Ethernet Connections (Splitting)

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Old 05-21-11, 08:11 AM
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Ethernet Connections (Splitting)

I need to split the ethernet connection coming out of my cable modem in order to branch off to my Bluray player. Do I need to use some sort of special hub to do this or can I simply use a two-way RJ45 splitter (like the telephone type)?
 
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Old 05-21-11, 08:22 AM
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You can't just split the cable like a phone line....you'll need a simple router. You can get them for as little as $20.

Modem connects to router, router connects to player and PC. No setup...just plug everything in and turn on.
 
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Old 05-21-11, 08:29 AM
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Actually not a router but a Ethernet switch or an Ethernet hub. network hubs and switches explained at HomeNetHelp.com
 
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Old 05-21-11, 08:48 AM
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Ahem....not to argue....but....
"In contrast, neither hubs nor switches are capable of joining multiple networks or sharing an Internet connection. A home network with only hubs and switches must designate one computer as the gateway to the Internet, and that device must possess two network adapters.."

Third paragraph from here...Router vs Switch - What Is The Difference Between a Router and Hub or Switch?

Sure it could be done with a hub or a switch...but its more work. And if you walked in most retail places...they'll give you a funny look if you ask where the hubs are, but take you right to the routers.
 
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Old 05-21-11, 08:48 AM
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I have a wireless router located next to my PC and my cable modem is in the basement, which is why I need to split the ethernet cable in the basement and run one line to the router and the other line to the Blu-ray player. I'm preferably looking for a passive hub (i.e., one that I don't have to plug in), but it's important that the Blu-ray player not only connects to the internet, but can also communicate with my PC for file sharing. Can I connect two routers together in the same system (one in the basement for splitting the signal, and the other (wireless) router upstairs by my PC)? I may just move the wireless router to the basement. Only reason I have it upstairs is for optimal signal strength throughout the house, but I think it will be fine in the basement.
 
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Old 05-21-11, 08:59 AM
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Probably over my knowledge level...but why not connect to the router you already have?

I didn't know they had BR players that would talk to PCs like that...I haven't been in the market for one for quite a while.

Gonna have to let one of the tech gurus weigh in maybe?
 
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Old 05-21-11, 10:35 AM
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I've always used a switch or hub to set up multiple computers on a network. Very simple plug it in and its done. I have been able to access drives on one computer from another and the Internet independently from each one.

What AT&T and I suspect what most ISPs call a modem isn't a modem. It is a single port router. This single port router contains the gateway not either computer. If the so called modem is where you set up access to the internet then it is really a single port router.

I have used a real modem where you run PPPOE software on your computer and in that case yes one computer is a gateway. I doubt though you will find many real modems anymore.
 

Last edited by ray2047; 05-21-11 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 05-21-11, 08:24 PM
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Probably over my knowledge level...but why not connect to the router you already have?
...because I need to run the Blu-ray ethernet connection through the basement and up through the wall to my entertainment center. The router is currently on the same floor, so I would have to run the cable to the wall, down into the basement, then back up. I might as well just move the router to the basement, which is now what I plan on doing.
 
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Old 05-25-11, 10:50 PM
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So you are saying then that your blu ray player can connect to the internet right? Well I have heard of those but I have never seen one. Apparently it connects with an ethernet cable. Well in that case wherever your router is you should have it fairly close to where your router is. I just wonder though is it possible that this same player might have wireless capabilities it sure would save you some work and if not is there a possibility to connect something like a wireless dongle? I think I would consult the manual again and if you have lost it many manufacturers allow you to download a copy and save it to Adobe Reader. With Adobe Reader you could then quickly search the manual. If not in the manual then I would still call the manufacturers toll free number and ask someone first. Also as an alternative you could run category five wire from your router to your blu ray player and find an empty spot on it. Most routers including Verizon FIOS have multiple connections. You need two router boxes and smaller router cables to connect point A to point B and you need to go to an electronics specialty store. I see by your location that you are in Northern Virginia so I think I know just the place for you. There is a place in Beltsville Maryland called Mark Electronics they are not a chain store and have only one location but they have experts there to show you what you need and how to use it unlike some unnamed stores I will not mention that really don't have as much as they used to. So a bit of a drive for you but you will not be disappointed. I think they have a website too still but I am not sure. Been there twice once when I wanted to extend my network wired from a computer instead of wirelessly and one time to buy a new antenna as ours blew down. They even knew of someone who could install it so I didn't have to go on the roof. You will not find better service anywhere. Just remember though runing the network wire is the easy part getting the box wired is a bit harder and you have to keep track of the wires so it is a bit tricky but can be done. I had to wire one box twice so they are difficult but not impossible. Also one other note Mark Electronics is a bit hard to find just remember it is near train tracks, they can give you better directions. Good luck to you.
 

