a pots splitter installed at your entry cable instead. This would separate your phone and data as soon as it enters the house, thus eliminating the multiple filters. If Telus operates in your area, tell them Telus would install it for you...
 
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Old 05-03-14, 01:02 PM
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Thanks for the help, yes I'm from Quebec and we do have Telus & Rogers beside Bell but only Bell and Videotron offer TV. I think the technician mensioned something like that but perhaps I misunderstood when he said he can do it in two ways and I choose the simplest. Now its too late because if they come back again I will have to pay $90 for a service visit. I did have before Bell and switched to Videotron cable but their TV content was really disappointing with lots of repeat shows and tons of commercials so I switched back to Bell and took only the phone and Internet package because I got an exterior antenna but if I'm not happy with the antenna then I can add the TV from Bell
 
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Old 05-03-14, 03:06 PM
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It is beyond me why the providers don't give out signal splitters to be mounted in the NID rather than having all phone lines protected individually. It would seem to be a simpler solution.
 
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Old 05-03-14, 06:13 PM
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Chandler,
I can't vouch for my entire country, but in my province there is one company that owns most of the lines, towers etc. so everybody goes with them. They're so busy digging up the province to deliver fiber that they contract service calls out. Most of the time you get some dude that can barely spell his name doing your install and you end up with goofy stuff like the OP discussed.

OP,
You might be facing a service charge, but you could still phone and call the tech on being lazy and threaten to switch providers if they don`t come put the splitter in for free. They are not at all hard to install. Worst they can do is tell you no.
 
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Old 05-03-14, 08:40 PM
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TV providers is a two players game in Quebec; either Videotron (cable) or Bell (dish) and try to get any help from either you are talking min. 30 minutes wait on the phone and keep your fingers crossed that you will get some answers / help. On top of that, the players they got you by the b@#ls because Government does not want to have foreign companies in that field so the players are not afraid of competition. It is not so important for me to spend the time to get that splitter but I'm handy enough and I will ask around if I can do it myself.
 
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Old 05-03-14, 09:55 PM
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Get ahold of one and I could likely walk you through it.
 
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Old 05-04-14, 08:48 AM
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Thank you Awesome for the help but digging into this subject I discovered some exciting info. About 4 years ago I had an old black rotary phone which the wife wanted to install somewhere in the house but this phone when connected to the wall outlet was all ok but not ringing. So I hooked up in some forums and send photos of my existing installation to fix the no ringing problem and kept these photos which I attach here.

In photo ďPhone1 Panel TodayĒ you can see that I have this Corning splitter and is not connected anywhere but in the rest photos you can see that the Corning Splitter was connected and it was installed by Bell about 8 years ago when I switched from Dial-up Internet to DSL. If you want I can post here the 2 page pamphlet from Corning regarding the splitter.

So it seems that the guy who installed my new phone on May-02 disconnected the Corning Splitter for unknown reasons to me. In addition where I have the Bell modem installed now, I had a single wall phone outlet and this guy remove it and installed a double phone outlet and he told me that the bottom outlet is for the modem and the top for the phone.

Unfortunately I donít have the time neither the patience now to call Bell and ask why the splitter was disconnected etc. Monday I have a contractor coming to do some landscaping and will be busy every day outside. But I would love to know what you have to say and if itís something simple I could try it at night and hopefully I will not disconnect my land line. It took Bell one week to come and install my new land line and this is after many calls to them and promises that they will come on Thursday which they never did and finally they came last Friday; I donít want to go thru that again.
 
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Old 05-04-14, 10:03 AM
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Those photos are a prime example of what I posted to chandler. Gross.
And are those plastic anchors used on the splices???

Ok lets try this out. Thats cool if you're busy but check in when you can and I'll help sort this out.
Could you please verify for me where the big black cable runs to?
Do you have a security system?
 
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Old 05-04-14, 12:37 PM
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The big black cable is going into the main electrical panel which is located just next to the Corning splitter and I'm sure its connected to the ground inside the panel but have to remove the cover to verify this and I may do it tonight. Yes I do have a security system but presently its not connected to any company as I'm also looking for a new security provider.

I'm also confused because when the Corning splitter was installed years ago Bell gave me the filters to install on each phone in the house. So if the splitter directs the Internet and phone to different lines why I needed the filters?
 
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Old 05-05-14, 04:46 PM
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Verified today and the big black cable is going to the ground; under the electrical panel there is a big clamp with a big copper wire coming thru the wall (I assume it is from the meter because my meter is just behind that place on the outside) and the big black cable is connected there.
 
