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  #1  
Old 01-22-03, 06:33 PM
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problem

Hello. Recently, my computer has come across another problem.

Sometimes, when the computer is on, and I leave it idle for a moment, when I come back to use it (move hte mouse, because of the monitor power save), the monitor says "No Signal Connected", but the computer is still on. Then when I go to restart it, I see nothing on the monitor (except that sign "No Signal Connected"), and the computer dosen't beep like it normally does when you turn it on. After a few pushes of the power button, the beep is heard and the information on the monitor is displayed. How can I fix this?
 
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  #2  
Old 01-22-03, 07:13 PM
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What type machine are you using, ie: brand, speed, etc. Most importantly, what type operating system does it use and what version.

Different machines, and operating systems work differently. Please post back with this information and we will try to help you out!

Also, another question. What changes did you make to your system such as system settings and software added or deleted right before your system started its different behavior. These may also help us to hone in on your problem.

Thanks,

Kay
 
  #3  
Old 01-23-03, 03:53 AM
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AMD Duron 1.2 Ghz
Windows XP Professional
608 MB OF RAM
32 MB VIDEO
 
  #4  
Old 01-23-03, 05:33 AM
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The error "no signal connected" means that there is no signal from the video card to the monitor.

Check to make sure that the monitor's cable is securely seated to the monitor and the video card. If you are comfortable with opening your computer, remove the video card and plug it back in. This will ensure that the contact is good.

Ordinarily, starting a computer from a cold state, that is with the power off, you should hear the computer beep as it completes the POST - power-on self-test. If the computer will not POST each time it is started from the power having been off, it is a sign of dark times ahead. This is a BIOS function that has to be completed for the computer to run properly. POST is something that the computer will do even if there is no operating system installed.
 
  #5  
Old 01-23-03, 07:18 PM
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New Information: After todays events, I found this out:

-even though the computer beeps, nothing loads on the monitor
-its not the monitor, I have tested the connections, and made sure they are tightened securely.
-even if I am reading a page like this, the monitor will all of a sudden turn black and it would say "no signal". I then HAVE to turn it off by pulling the wire. Then when I turn it on again, it may beep or not, but nothing displays on the monitor. I can hear the fan inside and some components, but thats about it. The activity light does not blink at all.
-After a few of those turning off and then turning on, in 10 mintues or so, the computer turns on and i can see the stuff on the monitor.

My "idea" of what is wrong. Its not the monitor. I think the computer just fails to boot the HDD maybe? I don't know...help!
 
  #6  
Old 01-23-03, 07:32 PM
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Hard drive will have nothing to do with it. You should at least see a POST (or on a name-brand the branding screen - Compaq, HP, Gateway, whatever.)

You may have Vid card problems. Try the monitor on a different computer. I think it's either the monitor or the card, probably the monitor. If your computer is beeping (once, I assume, you didn't say) then it's completing POST. That's a good sign. Once it completes POST (beeps) do you notice the HDD light flickering? Hear the HDD running? Does the CD-R test? Have you tried starting from a boot disk? That's a good way to test the computer. If you see the floppy turning and running, and don't see anything, that's a good indication it's your vid card or monitor. Once the computer boots to floppy, try typing this: C: <Enter>, then A: <Enter>
If after the A: <Enter> you see the floppy running again, your computer is booted, you have a bad monitor or vid card (or seated improperly, or something like that.)
At that point I would try re-seating the Vid Card. Try a different monitor (one that you know works.)

Good luck!
 
  #7  
Old 01-23-03, 07:35 PM
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One more thing, you haven't by chance overclocked this computer have you? If so, you may be overheating the CPU. Even if it's not OC'd, it could still be overheating. Try cleaning the case out real good. Make sure all the fans are spinning properly. If a CPU is overheated, it may not start the computer until it's cool.
 
  #8  
Old 01-24-03, 03:58 AM
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The computer and everything turns on properly when I see that the HDD and Floppy Disk LED flickers.

My video card is internally built into the motherboard. And I checked my monitor on another computer and it works fine.