Last edited by hedgeclippers; 05-25-11 at 10:56 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 05-28-11, 10:41 AM
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Blu Ray player only has a wired ethernet connection. There is an optional wireless USB adapter that can be bought, but running a dedicated wire is no problem at all. Plan is to simply move the wireless router into the basement utility area and branch off of the router--one line to my PC in the room above, and one to the Blu Ray player in the family room. I've been making my own cables, so that is not an issue. Thanks.
 
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Old 05-29-11, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Gunguy45 View Post
Ahem....not to argue....but....
"In contrast, neither hubs nor switches are capable of joining multiple networks or sharing an Internet connection. A home network with only hubs and switches must designate one computer as the gateway to the Internet, and that device must possess two network adapters.."

Third paragraph from here...Router vs Switch - What Is The Difference Between a Router and Hub or Switch?

Sure it could be done with a hub or a switch...but its more work. And if you walked in most retail places...they'll give you a funny look if you ask where the hubs are, but take you right to the routers.


Originally Posted by ray2047 View Post
I've always used a switch or hub to set up multiple computers on a network. Very simple plug it in and its done. I have been able to access drives on one computer from another and the Internet independently from each one.

What AT&T and I suspect what most ISPs call a modem isn't a modem. It is a single port router. This single port router contains the gateway not either computer. If the so called modem is where you set up access to the internet then it is really a single port router.

I have used a real modem where you run PPPOE software on your computer and in that case yes one computer is a gateway. I doubt though you will find many real modems anymore.
Just to clarify on both of your points, it depends on what type of hardware the ISP uses. DSL and fiber use PPPoE, which requires a login and password to connect (even though you don't notice it, DSL and fiber are actually 'dialing in' each time there is traffic on the network, it's not technically 'always on') . USUALLY these providers use an off-the-shelf router to do this, so that there is little or no configuration and no software installation required on the computer. Ray, I know Verizon still issues a stand-alone modem for their DSL that plugs into your phone jack, and it is up to you to either install their software or buy a router and set it up as the gateway. With fiber providers, the actual 'modem' is the gray box on the side of your house. Since the router is the only actual hardware that people see that connects the computers to the jack on the wall, they call the router their 'modem'.

Cable modems are a different animal. DOCSIS is an always-on system that doesn't need a gateway or software to log in. You just plug it in and it works. In most situations, they simply issue their WAN IP to the ethernet port, and if you connect directly to the computer, that is the IP that the computer takes. Using a hub/switch in this instance will cause nothing to work. Some of the newer Motorola Surfboard modems do have limited router capabilities that can be enabled by the ISP. If you purchase your own, Linksys makes an actual router with a cable modem built in that works very well. They have a DHCP server built in, and as such anything connected to its ethernet port will receive a 192.168.1.xxx IP address. THESE modems CAN use a switch because the modem will hand out separate IP addresses to each device.

As someone who does computers and networks for a living, I ALWAYS recommend having a router, regardless of the capabilities of your modem. It's an extra layer of security against no-gooders. Nothing will stop a determined pro that you might've pissed off, but don't leave the front door wide open for them. Make them work for it.
 

