CAT -5 cable splicing

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  #1  
Old 01-02-08, 06:10 PM
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CAT -5 cable splicing

I was recently assigned the task to relocate a CAT-5 line from one point in an apartment to another 10' away on the same wall.After 15 yrs in the electrical industry this is the 1st time I've had to do this kind of work.I already have the new cable ran in the wall. My question is can I simply cut back the jacket strip each of the conductors & wirenut them to the new run {color for color of course}.Or do I have to crimp an end onto each end of the cable using a coupling at the existing cable and a new male end at the new jack location. I do know that there is a coax/CAT-5 combo jack for each room in the apartment and all are homeruns to a main patchpanel & splitter. Unfourtunately the ceiling in the apartment is inaccessible so running a new line is not possible.Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
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  #2  
Old 01-02-08, 06:25 PM
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The appropriate solution is to run a new cable. If I found someone had taken either of the shortcuts you propose I would insist that it be redone properly.

Do it right, or don't do it at all.
 
  #3  
Old 01-03-08, 11:58 AM
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Do it right or dont do it at all....Something my father & two of the best contractors in the Philly area always taught me. And if it were up to me & the construction of the building allowed I would run a new line. Unfourtunately other than at the existing jack location the only place I have access to all of the cable runs is in the drop ceiling just above the entry door to the apartment.
 
  #4  
Old 01-03-08, 12:26 PM
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Then don't do it at all.
 
  #5  
Old 01-03-08, 12:46 PM
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Although I would prefer it thats not an option either. My original plan was to run a peice of wiremold the 10' or 12' {from point A to point B} straight run & use a prepared cable.But my boss told me the new resident doesn't want to see any wires or any evidence of a wire along the wall.....period. You'd probably understand if you'd see the way they do things in this facility...pennywise & dollar foolish....dont do it right just do it fast thats the facilities directors mottos {whos above my boss}
 
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Old 01-03-08, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by racraft View Post
Then don't do it at all.
Well now, that won't solve his problem. Will it?

ampz;
If your only option is to splice it, then you have no choice. Crimp connectors to the cables and connect them with a splicer.
 
  #7  
Old 01-03-08, 01:49 PM
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Then don't do it at all.

You don't have to do work that is sub standard. You can find different work.
 
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Old 01-03-08, 01:57 PM
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ampz;

I doubt you'll be giving up your job in this tight market, (more bad advise) so here's what you can do. Splice it and tell your boss that if there are problems, that's why.
 
  #9  
Old 01-03-08, 02:14 PM
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I would crimp to rj-45s on each end of the cable and use a 1 to 1 coupler. I have seen this done at work before, only in an accesable area though.
 
  #10  
Old 01-03-08, 02:17 PM
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I would put a cat 5 jack (not plug )on each end of the cable you want to splice and join with a short (factory made )patch cord .

don't crimp plugs on the cable

not the best but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do

leave a cover plate on the splice for later access if problems creep in

(do it right and I'll bet it would still certify cat5 )
 
  #11  
Old 01-03-08, 02:18 PM
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Are you using the cat 5 for phone or computer? If it for phone, you can splice it.
 
  #12  
Old 01-03-08, 02:20 PM
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This is why you should not splice - there will be problems with the signals that CAT 5 needs to carry.

http://www.softprose.com/proposals/ethernet.html

If it were my house - I might be tempted to put cable ends and connector in between ( same theory as a patch connector). The connection would have to be accessible so there would be a blank plate.

Of course if I was paying someone to do this - I would not accept this. If I found it I would suspect the quality of any electrical wiring.....

Buy them a wireless router.
 
