Ledgers .... should i take the concrete plunge or freestand it ???

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Old 06-09-10, 09:34 PM
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Ledgers .... should i take the concrete plunge or freestand it ???

Ok guys heres my dilemma . . .

Its my first time building a deck , but I am proficient with carpentry tools and such , and have all the toys to do the job . … just never framed a deck.
The deck will be 20’ wide along the house and 16’ deep . on one of the furthest corners away from the house will be a octagonal shape like you see in the attached sketch . I plan on putting 4 or 5 footers along the very end of the deck , and was planning on attaching the 20’ ledger board to the house .
If you have a sharp eye , you can see below the French doors that I don’t have very much room to work with … in fact, after I regrade the soil close to the house, I will have about 14” from the ground to just below the French doors. I plan on using 2x10 framing so I can span the entire 16 foot depth of the deck .
So ive realized I will have about 2” of ground clearance  .
Anyways, since I don’t have the houses rim joist to tie into, that means ill need to attach the 2”x10” ledger board to the hollow masonry block ! and NO , I don’t have access to a crawl space or basement to get to the other side of the masonry so I can sandwich the concrete with another 2x10 on the inside of the house . it’s a fireplace room on a slab… part of the garage.
ive read article after article on this , and everyone has a different opinion :
- Drill the ledger board holes to the concrete block’s mortar joints
- Fill all the concrete block’s hollow voids with mortar (I don’t think so)
- Drill all the way through the brick and attach another 2x10 on the other side of the block(cant, no access )
- Drill into the hollow spot and use HILTI brand epoxy anchors
- Don’t drill into the brick and just make the deck free standing by adding another row of footers , 3’ from the house and run them the whole length of the house and just cantilever(girter) the deck frame.

Im beginning to think the only hope is the last option. maybe im reading too much and ill be fine with the second last option though (epoxy anchors) .

Anyways , it just worries me to have about half the weight of this 350 sq ft deck is being held up by 15-20 anchors and glue ….

Should I just call the county office and ask them ?

Well, just for reference , the french doors in my photo will be dead center with the middle of the deck , unlike the picture of the sketched deck . Thanks in advance and I hope someone can help






HERES A FREESTANDING OPTION I HAVE IF I FEEL ITS NOT SAFE TO PUT IT IN THE CONCRETE BLOCKS. . . NOT BAD, JUST MORE DIGGING
 
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Old 06-10-10, 03:29 AM
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As low as it is, by all means, free stand. We don't have that option where you walk on the deck at grade level and by the time you cross the deck, you are 20 feet off the ground. Mountains. The less you drill into your house the less possibility of leaks you will have.
 
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Old 06-10-10, 03:47 PM
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woodbutcher80,

Your attachment problems would become nitemares. Make the thing free-standing.

As close to grade as you are, I wouldn't try to get joists to sit on top of the beams. Install the beams (level, of course!) and HANG the joists between them. Doing it that way, your beams need to be set at a level that will become the bottom of the decking.
 
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Old 06-13-10, 05:13 PM
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thanks for the advice guys . well i rototilled today and will regrade it to squeeze a few inches more out of it, but still grade it so the water will fun away from the house. if i use 2x10 joists and 5/4 decking ...that would leave me a total height from bottom of joist to top of decking of about 11.5" right? just want to think about how much clearance i should have from the soil to the joist(ground clearance)... i dont want any critters (skunks) living under the deck if i make the deck 3" off the ground... then again , i was just going to lay landscaping posts down right up against the deck to plug the space anyhow ... so i can put a mulch bed around it and landscape .
i dont know ....

i talked to a reputable deck building company and they said they would plug the ledger right up to the concrete block ... no worries with the right epoxy anchors. . .

LEFTY , now you got me thinking freestanding would be better.
now, in regards to mounting the 6x6 posts so theyll be on the outside of the joists .... :
1. is that common for low decks?
2. what would be the advantage of that aside from more 6x6 post being exposed out of the ground?
i would still need 11.5" or more of clearance, regardless of how the posts attach.
im confused !
 
