Bollard (Bolt Down)

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Old 11-30-17, 03:31 AM
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Bollard (Bolt Down)

Can this bollard stop a car/truck going at 45 mph if installed on a driveway?

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Vestil-3...-5-5/205719789

I understand the "drop down" type can stop a car but what about the "bolt down" type? I found tons of test videos for the "drop down" type on YouTube but none for the "bolt down" type.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 04:01 AM
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While a lot depends on how/what it's bolted to, I doubt it would stop a speeding vehicle.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 08:36 AM
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A vehicle moving at 45MPH has a huge amount of kinetic energy, just think of the damage a vehicle would sustain stopped at a light and a car doing 45 hits it.

Short of a concrete barrier like between the freeway lanes there isn't much you are going to do to stop a 45mph vehicle.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 11:27 AM
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What exactly are you trying to do or accomplish?

Just to put things into perspective... a 3'000 pound car traveling at 45 mph has about 275'343 joules of energy or 203'085 pounds of energy. Your not talking thousands of pounds of energy, nor tons... it's hundreds of thousands of pounds. You will need a layered defense to stop a vehicle going that fast as it will be extremely difficult and expensive to construct one single item that can withstand all that energy. Take a look at highway barriers and how they use multiple posts, barrels and massive concrete barriers. The barriers ahead of a toll booth often have 20-30 feet of "soft" barrels or barrier before a very massive concrete structure. Often the face of the concrete block is shaped like a ramp to plow the vehicle over and out of the way.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 05:34 PM
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Posts like the one you posted are only for a warning IMO. An example would be placing them around a gas meter, you will hit the post before hitting the meter.
This will only alert you and is for driveway use at creeping speeds. Even at creeping speeds the post will probably bend and need replaced.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 05:49 PM
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Hi everyone,

Thank you for your replies.

Part of my garage is at a T-Intersection and if someone drives through it, it will hit one of the main foundation post. Although the neighborhood has been very quiet but on occasions, there are kids with their testosterone driving at unsafe speed. I have been here for 20 years and nothing yet. Recently, I have seen lots of incidents on the news where people drive through houses and restaurants. This bollard project came up because I can't remember one which but there was recently a terrorist attack where the vehicle was stopped by some bollards.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yv79MMj3y60

I have been parking my cars on the driveway to protect the beam and the guest bedroom. I might just be paranoid.

Thanks
 
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Old 11-30-17, 06:09 PM
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In order for a bollard to be as effective as the one in that video...... it needs to be set into the ground. There is no "bolt down" unit that could stop a vehicle like that.

There is also something hokey in that video. There are some type of straps underneath that vehicle that look like they help lift it.

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Old 11-30-17, 07:33 PM
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There is also something hokey in that video. There are some type of straps underneath that vehicle that look like they help lift it.


I believe that is the attachment point for the pull cable. You can kinda see it release just prior to hitting. I'm guessing the center of mass is just above the top of the bollard which forces the truck to try and curl over the post.

Regardless, the weak point on WRDIYs post is either the bolts, which would easily snap with the inertia he is concerned about or the steel. The steel is just as likely to angle over just enough during the collision process to give the vehicle a bit of a launch into the home.
 
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Old 11-30-17, 09:08 PM
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I've never been involved in the process but you might want to fight the city for speed bumps.
You are right to be concerned, there are too many people in Cal that drive like maniacs. People are in a hurry to get nowhere.
The speed bumps are effective for slowing down speeders. I've also seen people put out their own signs (purchased), like "children at play".
 
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Old 11-30-17, 09:20 PM
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"...there are too many people in Cal that drive like maniacs."
It's not just in California. Saw a segment on the local news where someone hit a support post and displaced several families in an apartment house.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 12:28 AM
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I imagine a couple of these anchored to 8' cubes of reinforced concrete would stop a car...
 
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Old 12-01-17, 12:47 AM
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Originally Posted by PJMax
it needs to be set into the ground.
I agree as mentioned in my original post. I guess I was just hoping there would be some good news with: "There is no "bolt down" unit that could stop a vehicle like that. "

Originally Posted by Handyone
I've never been involved in the process but you might want to fight the city for speed bumps.
I have and the problem is that other neighbors will fight against it because it will bring down their house values. I have thought about moving and finding a new house in a cul-del-sac but I have put so much into this house.

I was working with the police department last year. They left the big speed meter on the street for 3 months. I took many pictures of speeding cars and sent those images to the police officer. They would come out and give the drivers warnings.

However, why should I be doing their job, especially one day, I know an angry idiot neighbor will be pissed and we will confront each other. So far, many home owners know that I have been very active in fighting this speed thing. Neighbors next to me love my contributions but they won't step up because they don't want confrontations with the rest. I am fighting the battle by myself.

The street that leads to my garage can reach speeds up to 45 mph because of the short distance. I only see fast driving once in a while. But the street that cross it can reach speeds up to 55 mph and I have caught many pictures and sent to the police. This is not even a main road but a residential street.

Originally Posted by Handyone
there are too many people in Cal that drive like maniacs.
Tell me about it Sir and I agree. I have even seen idiots on this street where they just stopped right in the middle of the road and started to text.