  #13  
Old 01-03-08, 03:55 PM
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Thanks to all for the great support. If miss responding to any specifics I apoligize. As far as I know it will be use for phone and computer. As for me "looking for other work" is out of the question for many reasons most important of which is my newly adopted daughter. I was considering leaving the original end on the original line crimping a new male end onto the cable I ran & using a coupling & then crimping female end for the new jack location. I also thought of soldering my connections, would that improve the continuity?
I would also like to let everyone know that shortcuts are not something I do everyday in fact I have to repair alot of them done by the original contractor over 25 yrs ago. And there are some serious code violations not just an improperly spliced comm. cable
Thanks for the help
Rob
 
  #14  
Old 01-03-08, 04:18 PM
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for voice it doesn't matter are you saying one cable for voice and data ?

for data maintaining the twist is the key

you shouldn't be crimping anything
 
  #15  
Old 01-03-08, 04:29 PM
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You can also beanie the wires together and have useable results. The key to either beanies or RJ connectors is to keep the exposed wiring as short as possible to maintain the distance between twists.

And, of course, make the junction accessible.
 
  #16  
Old 01-03-08, 08:35 PM
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not the best but will work

leaving the jack on and crimping an rj45 on the new cable u ran will work may not be the best idea but it will work and will keep the cat5 integrity of the cable
 
  #17  
Old 01-03-08, 08:56 PM
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I'm no expert, but I have run a lot of cat5e/cat6 wire in my house for voice and data. What's wrong with using an RJ45 female to RJ45 female inline coupler at the end of the original cable as long as it remains accessible for replacement? Between the computer I'm on now (at home) and the router connected to my DSL modem, there are five different cable segements (one run in the walls/attic and four patch cables) that are terminated on each end by a RJ45 plug or keystone jack, and three ethernet switches (I put a small switch in each room in case I need to connect more than one computer in the room to the network). There's also a patch cable between the DSL modem and first switch, another between the DSL modem and the wall keystone jack where the DSL line comes in, another cable segment between the wall and the telco NID, and another patch cable in the NID on the outside wall of my house. And that's just the number of "splices" between the NID and my computer. My network is very reliable. I can't see how "splicing" a new wire in by using an inline coupler would be a problem for the OP, especially if this is near the "end" of the run to a single workstation. Sure it would be better to replace the existing wire with a new home run, but if he can't do it, he should be okay with an inline coupler from a quality manufacturer.

Regards,
Ira
 
  #18  
Old 01-04-08, 04:25 AM
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The Cat 5 spec says the cable must hold tolerance up to 100 meters (328 feet) between devices. By splicing the wires or adding couplers, you reduce the maximum distance. This shouldn't be a factor in an average home, where the length of run from computer to router is usually less than 50 feet.

The twists in the pairs help reject noise. Noise can cause errors in the data stream, which usually manifests as a slow connection. RJ jacks, plugs and couplers -- and beanies -- interrupt the twists. If the joint is next to an AC line, fluorescent ballast, or other EMI generator there could be problems. If the splice is 12 inches or more away from any other electrical devices, you should be fine.

Still, as others have said, it's best to have an uninterrupted home run from computer to router.

Ira, routers and switches buffer the signal, which means they re-generate the signals rather than simply passing them on. Every time you insert such a device, the distance measurement starts over.
 
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Old 01-04-08, 08:43 AM
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I had to make 5 splices to a phone cable (cat 3, 3 pair) to be able to get data out to my existing shop (not attached) I was trying an easy fix for an otherwise impossible problem. I now have phone (one pair) and data (two pair). Went to speedtest.net to see how poor the cable would perform. In the house computer next to the modem and router, 1400kbps. In the shop, 1400kbps. Again 5 splices, I just spliced with wirenuts, using cat 3 cable. It is a non factor! It may not be the "best option" but it is the only option. Splice away.
 
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Old 01-05-08, 09:43 AM
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seems like a jack and plug would be best, logically. You have just one connection. 2 plugs and an inline connector is the equivalant of 2 connections. Same with 2 jacks and a patch.

And as others have pointed out, alot of applications have many connections. Even in commercial applications, you often have a patch cable from switch to patch panel, run to another patch panel, than another, then run to an office, than a patch to the pc.