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Old 06-13-10, 06:34 PM
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woodbutcher80,

I'm looking at the picture of the back side of your house. I'm seeing concrete blocks that are 8" tall, pretty much up to the bottom of the siding and they are only a little above grade. That doesn't leave a lot of space under where this deck is going to be. I wouldn't use 2X10's for the joists. the bottom side of them is going to be VERY close to grade. I would use 4X6's for the beams, 2X6's for the joists and get the wood as far above the dirt as possible. That will mean an extra beam, and and extra row of footings to reduce the joist span. 2X6 DF or SYP at 16" OC will span 10'. Go that route. Get the wood as far as reasonably possible above the dirt.

You have told us that you location is "USA" -- that could be anything as far as frost is concerned. IF frost is an issue, then taller joists and beams will mean fewer footings. That is certainly a consideration. But, without frost in the picture, smaller beams and joists and more ground clearance will win everytime.

As far as keeping critters out from under the deck, USE SKIRTING!!
 
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Old 06-13-10, 06:55 PM
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sorry about that . thought it had my city listed.
im east of cleveland ohio , smack in the middle of 125" of snow every year (more than buffalo) .

frost is a concern and it is required to go 42" for footings.
hope that info helps. heres the deck plan i am doing. i bought the blueprint plan for 30$ .,.. kinda nice to get an idea of footers ,etc . it also came with a triangulation page to help with footer distances , post to post distances, etc.

again , the original picture of the back of my house is deceiving. the grade looks high up on the concrete below the french doors because of the mulch bed there. i rototilled that and will remove a bung of dirt. until then i wont know how much height ill have .
i really would like to keep it to 2x10's so it can span that whole 16' from the house. but ill do what i have to do .. just trying to make it simpler on me since its my first deck build .
i guess the blueprint's measurements below would still work with it being feestanding instead ...

 
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Old 06-13-10, 07:07 PM
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as for footers...
they need to be 42" deep . i was told to save money on concrete to take one 80lb bag per hole, mix it up , dump it in 42" down , let it set up for a couple days , lay the 4' tall post and backfill around it with dirt.

i called my local building department and they said thats allowed and i dont need concrete pillars sticking out of the ground .
when i brought this up to them over the phone they said , "whats the difference? either way the posts will be on concrete below the frost line " ... guess hes right .

when i was told to make the posts go down to the bottom of the holes and backfill around them it sounded like a great idea... seeing how i would have some wiggle room to inline the posts better if need be ....
what you think ?
sorry , i know ... too many questions. just like to learn before i dive in .
 
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Old 06-15-10, 08:40 PM
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ive decided to free stand the deck . i burn firewood, so i may stack some pieces (50 or so) along the house on the deck once winter hits. . . so ill feel more safe with 3 beams close to the wood rather than a ledger.

i line leveled out 16' from the house and ill have only 14" from the bottom of the threshold to the ground . thats it . so with 2x10's ill be 2" from the ground . . .
that ok ??????

im going to cantilever (sistering) the deck 2 ' over on both ends so i can keep the three posts by the house atleast 2 feet from the house foundation. also itll make sure there wont be any spring in the middle of the span since itll only be 12' now instead of 16'

any input?
 
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Old 06-16-10, 04:25 AM
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I'll stick my nose in again until Mike wakes up. He's on the left coast. Saving on concrete isn't in your best interest. What will you do when the post rot out? Not a pretty scenario. Make the footings complete, install a PB on top and install your short posts. Should anything go wrong with the wood, at least it will be above grade and can be corrected without having to dig up your entire footer. 2" from the ground is what you have. That's not ideal, but better than sitting directly in dirt. You need air circulation, and you should be ok. Hang in there, Mike will chime in shortly with better suggestions, I'm sure.
 
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Old 06-16-10, 05:55 AM
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well ive already decided that backfilling around a 4x4 post is dumb since ill be freestanding and i dont want to add to the wiggle effect .

im just going to make the concrete pillars and be done with it .

just need to think of the BEST layout for the 6 footers and start digging!

i need to think of things in my head , and the image of where the footers are on the sides of the footers is still unclear. i know i want to hang the deck over 2 feet on the ends parallel to the house and the other one furthest to the house... but need to draw up the 2 other sides and make some measurements.
oh and heres a big one... if im making the beams flush with the joists and decking.. theres NO WAY of me cantilevering the deck towards the house is there? the house was built in 1988 , so i know the house backfill has settled. i just wanted to make it easier on me to dig the 3 footers along the house. the posts need to rest on the beam .

everything else aside from the layout seems like itll be straight forward and learn as you go .

oh and another thing . . i rototilled all the grass... do i need to put landscape netting and some small rocks to keep the weeds out?
i would think YES but its funny since a lot of how to books dont even mention it. i was going to anyways, its cheap .
 