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Old 05-05-14, 11:05 PM
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Alright that makes no sense to me. Your picture says the blue and yellow wire coming off the terminals with the black cable were terminated onto your splitter.
No idea why they would would still ask you to install the separate filters.
Well some detective work needs to be done. You need to locate the cable coming in from outside. Do you have a grey box mounted somewhere outside your house?
The cable entering from outside is what needs to be split.
There will be two wires from that cable the go into the "line" terminals.
From there, your modem cable will have the green and red wires on the "modem" terminals, and your phone lines will be jointed together and tailed onto the "phone" terminals.
Your security we can get into later. I would start by identifying your incoming cable, phone cables, and modem cable.
 
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Old 05-06-14, 05:03 AM
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The big black cable is not the ground, it's the incoming line. Back in the day when that was installed, they used what basically amounted to lamp cord. It's horrible for carrying data - especially if it runs anywhere near electrical - and if you can I highly recommend that you rip it out and replace it with Cat5.

The ground is the solid gray wire that connects to the center nut on the terminal block.

The jacks that just have phones attached to them can stay as they are, but you really need to run a new Cat5 line from there to where the modem is. With that crappy wiring I guarantee your speeds are suffering.
 

Last edited by JerseyMatt; 05-06-14 at 05:29 AM.
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Old 05-06-14, 06:04 AM
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Sorry but I had a closer look and the big black cable is the incoming phone line as Jersey suggests. This cable has two wires and each wire is connected to the right / left brass terminals on the black box. The center brass terminal is marked GND and there is a single gray wire connected to it and the other end of this gray wire goes inside the wall and I assume goes to outside Bells incoming wiring.

Although I would have liked, there is no way for me to replace the big black cable with Cat5 because it comes from outside where the electric meter is and Iím not qualified to do such a work. Also it is impossible to install Cat5 cable from the black box to where the modem is; to do this it means that I have to open up many walls / ceilings Ė a huge job.

If you noticed my 1st picture in post #10 above, this picture represents the current wiring and there is a red wire connected to the right brass terminal and a green wire connected to the left brass terminal. On the same picture there are no wires connected to the Corning splitter

On the next picture below which represents the installation a few years earlier, there are different color wires connected to the brass terminals and I also have wires connected to the Corning splitter. This means that the guy who installed my landline on May-02 he switched the wires from the brass terminals and disconnected the wires from the Corning splitter.

Last night I subscribed to Bellís online page and noticed that now they have a chat on line feature which I used it to help me with the registration process and it was fast and convenient. I will use again this chat feature and will ask to speak to a technician and explain the above problems and hopefully they will come for free to fix all the above issues
 
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Old 05-06-14, 01:01 PM
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Do you have any computers connected via wired internet to your router? What you could do is if you are running all wireless is install the modem right there. That would avoid you having to run the new cable to the room the modem is in. Plus if you go with VoIP, you can connect your phones to it right there.

As far as replacing the black cable, there's nothing you need to be qualified for. You're replacing one low-voltage cable for another. It doesn't go through your electrical panel or meter (or it better not anyway), or anywhere else that would make it dangerous. But you have to change it.
 
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Old 05-06-14, 05:34 PM
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Earlier on this thread I mentioned that the Bell technician removed a single phone wall outlet I had in my office and installed a double one (the wireless modem is connected there) and he told me the bottom one is for the wireless modem and the top for the phone. This makes me think that although he disconnected the Corning splitter perhaps he did something that is equivalent to a splitter. Why he would spend the time to remove a single phone wall outlet and install a double one?

In addition I just checked my Internet speed and I have 6.8MBps which is what I ordered (basic Internet). With the previous company I had again the basic Internet and my speed was about 5MBps. So I donít see any problem with my speed so far.

Jersey I know that its not a big deal to replace the black cable but all Iím saying is that in order to do that I have to cut and splice the main Bell phone cable which comes from the street pole to my house and if something goes wrong I will be out of phone service for a few days + its going to cost me at least $95 if I have to get a Bell guy to come and fix whatever is required. My thinking is when I cut the cable, it may trip something at Bellís service center and this may need a service visit to verify why my cable was cut, I just donít know and Iím not prepared to take the chance.
 
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Old 05-07-14, 04:50 PM
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If everything is working to your satisfaction there really is no need to change anything.
What we are telling you would lead to eliminating the separate filters and tidying up your cables.
 
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Old 05-07-14, 05:25 PM
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LOL it won't trip any alarms or anything. You watch too much TV. If anything you need to tell them to come out and install a proper NID on the side of the house, and ground it OUTSIDE the house like code requires. And that's something they can't charge you for. It should have been done by the last guy that was there. It's illegal for the drop to enter the premises without going through a grounding block first. If the pole gets struck by lightning that could burn your house down.
 