Overclocking? I don't think I overclocked it, but I know my motherboard has a S.M.A.R.T. chip that tells me the temp, so I can check that...

Still have the problem...
 
  #9  
Old 01-24-03, 04:15 AM
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If you can get your hands on a vid card, I would start there. Sounds like the MB is fine, you're just having video problems. Of course, these days, you can get another MB for less than the price of a Vid Card, so you may be better off replacing it anyway.
 
  #10  
Old 01-24-03, 11:32 AM
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The video card in my computer is not really a card. Since my RAM and Video is shared, the Video port is built in to the motherboard.

Can we be sure its the video problem? Because if the computer won't boot at all sometimes, dosen't it mean it could be something else? Sometimes it beeps and the other time it dosen't. Sure it could be the video, but the way I see it here, is that it might not be.
Right now I will download a application that displays my current CPU temperature and determine wheter or not if this is a factor contributing to the problem.

And also, even if I was to get a new Video Card, I have no free PCI slots for it, since my motherboard is only equipped with three slots--all which are filled with necessities.
 
  #11  
Old 01-24-03, 03:06 PM
jlbos83
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Does this only happen after things have been on for a while? Is the power supply fan running? I am wondering if the power supply is getting hot and dropping some, but not all voltages, so you still have an LED here and there, but nothing really working. Then after it cools down everything seems to work for a while. Sort of the same symptoms that you might get if the CPU was overheating.
 
  #12  
Old 01-24-03, 03:18 PM
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Yeah, that's what I'm thinking is some sort of overheating problems. If you have a board that supports monitoring of all the temps (not just the CPU temp) run some software to monitor the temps and fan speeds, etc. Set the temp alarms fairly low, so that you will know before it overheats to the point of shutting down. Set the fan alarm somewhat higher than usual, so that you will know if the fans are slowing to much. Set the voltages at about 5% or lower, so that you will know if they fluctuate too much. I forget the program I used to use for temp/speed monitoring, but it was a good one. I know I got it from www.download.com

Good luck!
 
  #13  
Old 01-24-03, 08:33 PM
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The computer just goes blank when Im using it, just all of a sudden.

I opened the computer and turned it on with the monitor and keyboard attatched just after the problem had hit again. I felt the radiators and the power supply, but they weren't even warm. This is what would happen:

1. Im using the computer
2. All of a sudden the screen goes black. The monitor says "No Signal Connected".
3. I turn off the comptuer
4. I turn it on using the power switch
5. I hear the HD start to spin, the fans running. The light on the CD flickers. The monitor says "No Signal Connected".
6. SOMETIMES thereis a beep, and sometimes there is not.
7. Theres nothing on the monitor
8. The red activity light does NOT flicker at all.

then after a while...of turning it off and on (like 3-5 mins)
1. I turn it on
2. I heard the HD start to spin, the fans running. The light on the Cd flickers.
3. BEEP...The red light flickers
4. Monitor displays all the things.
5. Floppy disk flickers* <<-- This usually tells me that the computer will work.
6. The comptuer boots regularly...
 
  #14  
Old 01-24-03, 09:52 PM
jlbos83
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MAybe a RAM problem? Since you have onboard video, it is sharing RAM. Maybe first try reseating, then move around and see if the symptoms stay the same?
 
  #15  
Old 01-25-03, 12:41 PM
timwilson
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Have you added ANY hardware to this machine lately? You said that all of the slots were filled up so you have some cards that you have added, but how long ago? Even though your symptom is at the video and not booting it could be any of these cards being defective or just not liking the other cards. I have done this before and removed all the cards not necessary to boot and then boot it up. One at a time shut down and add the cards, letting the computer run long enough to see if it will fail every time.

Good Luck!!
 
  #16  
Old 01-25-03, 03:03 PM
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USB 2.0, Modem, and LAN Card. Ive had them since i've had the computer.
 
  #17  
Old 01-25-03, 03:13 PM
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They aren't required to start the computer though, so try removing them and adding back one at a time as timwilson suggest. You may still have the same problems with all the cards out of the computer anyway. But at least this way you can eliminate some components as problematic.
 