Last edited by woodbutcher80; 06-16-10 at 06:11 AM.
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Old 06-16-10, 08:23 PM
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The best way to do the footings would be to dig down to the 42" depth, fill the bottom 12" of the hole (by however large it has to be square), then set a length of sonotube on the wet concrete (tall enough to get it above grade) and fill that with concrete, backfilling around the outside as you go. Once you have it above grade, install the post or column base in the wet concrete. NOW let it sit a couple of days befor you start building the deck on the footings. Do each of the footings this way, one at a time, so that your concrete is done in a monolithic pour -- no cold joints! This way you have no wood below grade -- no earth-to-wood contact.

I would also look hard at using smaller joists and beams (either 2X6 and 4X6 or maybe 2X8 and 4X8) and install a few more footing to reduce the spans. The more footings you put under a free-standing deck, the more solid it will be. If you use the larger framing and fewer footings, it's going to be more apt to have some sway in it. Of course everything is going to have to be cross-braced in both directions as well, and that will eliminate sway.
 
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Old 06-16-10, 09:09 PM
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i guess your right Lefty ....

3 more footings in the middle isnt going to be the end of the world . . . so then i would have 9 total holes on the main deck roughly: 3 by the house, 3 away in the yard, and 3 down the middle of the deck parallel to the house.

ok , now the real puzzler is this...
since i AM free standing the deck . what is the best approach to make the deck IF I ONLY HAVE 14" OF HEIGHT TO WORK WITH ????
i dont see how anyone can butt a freestanding deck up to a house without pouring the footers right next to the house foundation.... aside from cantilevering it ..
i understand the height thing is an issue... and if i didnt have it , i would simply put 3 rows of 2x10 beams and tie in 2x10 joists and call it a day .... but i cant do that .


Lefty ,
before you said :
"Install the beams (level, of course!) and HANG the joists between them. Doing it that way, your beams need to be set at a level that will become the bottom of the decking"

can i do that and cantilever the deck 2' away from the house to keep the posts away from the house foundation?
i just cant picture that working .
any help would be much appreciated. i have until july 30th to complete this project and ill ive done is rototill
. the lady is having some friends over to show off her new deck
 
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Old 06-17-10, 07:13 PM
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woodbutcher80,

Welcome to the world of low level (also spelled E-X-P-E-N-S-I-V-E!!) decks!! You're beginning to see why the cost more.

With only 14" of ground clearance, you're going to have to set the beam closest to the house as close as the house foundation will allow you to. (That foundation is probably an upside down "T" -- wider below grade what you see at the surface.) Build the beam before you put it in place. Through bolt spacers onto the house side of the beam and then attach a rim joist to the spacers so that the rim joist is about an inch from the foundation wall of the house. That will give you something to attach the first couple of deck boards to. Don't rely on nails or screws to build the beam with -- THRU-BOLT IT!!
 
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Old 06-17-10, 08:40 PM
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Lefty,
i wish i had a visual for what your describing . . . i kinda need that to figure it out.
the only other thing i was thinking might work would be to run the beams perpendicular to the house.
that way the footers can be a couple feet away from the house and the beams would extend to the house. the decking would run the other way but does that really matter anyways???
ive been to 2 decks this past week that had decking running perpendicular to the side of the house.
 

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Old 06-17-10, 09:25 PM
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woodbutcher80,

I'm just not computer literate enough to draw you a picture and post it!

Beams perpendicular to the house would work, but then your deck boards will run that way as well. (Your joists would be parallel to the house.)

PM me a phone # where I can FAX you a sketch -- that would work!
 
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Old 06-18-10, 12:02 PM
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It looks like you have a couple of obstacles to overcome. The simpliest solution maybe to just build a patio. I tend to prefer patios since they have less maintenance issues.