Last edited by JerseyMatt; 05-29-11 at 04:14 AM.
  #12  
Old 06-06-11, 04:47 AM
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my 2 cents is to use a device called a wireless bridge. it's a small wireless device that you can use with any wireless network to make any ethernet device, a wireless device. they are cheeper used, or refurbished. this is what they look like

NetGear WNCE2001-100NAS Universal WiFi Internet Adapter - 2.4 Ghz, Ethernet port, USB (Recertified) at TigerDirect.com

that help??

ps: i agree with ya JerseyMatt, NAT does a great job of protecting but as you know with ipv6 were trying to ween off of tha NAT because not only does it protect us, it protects the goonies too lol
 
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Old 06-06-11, 05:27 AM
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Originally Posted by vergeofimpetus View Post
my 2 cents is to use a device called a wireless bridge. it's a small wireless device that you can use with any wireless network to make any ethernet device, a wireless device. they are cheeper used, or refurbished. this is what they look like

NetGear WNCE2001-100NAS Universal WiFi Internet Adapter - 2.4 Ghz, Ethernet port, USB (Recertified) at TigerDirect.com

that help??
He's got ethernet right there.. Why would a bridge help him? He needs a router.
 
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Old 06-06-11, 05:43 AM
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well if subject really wants to run cables everywhere, i guess. that device requires only that you connect it to your router, then plug it in the wall next to your device, then connect one short patch cable to the devices then it's on the network with the rest of your devices. eliminating the need for an additional router all together.

in otherwords whatever is plugged into the Ethernet port on the bridge is "actually" repeated on the wireless network that you paired it with. it bridges protocols... wired to wireless.
 
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Old 06-06-11, 05:58 AM
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I know how a bridge works. It is totally unnecessary for this application, seeing as the OP is asking how to split WIRED. The only thing wireless is good for is your laptop. Anything to do with video or gaming should always be wired. It also wouldn't eliminate the need for a router, since you still need the router to hand out IPs on the LAN.
 
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Old 06-06-11, 06:35 AM
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ok... you do connect to the router ,...wirelessly ....so you get ip's too.

wireless n and even g CAN stream hd video nicely, you know how i know??? because i can do it on youtube and that is way slower than local networking speeds you need to turn on QoS on your router, and it will stream better, although gaming is different, it's bi-directional instead of just a stream when gaming. it's best to forward correct port ranges when gaming.
 
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Old 06-06-11, 06:49 AM
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Wow. Youtube. Thats some high bandwidth right there. And for the record, G can't handle HD (unless it is compressed to sh*t by a codec like FLV which is what youtube uses). It doesn't have the bandwidth, especially if two or more G clients are connected. Know how I know? I know how wifi works and how much bandwidth HD video requires. Wifi was never designed to handle streaming video. It was designed for the intermittent traffic of web browsing.

And please explain to me how port forwarding helps the lag that wifi introduces into your gaming. I'd love to hear this one. Does it make the packets warp instantly to your location, negating the lag?
 
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Old 06-06-11, 07:14 AM
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wifi uses udp but with cs/macd which only uses up a small portion of it's throughput. if it wasn't designed for video then why are their wireless hd surveillance cameras? but your half right, in the ab standards, wireless wasn't designed for it but with emerging technologies now it is possible, it say it right on the box, and QoS implementation helps ridiculously when it is enabled inside the router.

and i said port forwarding but i guess it's all the same concept that will allow you to route external (Internet) calls for services such as a web server (port 80), FTP server (Port 21), or other applications through your Router to your internal network. it is a direct pass-through and with QoS it gives packets a sort of priority or distinction on the network. you can also usually manage traffic by assigning certain types of traffic to certain ports, that saves bandwidth.
 
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Old 06-06-11, 07:59 AM
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.....uhhhh....., I think I'm fine with what I have. I'm going to relocate the wireless router to the basement next to the cable modem, then branch off the router to my PC and my Blu Ray player with wired connections. Thanks
 
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Old 06-06-11, 08:11 AM
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Ok, this is my last post on this subject because you've pretty much derailed the thread at this point.

