DSL problems...

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Old 08-11-20, 12:18 PM
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DSL problems...

Our DSL is not working well. I"m THINKING it may be with stuff inside the house. Is this the right place to get help with the wiring, plugs, and all that for DSL? 'Cause the last time we had a Centurylink technician it didn't go well (about 5 YEARS ago), and I don't imagine they've gotten any better...

So, are there experts in here that can help me figure out inside-the-house stuff?
 
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Old 08-11-20, 12:56 PM
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Typically what I do is to connect the incoming phone line directly to the DSL modem.
Check the operation that way.

The problem is DSL is carried on standard copper wiring. The copper wiring infrastructure is failing and they are not upgrading copper lines. All it takes is a little water in the cable or at one of the splice points to reduce the DSL signal.

It may be time to start looking for a new internet provider.
 
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Old 08-11-20, 04:30 PM
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Thanks for the feedback. Not very useful here, but...


I apologize in advance ‘cause this is going to be long and stupid…

We have Centurylink DSL coming into the house. It's not very fast at 15Mbps, but it appears to be about as fast as they go to where we are, 40 miles from Minneapolis. And other than ONE cable company, that’s it for anything other than cell phone wireless. The last time they replaced the modem, which was sometime in 2018, we went from 12 Mbps to 15, and a technician had to come out an "rewire" the plug. He dragged a new wire across the basement, out the wall, and back in where the wall plug was. If the performance sucks at THIS POINT, it's outside and it's Centurylink's problem... Once it's INSIDE the house, they couldn't care less HOW BADLY it works.

The plug is in the outside wall of room A where it’s been for 15 years. For 15 years, the modem sat on the INSIDE wall of room A, opposite where the modem was. A LONG phone wire ran around 3 sides of the room from the wall plug to the modem. WORKED FINE.......

When he put in the new modem, that required a new wire (because of the blinding fast speed as I recall), he made me a LONG, LONG cable to work with the new setup for the new modem. So, it continued to run around the sides of the room, worked fine.

Last YEAR, we MOVED the modem so it was centrally located because we started streaming TV. And that SAME long, long wire got pulled out the door of room A and over to where the modem was. STILL worked fine - or as reasonably fine as we were led to believe it should - with people working from home for the last 6 months, there were times when it was slow-ish, but no worse than any of the wireless through the cell phones.

While we were in Coronavirus lockdown, we REMODELED room A, and as part of that, I ran a "phone" wire (4-wire cable) cable from the plug on the outside wall of room A to the wall near where the modem now sits. Just added MY cable to the three wires in use in the wall plug.



HERE'S where the fun starts... And why I'm hoping for someone informed on how the wiring plays together...

The incoming line has green, yellow, black and red wires. The wall plug uses the green, yellow and black incoming wires, connected to the green, yellow and black wires on the plug. The red wire isn't connected to anything. Never has been as far as I know. I haven’t touched it, just left it sitting quietly.

For the run to the plug near the modem, I connected the same green, yellow and black wires of MY wire/cable to the same colors in the plug on the outside wall of room A – the ORIGINAL wall plug. Just put 2 wires on each screw connector on the plug. Took the OTHER end of my cable, to the wall plug near the modem and connected the SAME yellow, green and black wires in MY cable to the wall plug. STILL worked fine. Took the LONG, LONG cable, plugged it into the plug near the modem, and it worked fine. Again, "fine" being not 15 Mbps, but not totally wretched.

Unfortunately, the only wall plug we had was white, so I used that temporarily while we ordered a brown one (don't ask, it "HAD" to match the rest of the plugs in the room according to the domestic associate and there was NOWHERE in the area that had a brown one)...

Brown wall plate arrived. Unwired my cable from the white one, wired up the green, yellow and black wires to the brown one (still just 6 feet from the modem), and IT TOTALLY SUCKS... 2 Mbps if I’m lucky. And upload of something like .5.

Reconnected the WHITE wall plug. one. No better. Reconnected the brown one. No better. This ISN'T rocket surgery - there's a yellow wire, a green wire and a black wire. And the plug has a yellow wire, a green wire and a black wire. SHOULDN'T IT BE REASONABLY IDIOT-PROOF? Even for me?

Just to be sure the whole thing hadn't composted, I called Centurylink and they said the connection strength was less than 50% and there were "lots of errors". So, SOMETHING is wrong.