I'm looking to add a 3 season room which would have a ledger on hollow blocks. Most contractors voted for the epoxy or acrylic fasterners, while I originally wanted to cantilever it in. I haven't made a decision yet.
 
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Old 06-18-10, 04:04 PM
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well i had an epiphany .

im going to run (3) 2x10 beams perpendicular to the house(6 total 2x10's for the main deck) . there will be 2- 2x10s sandwhiching 3 posts each, along the depth of the deck and there will be a 2' overhang of the beams towards the house. so in other words, 3 double-stacked beams running the 16' . i will have a single 2x10 rim joist running along the house and itll tie into all the main beams . the same applies for the beam out furthest from the house.
my floor joists will comprise of 2x10s.... but since i am keeping the floor joists flush with the main beams theyll tied into the beams with hangers and the max length of each beam is 7' or so . thats where the EXPENSIVE comes in with all the hangers!
there will be 13 posts holes all together on the main deck: 11 spaced evenly and 2 in the lower right corner to tie into the octagon .
i think im gonna make the deck 22' wide (entire length of room where deck is) and make it 22' deep from the house.

does this make sense to anyone?
ill have a drawing soon . i know , the decking will be perpendicular to the house, but hey .. at least i wont have to have footers right next to the foundation .

progress............

side note: i called a well digging company- since we still have well water- and asked him if he could mark the well water line to the house since its in the path of all my footers... he said 100$ to come and mark them.... sounds pricey. no? just to mark a dang 1" water line? i know i need it done... just wanted to know the norm for pricing.
 
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Old 06-18-10, 04:32 PM
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Call Before you Dig 800 number in your local phone book. It is a free locating service to keep you from cutting power and phone lines. If you have an energized line in the ground they can locate it for you.
 
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Old 06-18-10, 04:52 PM
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well i called ohio utilities protection service Home | Ohio Utilities Protection Service
and they said they didnt see a company water line .. but found my telephone and electrical line. .
my assumption for not finding a water line is easy : ITS PRIVATE . no company give me my water.
when i talked to the well drilling company they said there should be a line run along the pipe.. im assuming he means the well pump electrical line thats run with the 1" water pipe? no idea. if thats the case, anyone with a meter can pick it up no?

well in the mean time i sent out an APB to the call before you dig and OUPS again to see if someone can come out here again .
otherwise i have about 5-10 other places to call for quote. its just marking a dang line ... grrr
 

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Old 06-23-10, 08:21 PM
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dont know if anyones reading this post anymore, but ill post updates as i go .

again , im going to run beams perpendicular to the house- at least 3 of them ... but was thinking of 4 . the deck will be 22' wide so i dont know .
anyways, im almost done grading the decking area so i can use a full 2x10 beam and joist to fit under the threshold . ..lowered the grade 5". just have 1/3 of the deck area left to do . used the left over dirt behind my dig site where i used to have a above ground pool that i removed.... had some rain puddling so i filled the spots in .

then its time to mark the post holes.

only thing im worried about is that im cantilevering the beams 2' past the posts on the beams shooting towards the house. i cant cantilever the joists since that would mean i would need to put the joists ON TOP of the beams and i dont have room for that.
in other words, the only thing supporting the decking 2' from the house and closer would be 4 double 2x10's (beams) .
im sure itll be ok ... just a though . most of the in theory its pretty much the same thing as cantilevering joists but less since ill only have 4 double beams supporting the 22 feet width.

heres a pic of the diggin so far
 
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Old 06-24-10, 04:36 AM
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Oh, yeah, we're reading the progress every day. Any cantilever you have will have to sit on a beam. Otherwise it wouldn't be a canti"lever". So I'm not sure if you are planning on having the joists run away from the house and over beams, thereby allowing you to cantilever it or not. You will need space to install a rim joist on the ends of your main joists, so keep that in mind. You can to that and slide the whole thing in place and fasten on top of your beam.
 