  #18  
Old 01-25-03, 05:54 PM
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It does sound like a heat issue.

Try taking the side panel off, visualy check to make sure all fans are working, and use the comp for a while with the panel off.

Also, while your are doing this, if you have one of those computer desks where the tower goes into one of those narrow slots, if you try this ,take it out of there. Those things by themselves can cause an overheating problem in some circumstances.

Good Luck!
 
  #19  
Old 01-25-03, 06:52 PM
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Ok. So my motherboard comes with this temperature monitor that telles me the temperature of the components inside.

My temps and volts are as follows:
CPU TEMP: 46.0 C 114.0 F
Vcore: 1.78 V
Vio: 3.27 V
System Temp: 34 C and 93 F
Vagp: 2.51 V

What are the averages suppose to be?

Also whats the difference between CPU Temp and System Temp?

Thanks.
 
  #20  
Old 01-26-03, 10:02 AM
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That's actually pretty cool for a Duron at 1.2Gh. Did you let the system warm-up good before taking these readings?

CPU temp = core CPU temp
System temp = temp at the motherboard

I'm not sure what a Duron 1.2's voltage is supposed to be, but that sounds right.

Also, if you're getting these readings from the CMOS, then you are not reading temps at 100% CPU usage. You need to run some temp/voltage software from windows. Work on your computer like you normally would, even run some CPU intensive programs, like SETI. Then take readings in Windows. These will give you more accurate readings.
 
  #21  
Old 01-26-03, 04:30 PM
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The symptoms you describe (not being able to turn it on for a cert. amt of time, etc.) do sound like an overheating problem. A common problem with 'package' computers, is their lack of proper cooling apparatus... especially if you added more internal hardware blocking air flow.

Try getting a can of compressed air and blowing out all of the dust & misc. buildup inside the tower.
If possible, remove any internal hardware that you added and see if it will run fine like that.


Occasionally though, the power-saving settings that will send your computer into a 'stand-by' mode won't turn off when input devices (keyboard, mouse, etc.) are used again. However, I've only encountered this problem with Windows 98 and 98se, never with xp pro.
 
  #22  
Old 01-26-03, 08:37 PM
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real problem

This could be alot of things, mebe heat related, mebe integrated video ram trouble, mebe ram probs, mebe a combination of phyical problems, however it does "feel" like a phyical problem.
Hardware is subject to break down.
Integrated hardware can and often does, produce this kind of symptom. Overheating is high on the list of "usual suspects".
you have looked at everything, have u also checked or tried changing the Power Scheme for the machine? Set it to totally disabled and see if that has any effect.
is it out of warranty? Check with the manufacturers' support, or FAQ on their web page.

are you against replacing the integrated unit?

sommetimes the cost of trouble-shooting isn't worth the time or trouble when you need to get back "up and running/working" again.

my vote: either get some serious bench-work on the unit, or replace it.

RichPatrick
lemme know how it works out.
 
  #23  
Old 01-27-03, 03:58 AM
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I downloaded some software, and they are giving me the reading temps. Right now, I think its an overheating problem, because when it goes off all of a sudden, I'm unable to turn it on again, until I let it cool down.

I turned it off last night after the problem, and when I turned it on in the morning, it was fine.

Yes, that is the temperature of the computer after a lot of usage and time has gone by.

The unit I'm using just went through a new motherboard, hard drive, and everything.

Another thing: I have an external usb drive 2.0 and when the problem occurs, the light changes from GREEN to AMBER.
 
  #24  
Old 01-27-03, 06:04 AM
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I use to have a video problem when the system got too warm. I installed a new cpu fan and it helped. To add a 'squirrel fan' would help me out even more. I'm not sure why my son calls it a squirrel fan, but he explained that it was just a card with fans on it.

Cleaning out the computer with compressed air also helped.

I hope you get it fixed. Nothing more frustrating that having a system that will try to boot up, finally does and then the screen goes blank! Well, mine had a black screen with dots all over it, in lines evenly spaced apart. Then the reboot problem would occur until I let it cool down.