First, 54Mbps is the theoretical maximum for G. When you factor in the TCP and security overhead, you're looking at about 34Mbps max. Then if you have multiple clients, the bandwidth is divided and the overhead is increased. So two clients would get approximately 12Mbps each, four clients would get approximately 5Mbps each, provided they are right next to the radio. As the distance and interference increase, the speed is decreased to compensate. And then remember, these are maximum numbers. The sustained throughput is going to be lower.

Second, "HD" is a term that is getting attached to more and more junk from China. It's a buzzword that they are attaching to any camera device that has 1440x720 resolution to make it sound better. But you have to realize that it's simply a 1 megapixel camera that is sending medium quality MJPEG video. It's not exactly bandwidth intensive, and nowhere near what true HD streaming video requires.

Third, port forwarding has nothing to do with QoS or priority or saving bandwidth. Its only purpose is to open up holes in your firewall for specific services so that they can be seen from the internet. It's not even necessary to do it manually, because of uPnP. This allows the programs to automatically open the ports they need, eliminating the need for you to do it automatically. Assigning traffic to certain ports does absolutely nothing to save bandwidth. A bit is a bit and it takes up the same amount of space no matter what port it is going through on the router. I have no idea what you are saying it is the 'same concept' of, because there is no 'concept' that eliminates the lag introduced by using wireless devices. But don't bother answering because I don't feel like adding another junk post to this thread to tell you that you're wrong.

Oh, and in a home environment with a cable modem, QoS does not 'help ridiculously', it does absolutely nothing unless you do things like run torrents without leashing the client.
 
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Old 12-24-11, 10:16 AM
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I relocated the wireless modem/router to the basement and everything works fine except I can't get a good wireless connection upstairs (two stories up). The laptop says the signal is good but surfing is extremly slow if at all possible. So, I need to split the wired signal in the basement and put the router back on the first floor. All of the replies to this thread have confused me. What do I need? A hub or a network switch? To reiterate, I need to "split" the ethernet connection in the basement--one line will run across the ceiling and up to the bluray on the first floor, and the other line will go to the office jack on the opposite side of the house and connect to my wireless router. I will need simultaneous internet access from both locations and would like to have the full bandwidth available at both locations. What do I use to "split" the ethernet connection. FYI, I have a cable modem with one ethernet output which currently connects to my wireless router which has one input and four outputs.
 
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Old 12-24-11, 11:14 AM
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I nave a one port router and when a boarder need an Ethernet connection for his Roku video player it worked fine running the router to an Ethernet switch and running both the computer and his Roku video player from the Ethernet switch. His video player did suck up bandwidth. I had to tipple the bandwidth just so I had reasonable speed on the computer.
 
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Old 12-24-11, 01:25 PM
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I wired the whole house and found it better to just take an ethernet cable with me in bed than to deal with the slow speed of my wireless.
 
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Old 12-25-11, 12:14 AM
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Originally Posted by mossman View Post
I relocated the wireless modem/router to the basement and everything works fine except I can't get a good wireless connection upstairs (two stories up). The laptop says the signal is good but surfing is extremly slow if at all possible. So, I need to split the wired signal in the basement and put the router back on the first floor. All of the replies to this thread have confused me. What do I need? A hub or a network switch? To reiterate, I need to "split" the ethernet connection in the basement--one line will run across the ceiling and up to the bluray on the first floor, and the other line will go to the office jack on the opposite side of the house and connect to my wireless router. I will need simultaneous internet access from both locations and would like to have the full bandwidth available at both locations. What do I use to "split" the ethernet connection. FYI, I have a cable modem with one ethernet output which currently connects to my wireless router which has one input and four outputs.