SO, BACK to the original plug on the outside wall of A. Opened it, disconnected MY cable from the plug (which had both mine and the ones coming in from outside connected - each screw connector had 2 yellow, 2 green and 2 black wires), reconnected the yellow, green and black wires coming in the wall, and plugged in. It now runs about 9 - 10 Mbps. SO, it’s back to what it was BEFORE I touched it, but is there ANY reason I shouldn’t be able to piggyback my cable off the wall plug, run it 25 or so feet over to where I want it and connect another wall plug? ONLY ONE is in use at a time, so it’s not like I’ve got things plugged into both of ‘em… Is there ANY reason this SHOULDN’T work?

After all that, I called Centurylink AGAIN. This time the person says there's a problem but 'THE MODEM STILL THINKS IT'S ON QWEST.NET'. Centurylink hasn't been Qwest.net for YEARS. So now they're sending A NEW MODEM... I have NO idea WHY they're sending a new modem, but they are. This is the FIRST person to every tell me the modem is bad because it still thinks it’s connected to a defunct network… This makes NO sense to me, but if Centurylink wants to send me a new modem, and I presume a tech to connect it, I’m OK with that.

Now for the OTHER bizarre part of all this……….

While all this is going on, we're rebooting the modem, and I’m trying DIFFERENT phone cables 'cause it's stupid to have a giant wad of cable sitting there to go 6 feet to the modem. EVERY other fer-real, came-with-a-modem phone cable I plugged in did NOT WORK AT ALL. I have 6-foot, 4 wire cables, I have 10 foot, 4-wire cables, I have a 20 foot, 4 wire cables – they’re ALL 4-wire cables. NONE OF THEM WORK. Yes, they’re ALL PHONE CABLES. They all fit in the phone cable plug, NOT the LAN/WAN cable plug. For every one of them, both DSL lights light steady, but NO Internet light ever comes on. The ONLY cable that works is this hugely long cable the Centurylink tech gave me when he wired the plug on the outside wall of room A back in 2018. What the heck is going on THERE?

So, anybody have any useful information – and dump the DSL is good, but not useful at this moment.
 
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Old 08-11-20, 04:48 PM
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(Side note: I am also about 40 miles NW of Minneapolis)

Phone and DSL only use two wires each not three. This is likely the issue. Typically voice will be on red/green and DSL will be black/yellow. Connecting three wires might be giving you some interference. In the outside box, you can look and see if they separate the wires there. If there is only one block they don't and you likely need to use a DSL filter. If there are two, take note of the colors of the 2nd one. This is likely the internet.

Start at the first cable the goes into the house and put the new modem there. Connect everything up and do a speed test (speedtest.net) If all is good then you can start moving things around making sure to keep track of the two wires you are using.
 
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Old 08-11-20, 05:35 PM
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DSL and phone come into your home on one pair of wires. You can use one pair throughout the home but then you'd need a DSL filter on every phone.

Like Tolyn mentioned they can use two pairs of wires if they use one DSL filter in the demarc location to feed just the phones. The DSL is the same exact line but with no filter.
 
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Old 08-12-20, 07:02 PM
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I'm not sure WHY there are three wires connected in the plug for the DSL, but there are. I've BEEN in the phone box outside and it's a mess. I couldn't figure out ANYTHING in the mess. BUT, FWIW, there are NO PHONES on any plugs in the house. Our "land line" is VOIP, so it runs off the DSL. And there are NO filters anywhere - when this modem was put in the (extremely young) tech INSISTED, NO FILTERS.

I can look in the mare's nest of the outside phone box again, but it would be extremely difficult to trace ANYTHING from the outside box into/through the house, and as far as I know - again, from the tech, this is a unique connection using the yellow and green wires... The Centurylink tech pulled a new wire from the outside phone box and wired the inside plug because, according to him, THIS DSL modem required two DSL connections for the "higher speed"... I have NO idea how much of the information was accurate, just what I vaguely remember from when the guy was here.

If y'all are sure I should just have a green and a yellow wire, and NO black wire, I'll disconnect the black wire - everything is sitting in the open at the moment, so it's very easy.