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Old 06-24-10, 04:57 AM
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chandler..

no , the beams WILL run away from the house. i was just going to extend the beams 2 feet past the closest footers to the house. so the beams will end up going towards the house and about 3" away from the block foundation , and then i was going to cap the BEAMS with a rim joist. of course ill have no room , so ill have to mount the rim joist on the main beams and then slide the frame closer to the house.

whats messing me all up is the clearance . you have to remember the beams are FLUSH to the joists , therefore i cant do it traditionally resting on top of the frame.

i know a true cantilever is the joists HANGING over the beams towards the house... but to hang over beams you need at least the clearance of the beam height AND the joist height... that which i dont have .

ill draw up a picture here soon and scan it. the very end closest to the house will be the main beams FREELY hanging 2 feet with a couple joists run with the house to support the unsupported hang . hope it make sense....
 
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Old 06-24-10, 05:00 AM
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a good way of seeing what im doing running along the house would be to look at the FIRST DRAWING of that computerized picture . the first pic of the post.

look at the LEFT SIDE of the deck from our view.... thats what im gonna do to the area next to the house.

you kinda have to rotate the deck 90 degrees clockwise in the pic.
 
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Old 07-01-10, 08:31 PM
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ok , everything on the main deck is laid out perfectly and ready for the one man auger this saturday.
the octagon is good to go , all squared and everything .

my question is this :
i have 19" to work with from the top of the 5/4 decking to the grade . . . how should i make the octagon frame if i plan someday of putting a hot tub on it?

so far, i was thinking tripled 2x12's on each of the 2 beams, and running 2x10 for the outer octagon frame and 2x10 joists.
that would bring me to 5" of concrete above grade, 11 1/4" of beam height and joist height, and 1 1/4" high decking.

i would have 8 12" footers 42" deep . i planned on cantilevering the beams further out than their corresponding footer holes by about a foot on each of the beams....

i would then have the other 4 footers not touching beams be on the outer frame edge of the octagon . i would run the joists flush as well .

would this be stronger that having triple 2x8s for the 2 beams and putting 2x8 joists ON TOP of the beams the traditional way ?
this way would also bring me close to the 18-19" i need for total deck height ( 3-4" concrete , beam height of 7 1/4, joist height of 7 1/4 , decking height of 1 1/4 ")

i guess if i knew how to calculate live load i could figure it out... i heard i need something like 100 psf for a hot tub!
i could also put a 16" footer in the middle somehow too .

i just want to know where to drill the footer holes by saturday .
thanks!Beer 4U2
 
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Old 07-02-10, 04:18 AM
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Others may work it differently, but I'd just put in a couple of extra holes and footings under where you plan on having the hot tub. Adding the extra joisting would be odd, and the footings would be solid support.
 
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Old 07-02-10, 01:19 PM
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well ,then ill keep it the same flush style as my main deck... but change it to 2x12's .

i was thinking... maybe one big 16" hole in the middle... but how would i support it seeing how the 2 main beams would be on either side of the middle.

well, i could just make the main 4 footers that the beam support be 16" instead of 12" , and the other 4 peripheral footers on the outskirts be 12" , maybe?

think im complicating things again....
 
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Old 07-02-10, 07:30 PM
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Yup. I have a helper who does the same thing. Wants to make a rocket swing when the customer only wanted a tire on a rope.
Why change to 2x12's? All you have to do is add support under the original joisting where the tub will be.
 
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Old 07-02-10, 07:58 PM
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yup im that helper !

anyways. i marked out all the footings tonight.

theres (8 footings as of now) .
if you looked at it like a square (how its laid out with batter boards) , the 2 footers on the left and the 2 on the far right will all be on the outer edge of the octagon frame.
the two up top and the 2 down low (closest to main deck) will be set in 2 feet per hole . this is supposed to be max cantilever of beams past footers for a octagon shaped deck... and i also wanted the 4 footers as close to being under the hot tub as possible .

i was going to change to 2x12's cus i can , and its not like a need a ton of them . plus ide rather have 2x12 framing (2" taller than 2x10s) than just adding 2" more inches of concrete footer coming out of the ground and 2x10s for the frame and beams.

heres the thing .
i have 19" to make this thing, and i want to make it as strong as possible . im not having posts, as i will place the beams right on the footer caps on the concrete.

so heres what i have for height if i used 2x12s :
5" concrete comin out of the sonitube
1 1/4" tall footer cap to hold the beams
11 1/4" high triple 2x12 beams and hung flush 2x12 joists 16oc
1 1/4" decking
-------------
thats 18 3/4" .. just where i need to be

the REAL question is this... what would get me 100psf that is recommended for hot tubs? i cant find a calculator anywhere.