Kay
 
  #25  
Old 01-27-03, 06:20 AM
richpatrick
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problem

Dude,

Does seem to be a power related problem of some sort. Did u have the power suply looked at or checked?

The Green to Amber light on the USB hub is an indication that signal was lost due to the power off situation your experiencing..
no big deal there.

I approach this kind of problem by trying to isolate what is causing the problem.

Try different stuff to see if you can get the "behavior" to change, and thereby isolating a contributing factor pointing you to a solution. Always leave your self a trail of bread crumbs, a list of what you changed, so after trying something you can adjust it back.

Have you adjusted the "power schemes" of the machine, and first try and shut all power saves, monitor shut offs... etc.. disable all that and see if that effecuates a change. Also check the BIOS to see if there are some power schemes in there also.

Also try a system diagnostic utility to run some tests on the system components. Good ones are available for free from
http://www.download.com
and check the Utility and Driver section for application(s) that will put your system through a "stress test" to see what/where the system is having a problem. My general feeling is that a chip on the MB (motherboard) is overheating, and causes you to loose the video first, then your unable to turn the system off, which seems like a hosed chip or video memory, i'm not so sure the CPU is the culprit. Also make sure the three populated slots in the machine are "seated" in their slots as well.

RichPatrick
lemme know how it goes. Good Luck
 
  #26  
Old 01-27-03, 08:27 AM
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Quantex you haven't said yet if you have opened the case or not. You need to open it up and at least blow it out with compressed air. It could be just some fuzz sticking to a fan or something. While you have it open, power it up and make sure all the fans are running right, not just running, but running at full speed. Make sure they are not making any noise. I still think you have an overheating problem. You say you upgraded the unit just recently, maybe you are not circulating enough air to keep it cool. If you upgraded your CPU and MoBo to a high-speed combo, you have to upgrade the cooling too. You may be doing more damage to that new CPU and MoBo than you think. I would try to get this problem worked out quikly. You don't want to overheat a CPU for long. Make sure the heatsink and CPU fan are rated for that CPU. If you're running anything over a 1Gh CPU, you need several Case Fans to circulate air, the front case fan and power supply fan are not enough.

I just had another thought, you say you upgrade the HDD, MoBo, and other stuff. Did you also upgrade the Power Supply? If you're running a high-speed CPU on a low-end Power Supply, you could easily be overheating all your components. You only have 3 PCI's and a 1.2Gh Duron, so you should be ok with a 300-W supply.
 
  #27  
Old 01-27-03, 10:10 AM
blkhawk1
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using xp pro, had monitor turning off while in use, had power settings to always on, never, never, never. went into power set to desktop 15mins all the way. problem stopped. went back to power reset to always on, never, never, never. problem has not returned for over a month now.
Blackhawk
 
  #28  
Old 01-27-03, 12:41 PM
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I have opened the comptuer just afterthe problem occured. I used a portable small vacuum to cleanse the comptuer of its dust within the fans and the chips.

**Also after the problem, I opened the comptuer quickly and found out that the components near the fans weren't emmiting much heat, I could not feel that much heat.

But, it still seems like an overheating problem due to the fact that I am unable to boot the comptuer after the problum has occured. I must wait awhile, maybe to let it cool -- which I am unsure of.

I thought that 114 F was hot for the comptuer, but I called up my comptuer retailer and he told me that that temperature is normal for my motherboard. EPoX KL-133M.

( richpatrick & SafeWatch ) Now, with the power...I have included pictures at this website http://ionx.netfirms.com/a/index.htm < the inside of my computer. I have a 1.2GhZ AMD Duron with 40 gigs and 608 MB RAM (+32 Video shared).
The 3 PCI ports are slugged into their slots firmly. I have double checked their grounds. The power supply and everything is stated in the images. When I got the new motherboard and everythign replaces, I am sure they put a new power supply in.

If you need any more information, please do so. Thank You.
 