The new modem should be here tomorrow or Friday - it has nothing to do with what I'm trying to do - they're sending it because the person on the phone freaked out when they noticed the current modem says it's still on Qwest.net... It's been working for 2 YEARS, so I can't imagine it makes any difference, but...

I don't know if Centurylink will send somebody out for the new modem or not, so we'll see...
 
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Old 08-13-20, 04:04 AM
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Removing the black wire not a good idea. Rebooted the modem and both DSL lights went red and STAYED red. Had NOTHING. Hooked the black wire back up. Back to running about half speed - 8Mbps up, 1 down.

Any chance the tech hooked things up in a non-standard configuration?

I can try looking at the outside phone box again, but it's ugly out there.

In a connected idea - we currently have connections through Visible. We have one "data" phone that's just for data. We have 2 cells that we can tether. So, even when the DSL is garbage we have a connection. We did all this for when traveling, but we're having to use things at home at this point. I could ADD a 4th phone - another "data" phone and remove the whole DSL from the equation. It would be cheaper monthly than paying Centurylink for the DSL, but we'd be completely reliant on Verizon for ALL our connections... Thoughts?
 
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Old 08-14-20, 03:32 PM
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The feces festival continues.... New modem arrived. Zyxel C3000Z. We were getting around 8Mbps sometimes and 2.7+/-.3Mbps most of the time. Plugged in the new modem. Set the names. Let it connect and NOW we get 8Mbps for a minute, the 2.3+/-.5Mbps.

Called Centurylink. Eventually got a person that "optimized the line. when he was done and we plugged the modem back in it wouldn't connect at all... EVENTUALLY - and by eventually I mean 10+ minutes, it sort-of connected, but the person on the phone said "I can see the DSL1 is connect but DSL2 is having problems. It's about 50% strength and there are a lot of errors - EXACTLY the same thing I was told a week ago...

The other interesting thing from today is that the Centurylink robot said we have 20 Mbps service and that we should be getting a minimum of 16.nnnMbps. We've NEVER had anywhere NEAR 20Mbps. I THINK we maybe used to get about 12Mbps, but it was never a big deal since we just used it for the computers. Since starting to stream TV in January it became a big deal but the excuse was always "line congestion" because everybody is at home, working and using HUGE amounts of bandwidth...

The good news is it'll either get FIXED or we'll go to the alternative of adding another wireless data phone and dump the DSL completely. So far, even when congested, the wireless phones are at least as good as the DSL on a GOOD day.

A technician is supposed to come out tomorrow.
 
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Old 08-14-20, 03:43 PM
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I have a good friend that lived out in the sticks in western Pa. He used to marvel at the speeds here as he could only get DSL. His got slow every time it rained. Went intermittent when it was windy. Finally he now has a basic cable system that came thru his area.

The biggest problem is the line quality. Here where I live DSL.... if there is any left.... will be gone soon.
My town and most directly around me have no copper ties to the outside world. We have all fiber with either FiOS or a converter on the pole to supply copper to a house.

You mentioned optimizing a line..... the tech can raise and lower transmit levels but he can't do anything about a crappy line.
 
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Old 09-11-20, 01:18 AM
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late to the party i guess.
but my history with DSL is remove any wires not needed for connections..
(that will reduce or eliminate stray induction)
Depending on the demark box, i'd only connect red & green to dsl feed output..
then that same wire to modem jack connect red & green to jack pins 4 & 5
(the 2 closest together in the middle)
plug in the modem, and see what you get..
if that gets you going with dsl.
you can go back and connect the black & yellow to the filtered voice output
feed from the demark.
then connect the other end at the modem to another jack for your voice phone..
(or use the jack off the back of the modem if it has a voice output connection)

;-)
 
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Old 09-14-20, 08:29 AM
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DSL is more sensitive than telephone, and inside you house you may look at splices and how the wire is going. The DSL goes straight to the line, or at some operators trough a splitter. the DSL connection on the splitter is st right trough or trough a pair of capacitors who just are blocking DC. All other equipment has to have a filter so it not steal to much of the data speed.
If it is possible to split so you have one pair after the splitter to phones etc, and on other pair to the ADSL it will help you loos as little speed as possible. Usually red and green are the line in, yellow and black may be the other pair, but you may have to disconnect it from other wires in the NID. They may have been for grounding etc.

As you describe it you only need yellow and green.


 
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