Racraft must work in a lab. Real world situations are often like yours. As Gunny Highway said "improvise. Adapt and overcome." (Heartbreak Ridge)
 
  #21  
Old 01-05-08, 10:08 AM
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Racraft is an engineer (so am I) and we tend to be perfectionists.

I had a data gathering system that used an rs-485 connection working over a mile on 26 gauge twisted pair telephone lines. It was supposed to be impossible but it worked fine.
 
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Old 01-05-08, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Tolyn Ironhand View Post
I had to make 5 splices to a phone cable (cat 3, 3 pair) to be able to get data out to my existing shop (not attached) I was trying an easy fix for an otherwise impossible problem. I now have phone (one pair) and data (two pair). Went to speedtest.net to see how poor the cable would perform. In the house computer next to the modem and router, 1400kbps. In the shop, 1400kbps. Again 5 splices, I just spliced with wirenuts, using cat 3 cable. It is a non factor! It may not be the "best option" but it is the only option. Splice away.
cat 3 rates at 10mbps your only using 1400kbps so you have a lot of room for degradation ,

even a broadband connection is less than the 10mbps that cat 3 rates at so a degraded 350mbps cat5 connection will function just fine in a most applications
 
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Old 01-05-08, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by furd View Post
Racraft is an engineer (so am I) and we tend to be perfectionists.

I had a data gathering system that used an rs-485 connection working over a mile on 26 gauge twisted pair telephone lines. It was supposed to be impossible but it worked fine.
being a perfectionist is one thing , spouting textbook absolutes with no real world experience to back it up is another
 
  #24  
Old 01-05-08, 02:26 PM
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I think you misinterpreted what I am suggesting. If I were paying for wiring, I would never accept a splice of any sort, buried or in a junction box, in-line or with RJ-45 connectors.

Further, I would not work for an employer who would not do the job properly. It;s true, we are not talking about a life threat issue or anything, but I would not compromise my integrity and my craftsmanship to save a few dollars, especially if it were not fully disclosed to the person who has to actually use the end result.

Yes, I fully understand cost concerns, and I understand how some people cannot simply quit a job because of one particular issue.

And I further realize that despite what I or anyone else think,s there are people who will do work in a manner that is less than I consider acceptable.
 
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Old 01-05-08, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by racraft View Post
Yes, I fully understand cost concerns, and I understand how some people cannot simply quit a job because of one particular issue.

And I further realize that despite what I or anyone else think,s there are people who will do work in a manner that is less than I consider acceptable.

I would say that MOST people cannot just quit a job because of one issue. Where I work you either do it thier way or you look for another job. Most places I have worked have been this way. Keep in mind the OP was not trying to launch the space shuttle, just trying to give a tenant internet access. It doesnt mean he doesn't have integrity, It means he works in the real world. IMHO
 
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Old 01-05-08, 03:58 PM
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Some jobs, such as this type of retrofit, make it impossible to "do it right" without major demolition. For many it's not an option at all, for others it's not a financial option.

As a professional I avoid work that is not up to par if it's cause someone's just being cheap. But I'll do what I can for someone on a budget, such as fixed income, but I let them know it's not the best thing.

I also bend if I have to for someone who gives me lots of money every year. I'm not going to tell a loyal customer to stuff it if that's what they really want done. I may argue, but I won't walk away from the good ones.
 
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Old 01-06-08, 05:52 AM
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I've found that the easiest way to make sure a job is done right is to hire someone who guarantees their work. The last thing an installer wants to do is come back at their own expense to repair their own work.
 
  #28  
Old 01-06-08, 06:27 AM
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Why does everyone have to make this so complicated. ampz's boss wants him to do this, and he's not about to quit his job because of it. Just give the poor fellow a couple options and leave it at that.
 
  #29  
Old 01-06-08, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by oneofamill View Post
Why does everyone have to make this so complicated. ampz's boss wants him to do this, and he's not about to quit his job because of it. Just give the poor fellow a couple options and leave it at that.
Correct. And the correct fix is to crimp on two RJ-45 plugs and use a double female to connect the two together, and have them inside a box with sufficient slack, and a cover plate accessible for future repairs.
 