  #29  
Old 01-27-03, 01:04 PM
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I couldn't really tell from the pics, but it looks like you only have the one Power Supply fan. It wouldn't hurt to add at least one more case fan (in the front by the speaker - make it at least an 80mm fan.) I'm pretty sure you don't have one, I don't see a wire for it or the fan itself.

Everything else looks pretty good. Just out of curiosity, who did the work for you when you had it upgraded? Wasn't a big name store, was it? It's very possible that whoever did the work for you Overclocked the CPU. They may have sold you a Duron 1Gh overclocked to 1.2Gh. Just a thought. You can get some software from AMD that will read the actual CPU specs for you. Or you could remove the fan and heatsink to see what it is, but there's probably too much therm on the CPU to read it anyway. BTW, if you try to do this be very careful with the CPU - touch the case to remove any static build-up before handling ANY of the MoBo's components.

Let us know what you figure out.
 
  #30  
Old 01-27-03, 02:16 PM
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Oh, I have just read the book to the motherboard and it says AMD Duron ~500MHz to 1.0Ghz and I have a 1.2 Ghz. But if it has worked well for 3+ months why do the problems start now?

Also, there are two fans in my computer, one for the processor and one for the power supply, but that's all.

The place I got my computer isn't really a big name brand. They have been reliable for most of my CPU needs. So I called them today and told them my problem. They said "It could be a virus, overheating, or powersupply." But they didn't mention "overclocking". Maybe I should speak to them about that, but I want to make sure before calling them.

Also, I'm drifting away from the idea that the comptuer is overheating. Just because when the computer had the problem just again, I turned it on 10 minutes after and cold air was blowing out from the power supply but it still would'nt turn on.

I would greatly appreciate it, if someone could send me a link to a stress test for my computer. I have looked but couldn't find a decent one.
 

Last edited by quantex; 01-27-03 at 03:16 PM.
  #31  
Old 01-27-03, 03:19 PM
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You definitely need another fan, at least one more. I have an Athlon 1Gh, and I run 3 case fans, plus the CPU fan, plus a PCI card fan that pulls the heat off the Vid card. Just because the Power Supply is cool, doesn't mean the CPU is. If it's not being cooled properly the CPU can heat up in a matter of seconds. The more applications (processes) you run, the hotter it gets too. I don't know about that board, but it could be that it has a fail-safe on it to shut-down when the CPU gets to a certain Temp. And the same fail-safe could keep the computer from starting until the CPU cools to a certain Temp. 10 min. is a long time, but I still think it's possible overclocking or heating problems (overclocking causing heat problems.)

BTW, if it were my computer and I had a board rated to 1Gh and they put a 1.2Gh in it, I would make them upgrade the board to a rated one. It's not that much difference, but it could very well be the root of your problems. It's possible the BIOS was upgraded to support a 1.2Gh. Check the Epox site to see if that board should have a 1.2G on it or not. Maybe even write their Tech Support to see if they have heard of similar problems and if they have any suggestions.
 
  #32  
Old 01-27-03, 03:37 PM
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I am assuming you meant KT-133M, not KL-133M (as there is no Epox KL-133M.)

According to the Epox support site this processor is not recommended for this board. Page 4, 3rd board listed. Only up to the 1Gh is recommended. This may be an old list, however. I still suggest asking Epox tech support what they think.
 
  #33  
Old 01-27-03, 07:00 PM
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quantex,

If you want to put your processor to work at maximum load, try the setiathome data cruncher of radiotelescope data. www.setiathome.ssl.berkeley.edu
the client will run the processor at maximum load so long as nothing else is trying to use it. This will also produce maximum heat in the processor.
 
  #34  
Old 01-27-03, 07:23 PM
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Thanks SafeWatch. I meant KL-133M. I viewd the file, and you are correct. My board dosen't support that, so they must of overclocked it. But If it has been working great for the past 3-4+ months, why all of a sudden does it act up now?

Also, chfite, is there a reason to let my processor build up heat?

Thanks.
 
  #35  
Old 01-27-03, 07:27 PM
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I was just mentioning that it would heat up when running at maximum performance. In case that might be a problem, or you were not otherwise aware of it.
 
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