As much as I would have liked to chime in on the discussion earlier, it is probably best that I didn't. To answer your question, my recommendation would be to keep the modem/router in the basement and run a single cable up to the first floor. At the first floor set up another wireless router (they are cheap for basic ones anymore) and from there you can run a cable to wherever you need since there will be an additional 4 ports and you can have the wireless access point in the middle floor of the house. This should increase your signal strength and at the same time accomplish what you need with minimal effort and cost. You may have to play with the settings a bit to make sure you can communicate between both networks but this should do the trick. It has been a while since I have daisy chained routers so you may need to set it to bridged mode to fully accomplish this. (Ensure the router you buy supports changing the mode from router to bridge, I would think most of them do, but I do not know the settings in every router out there.)

Alternatively you could just buy a wired only router and use it in the basement and then place your wireless router on the first floor instead of the new one. This would allow you to ensure your wireless router supports bridging and would save from disabling the wireless (if you wanted to) in the router next to the modem.

Hope this helps.
~Spike
 

Last edited by Spikester; 12-25-11 at 12:16 AM. Reason: Add stuff
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Old 12-26-11, 07:44 AM
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Something like this?...

Amazon.com: NETGEAR FS105NA Switch 5Port Metal: Electronics

...oh, and I guess I should mention that my router is currently located about 2 feet from my main electrical panel. Could this be causing connectivity issues? How far away should it be?
 
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Old 12-26-11, 08:02 AM
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That is what I have been suggesting from early on and have used in a similar situation.
 
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Old 12-26-11, 11:05 AM
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Sorry Ray, I haven't revisited this thread in months and didn't bother reading through it again. I picked up a Cisco switch today and so far so good.
 
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Old 12-27-11, 04:29 PM
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...not so good now...I can only use one device at a time. I realized this once I tried to stream Pandora from my DVD player and it said there was no internet connection. I rebooted the modem and the new switch (5-port fast ethernet switch) and then the DVD player was able to connect. However, I then lost my internet connection at my PC. So I turned everything off (DVD player and PC) and rebooted the cable modem, ethernet switch, and router, then rebooted my PC. Internet at my PC is now back but the connection at my DVD player is disconnected again. Is this how an ethernet switch is supposed to work (one device at a time), or am I having some type of a hardware or IP address conflict?
 
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Old 12-27-11, 06:08 PM
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I was told by Cisco that the reason it won't work is because the switch doesn't have DHCP capability. So the way I have it connected (modem->switch->router) will not work. My question is then, how do I get this configuration to work? Do I need something different than a switch?
 
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Old 12-27-11, 06:10 PM
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You should be able to run multiple devices at one time.
 
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Old 12-27-11, 06:21 PM
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I thought I would be able to, but apparently the only way to do so is to connect the switch after the router, which is not what I need to do. I need to split the internet signal coming from my modem, one to my blu ray player and one to my wireless router. How do I do this!?
 
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Old 12-27-11, 06:24 PM
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Modem>router>switch. I use this configuration and it works well for me with multiple computers, networked printer and VoIP telephones.
 
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Old 12-28-11, 07:48 AM
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I spoke with the IT dept. at my work and they said I could use the router from my previous ISP as an access point. Do I need to use a crossover cable if I am connecting two routers or will a straight through cable work?
 

Last edited by mossman; 12-28-11 at 09:01 AM.
  #34  
Old 12-29-11, 05:24 AM
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Straight through cable works. I configured my old router as an access point and everything works as planned. Only problem now is that I can't seem to access my access point's (repurposed router) configuration menu now that I changed the settings. I believe I initially accessed it using 192.168.1.1, which I then changed to 192.168.0.2, rebooted the modem, and now I can't access it (neither 192.168.1.1 or 192.168.0.2 works). Also, when I do an ipconfig, the default gateway is now blank. How do I determine the new IP address so I can access the router if it is no longer listed?
 
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Old 12-29-11, 05:53 PM
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You have them on different subnets...
Set router to 192.168.1.1 and 192.168.1.2 for access point.

You may have to use the reset button to make these changes if it has somehow blocked you out.
 
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Old 01-06-12, 09:55 AM
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I tried talking to the access point again a few hours later with 192.168.0.2 and connected successfully. Blu ray player, PC, ipad, and laptop all have simultaneous internet access. Thanks everyone.
 
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