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Old 01-06-08, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by oneofamill View Post
Why does everyone have to make this so complicated. ampz's boss wants him to do this, and he's not about to quit his job because of it. Just give the poor fellow a couple options and leave it at that.


exactly he came here for some suggestions on the best way to deal with a bad situation he had been handed

splicing cat5 isn't prohibited by code (don't confuse codes and standards ) doesn't pose a hazard of any type worse case there will be SOME signal degradation but probably not a enough to be noticeable (and as I mentioned earlier if done wellthe cable can still certify cat5e)

he is here because he wants to do the best quality job he can given the circumstances lets do what we can to help
"don't do the Job " isn't helping
 
  #31  
Old 01-06-08, 12:34 PM
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and as with any "less than perfect because the customer is willing to try that rather than spend the money to do it right" install,

disclaimers solve the "freebie" repair. Tell the customer it costs $$$ to do it right. When they moan and groan and say they can't (read: won't) spend that much money, the alternative comes up with the disclaimer: it may very well work just as you need BUT since it is not to industry standards, it may not. If it doesn;t work as needed, then you have two choices; live with it or pay us to come back and install it as it should be but I will be more than happy to try it this way first is you want to try.
 
  #32  
Old 01-09-08, 06:24 PM
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Well the work is done I crimped a male RJ-45 onto the end of the new cable used the female from the old jack {it used a snap in combo catv/rj-45} and used a blank plate{accessibile} at the old location. I then crimped a new female connector for the new jack {also a snap in}.The line is for a computer & phone, thats it.
Thanks again for all the support. I would also like to say that I strive to NOT DO any work HALF ASS but when left with a decision to get this {non-critical} job done & move on to the next and keep the facilities dir. happy that work is getting done then thats the way I will call it. If this was matter of life safety and/or building integrity then you can belive I would not have done it {job loss or not}.
It became obvious to me that the new residents {for which the work was done} are not mechanically inclined,you could hand them a piece each of shielded cable & cat 5 & they most likely will not tell them apart.All they care about is that it works well enough.
If Bob {racraft} would not accept any splice of any type he would hire a data/comm co. to do the work or do it himself...hey whatever floats yer boat I would be the exact same way when it comes to electrical work.
 
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Old 01-09-08, 07:04 PM
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Glad you got it done. Now we can put this to rest.
 
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Old 01-09-08, 08:43 PM
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That's the way I woulda done it, under the circumstances. Onward ho.
 
  #35  
Old 01-10-08, 07:04 PM
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I think this will be fine. I am a bit confused, however, that a single CAT5 line will be used for both computer and phone. I can only think of three ways this would be configured:
  1. It is a standard phone line that will be used for a phone and dial-up modem.
  2. It is a standard phone line that is used for phone and a DSL high-speed modem.
  3. It is 100Mbps data line to a router that will provide network connectivity and voice over IP.

In the first two cases, a splice would work just fine as both are standard phone line connections requiring fairly low bandwidth.

The third and most unlikely case is the only one that would have any sensitivity to impedance mismatches in the cable run, as it is a full 100Mbps data connection. The impedance mismatch at the splice could be kept to a minimum by splicing carefully. A time domain reflectometer (TDR) could be used to test the impedance over the entire line, if necessary, to see if the splice introduced any aborations which would degrade performance.

The OP's ultimate solution will work just fine for all three cases. In many office environments, there is a long run from the server patch panel to the office wall plate. There is a cable from the switch to the patch panel that can be 5' to 10'. There is a cable from the wall plate to the computer that can be up to 100'. Adding one additional interconnect should not noticeably degrade performance.
 
  #36  
Old 01-11-08, 08:49 AM
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knavekid;

The problem has been resolved.
 
  #37  
Old 01-12-08, 04:49 AM
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Maybe so, but it's still good info to know.
 
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