keeping the 8 footers ALL 12" would help, as i wouldnt have to hand dig as much as i would have to with 16" footers since my well water line is close by and 35" down .

i can change anything you suggest. .. but as of right now, the holes are not moving, and they will be dug at 12" in diameter tomorrow when i rent the hydraulic auger.

i can switch to 2x10s if need be for the joists and just leave the beams 2x12.. just need to make up for the 7" height rise this octagon will be compared to the lower deck... since i want to step up onto the octagon .

ok ... ill stop now
 
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Old 07-06-10, 04:09 AM
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footings dug. thanks to all who responded to my Qs
 
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Old 07-07-10, 11:33 AM
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Ground level decks SUCK. I built a 2 level one a few years ago 22'x12' 9 holes like you.

one section was 2x6 with a double beam in the middle supported on 2 piers (no posts). so the unsuported span for the 6" section was only like 10.5'. the rim joist was also doubled and supported with 2 piers. Then the taller section the one that you walked out onto was 2x12 supported on the rim joist with 3 piers and bolted using a ledger. with joists all perpendicular to the house.

it was a PITA because you have to get the concrete perfectly level for all of them, and you'll find, even if you don't use the tube for the whole depth (maybe only the top 1' or so) that the concrete will pull it down so if I can recommend anything it's that make sure your tubes are absolutely anchored, so you can almost stand on them , before you start to pour. Because there's no going back after concrete and you have to work rather quickly as you can imagine. When using posts this is a non issue as your post height can be very easily adjusted (circ saw :-) ) And get a water level. or laser but I don't trust lasers over long distances, though I'm no pro it's simple, a water level doesn't care if you're measuring 50' or 5" it's accuracy is not affected by distance unlike a level that pivots from a single point. Though I'm sure you could rent a HIGH quality laser level and get good results.
 
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Old 07-07-10, 06:57 PM
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ya .
my quik tubes are 4 feet tall, and stuck in the ground from 38"-42" per code (42" is code but he didnt measure exactly) . i bought a tamper at home depot for like 30$ and it only had a 42" tall handle so it wasnt fun to slam it down in the hole to pack the clay bottom .

i returned it and made my own out of a treated 4x4 and 2 handles for a shed . . .
worked great ! nice and tall and i could adjust the handles to the right stand-over depth .
i packed in 9 of them today and leveled and straightened. i have 13 on the primary deck , not 9. 4 along the house 4 in the middle and another row of 4 except double footings on the corner that meets up with the octagon .

packed the dirt around the tube real good, and am ready to pour this weekend .

AS FOR A LASER LEVEL .. luckily ran into a buddy in the construction business and he has a real expensive one thats accurate to within 1/8" at 200 feet . works for me .
just going to stick it at the level i want the concrete footings to be and swing it over at the tubes and make a mark on the outer tube .
then drill a small 1/64th" hole on the mark and put a screw in the so it pokes out in the inside to keep the level proper for the poured cement.

ill let you know what happens .
 

Last edited by woodbutcher80; 07-07-10 at 07:32 PM.
  #32  
Old 07-11-10, 11:09 AM
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finally, all 21 footers are poured and ready for the 48hr drying period. 2 days, 88 bags later my back is sore... but the Kushlan did a great job in mixing the bags!

i have a story pole right next to the threshold where the deck will be under.. i aligned the CST laser level with where the main deck footers need to end up at height-wise.
then for the octagon-since it will be approx 6" of a step up from the main deck- i made another mark 4" higher than the main deck since the concrete footers need to be higher. it worked out to 4" taller footers + 2" taller beams (2x12s) would equal 6" rise when they butt up on the corner.
man i feel like a genius ! Beer 4U2 see if it works out when framing starts this week!
need to make a treated lumber shim for all the beams so they fit snug in the adjustable post base . my beams are (2) 2x10s , so thats 3" total thickness.... the post bases that will bolt to the footers are 3.5" wide- since theyre made to accommodate 4x4 posts. so i need the shim to be 1/2" thick . maybe some scrap board and just slap some wood protectant on it since it really served no purpose but to snug up the boards. ill think of something ....
 
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Old 07-11-10, 04:15 PM
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Home Depot sells treated 1/2" plywood.
 