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Old 05-07-14, 08:52 PM
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While Matt is probably correct that current codes require the station protector to be located outside there are tens, or hundreds, of millions installations that have the protector inside the building. I see no reason to get excited about the location of the station protector at this late date.

Also, the wiring ahead of the DSL modem is irrelevant concerning the data transfer. As one poster (a telephone installer) noted several years ago the entire run from the modem back to the central office is "cat nothing" and it works just fine. MAYBE if you are at the fringe end of the DSL capability of the central office it MIGHT make a difference but I doubt very much that the telephone company will put in a cat-rated line just for you. So, because the protector and the incoming line IS the property of the telephone company you should do NOTHING with the incoming cable or the protector.

I DO suggest that you clean up that rat's nest of station wiring, however. The ideal would be to use either a type 66 or a type 110 punch-down block and wire each station jack separately. Then wire from the protector to the DSL filter and from the filter to the punch-down block appropriately. Using the central filter will make the individual filters unnecessary.

Locating the modem near the point of entry and then running cat. 5e cables to the various data jacks totally separate from the telephone wiring is also a good idea.
 
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Old 05-07-14, 10:49 PM
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Thank you all for the great education on this subject and I intent to call Bell to raise my concerns about the ďratís nest of station wiringĒ I have including the disconnected Corning splitter.
 
  #23  
Old 05-08-14, 02:27 AM
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You can have the telephone company do the work, at a high hourly rate, or you can Do-It-Yourself in a few hours. The 66 and 110 blocks are readily available, you will get a much better price ordering them over the Internet than buying them from the big box mega-mart homecenter. You would also need a "punch down" tool and these come in a price range of a few dollars to over a hundred. For your usage I would probably not pay over ten dollars (on-line purchase) or twenty dollars in the big box. You would probably also want a line tracer/toner that would cost another twenty or so in order to identify which jacks are connected to which cables.
 
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Old 05-08-14, 04:33 AM
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There's a huge difference between several years ago and today. Several years ago you couldn't get DSL unless you were within X number of FEET - not miles - from the local exchange office (and if you were on the fringe you could get MAYBE 128kbps) - and that 'cat nothing' cable is the reason. Nowadays that limitation is mostly extinct because the 'last miles' have been largely converted to fiber, and the local loop distribution lines are now large gauge twisted pair cables.

And yes, while the old huge 500-pair rope cables that used to run along the poles aren't twisted pair, they ARE shielded against outside RF and EM interference. The parallel pair 'lamp cord' from the pole to the block is not.
 
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Old 05-08-14, 04:48 AM
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Yes, in the early days of DSL they did use feet as the measurement, like a maximum of 12,000 feet, which is roughly two miles. Yes, improvements have been made but not too many new twisted pairs have been installed as the cost is prohibitive, especially in larger gauges. I know people that live in older sections of cities where they are served by the same cables that were installed prior to WW II and they get DSL service just fine. Further, a 500 pair cable would be a rather small telephone cable, I'm much more used to seeing 1,500 pair cables and these have been run in the last decade or so.

As for using fiber, not in the "last mile" my friend unless you are talking about the Verizon FiOS system. Fiber IS common between central offices and between the CO and large subscribers (businesses and large multi-occupancy residential buildings) but outside of FiOS almost unheard of to single-family residences.
 
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Old 05-08-14, 07:14 AM
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I donít intent to pay Bell to fix the mess they made. You guys sound like a pro and Iím glad you participated here to explain the details. Myself Iím just a knowledgeable DIY with common sense. I know my capabilities and limitations and therefore I know any service coming to the house is safer to leave it to the pros.
 
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Old 05-08-14, 07:50 AM
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Maybe the telephone company is quite a bit different where you live but in my neck of the woods they charge severely anytime they come to a person's house unless there is trouble that is definitely their fault. They most assuredly would NOT repair the mess you have for free.

Almost every residential telephone installation I have ever seen that was done prior to the "Bell Breakup" was a hack job. They could get away with it because the consumer had no choice, it was either the Bell operating company that did the work or there was no telephone service at all. As Ernestine (Lily Tomlin on the old Laugh-In television show from the 1960s) stated, "We don't care, we don't have to. We're the telephone company!"
 
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Old 05-09-14, 04:56 PM
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kolias,
If things don't go well with Bell, just remember it is very very easy to do yourself. Your lines all come together in one place so its just a matter of tidying them up.
 
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Old 05-09-14, 06:37 PM
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Much appreciate the help Awesome but got too many things going on right now and since the phone / Internet are working, tidying the wires up is on the bottom of my list. But one day I will do this work
 
 

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