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Old 07-14-10, 06:02 AM
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well i went up there today and spent 400$ on my beams... there is a 1/2" gap i need to fill in the post cap , and their ONLY treated sheet of plywood is NOT 1/2" , its thicker ... like 7/8ths . i walked around with some help there... so who knows.

the best solution i could think of was to buy 2 1x4s x8' long and just rip them to thickness using a table saw. one problem.... no table saw! i need 13 shims to be made so im not gonna use my miter saw or circular saw unless i have to .

need to find a buddy with one and use his !
 
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Old 07-14-10, 07:15 AM
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Building a deck without a table saw is going to be challenging I recommend you get one. Otherwise just use your handheld circ saw.

Did you use the one man post hole digger? How did that go? I was thinking of doing that for mine.
 
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Old 07-14-10, 07:46 PM
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There are a couple of solutions.

What you have on the top of your post is a BC4. Change that to a Simpson BCS2-2/4. (That's about the same thing, only it holds a double 2X beam on top of a 4X post --exactly what you have.)

Another would be to use EITHER a 1/2" x 4" piece of pine -- you'll find 1/2" thick material in the trim section of the store -- OR use a piece of 1/2" thick composite facia. Ever Grain and Azek both make their facia 1/2" thick, and there are others that do as well.
 
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Old 07-14-10, 09:15 PM
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the one man auger was nice, i needed it 2 days . i kept hitting shale and rocked and used my air chisel to chunk them up .
if you hit rock , youll know, itll shake like an uneven washing machine load. sometimes all it took was a slight cant or tilt of the auger and it would 'hook' and dislodge the rock from the sidewall.
get a couple 2" long x 3/8" thick bolts to use as shear bolts just in case something happens in the field. i broke my shear bolt twice.. but they were wimpy bolts.


Originally Posted by lefty View Post
There are a couple of solutions.

What you have on the top of your post is a BC4. Change that to a Simpson BCS2-2/4. (That's about the same thing, only it holds a double 2X beam on top of a 4X post --exactly what you have.)
.
that wont work since i dont have beams. these simpsons are resting RIGHT ON the footings . need to be bolted down and adjustable .
i just bought a 1x4 treated and ripped it to 1/2" thick at my buddys house with his table saw. worked great.
 
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Old 07-18-10, 09:19 PM
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framing is done on the main deck, just need to pop the joist hangers on and joists .

as for the octagon... well , the angles are going to be off. no 22.5 degree corners. the bolts in the footings are square so the decking will be no problem... but not all the angles will be the same. my guess is theyll all be from 22-30 degrees...

any easy way to find the angles? i havent a clue and treated wood aint cheap. i have an angle finder, but its more for to butted up boards, like crown molding ... NOT octagon angles when your going from one board to another thats 4 feet away!

thanks!
 
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Old 07-19-10, 03:57 AM
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Your camera broke????????????
 
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Old 07-19-10, 06:19 AM
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no, the ol lady had it yesterday at cedar point park so couldnt take any . heres a few from just now. rainy....

anyways , you can see that the octagon's 2 triple beams are overhanging their footings by about 18" .. well , look at the overhang of the beam side closest to the main deck, the other side going into the yard hasnt been cut off yet to size.

you can see the other 4 footing holes that are going to have double 2x12s in them to connect to the ends of the main beam.. hence an octagon .

NOW , the 4 footing holes that dont have beams on them are PERFECTLY square. diagonals are right on , etc . i squared the beams to them , so the beams are the same distance away from the outer footing holes.

THE PROBLEM lies within the end of the octagon that will butt into the main deck . the main deck's angled board took up 1.5" of room (and isnt dead on 22.5 degrees either..) , so now the first board on the octagon has to be a different size to make the angle to the exposed outer octagon footings.... make sense?

in other words, im bolting the first octagon side to the ends of the triple beams, but its length isnt 48" like i planned ALL SIDES to be ... it needs to be a bit longer, thus making the diagonal sides (4) a bit less... about 43" .
its ok , im not worried about it , no one will know but me . .. and maybe a pilot in the sky with an overhead view

anyways, ill just figure them out the hard way , start at 25 degrees and play from there. once i have the one , the others should be about the same.









 
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