Anyway, here is another one with cables:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zp85-dBwslE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAkCypsQIQk

Anyway, I think the solution to this is to either move or continue to leave my cars on my drive way.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 01:05 AM
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What is the speed limit on the road towards you (the one where the speed demons drive)? They have speed "humps" also that are perfectly fine to drive over at the posted speed, but if you try to do 10-20 mph over and yer gonna get bounced.

Your neighbors are idiots...did they explain HOW reducing the speeds would lower their property values. To me all speed bumps say in a residential area is "We care about people and children more than your schedule".

I have to agree with the Cal drivers statements...so could you kindly keep them on YOUR side of the state line and out of my little town? lol
 
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Old 12-01-17, 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Vic
I have to agree with the Cal drivers statements...so could you kindly keep them on YOUR side of the state line and out of my little town?
LMAO Vic.

The speed limit for residential area is automatically 25 mph even when not posted. That is straight from the horse's mouth "police officer and the police chief". My neighbors are idiots. Their houses are even more exposed than mine because some of them are on corner lots.

You and HandyOne have motivated me enough. I will talk to the city again next week.

BTW... the product that you posted above, isn't that be the same as the bollard that I posted? Both are bollards and bolt down, right?
 
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Old 12-01-17, 02:08 AM
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Well, yes, they are both bollards and bolt down...but the one I posted is anchored with probably 7-8 8'-10' long 3" bolts into several feet of concrete and steel as well as pilings that reach into the ocean floor and you can moor an aircraft carrier to them. Notice the 100TON on top? That's the stress they can take before starting to fail, when properly installed (they also make up to 250 ton). A carrier would normally be moored to 8 of those or equivalent. I'd say 2 anchored to the cubes of concrete I mentioned would be enough.

But other than those small differences...yeah, they're both bollards.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 05:08 AM
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You can petition the city or DMV to install a steel guardrail. I would imagine a car would have to drive through you house before they would be willing to act though. You could pay to have a guardrail installed.

You could have a series of telephone poles installed. They don't have to be full height and could be arranged like a landscape feature. At the coast I often see three or four right next to each other and of varying heights with some large rope wrapped around them for a nautical theme.

Have a landscape or grading contractor place a large rock in your yard. Just make sure it's not too round. You don't want someone to hit it and send it rolling into your house. I know it sounds stupid but rocks are very heavy. Even a medium size one could weigh several tons.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 05:37 AM
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You can buy or rent!


https://www.doityourself.com/forum/a...1&d=1512135448
 
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Old 12-01-17, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Pilot Dane
I know it sounds stupid but rocks are very heavy. Even a medium size one could weigh several tons.
It does not sound stupid and as a matter of fact, that is a very good idea.

The telephone poles would be in the same manner as drop in bollards. As for the guardrail, are you saying to put it in front of my drive way?

Originally Posted by Marq1
You can buy or rent!
OMG! You crack me up. I assume you meant to rent the tank, not the cement blockers.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 01:24 PM
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If a car shoots across the T intersection, then it goes right up your driveway? Or across your yard?
 
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Old 12-01-17, 01:49 PM
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It will go up the drive way.
 
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Old 12-01-17, 02:26 PM
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Yuck. That sucks.

How wide (roughly) is the driveway? Single or double car width? You could still use the boulders (or guard rail) on either side of the driveway and just leave an opening at the driveway itself. In that case, an approaching car would have to "thread the needle" to go up the driveway. And at high speed, and if trying to turn at the last second, they might not hit the driveway squarely, and will impact one of the barriers.

If the driveway is double width, you could try using some very heavy concrete planters on the driveway, offset on either side to create a slalom course. Now, you do run the risk of making your house look like it's in a war zone. But in places I have worked, we had similar set-ups. Offset barriers to slalom around, or a concrete barrier chicane, so you can't approach in a straight line or at any serious speed. And then some other security measures too. It's unsightly, but effective.

Behold, a crummy MS Paint diagram!
 
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Old 12-01-17, 05:03 PM
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Chicane, it's not everyday you hear that word
 
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Old 12-01-17, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by UltraSquirrel
If the driveway is double width, you could try using some very heavy concrete planters on the driveway, offset on either side to create a slalom course.
Ultra Squirrel, upgraded from Super, that is a very smart recommendation. I did not think of that.

How heavy would each boulder need to be and where would I purchase such boulder?
 
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Old 12-01-17, 09:22 PM
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Honestly, with the information provided, I can't say. When I start to do the math in my head, I see a whole lot of variables that need to be plugged in.

I also have to raise a couple concerns about this plan, including about my own suggestions. My career has had several facets. One of them involved stopping very bad people who were intent on coming to a place and doing very bad things to innocent people. And in that circumstance, if the bad people died when they slammed into a fixed object at a high speed... well, yeah. But another facet of my career has focused on improving vehicular and traffic safety. When I look at this plan in that light, I can't help but consider a different scenario. A driver fails to properly navigate the intersection and slams into a fixed object at high speed. There is a serious risk of life-altering injury or death. And that crash could occur as a result of their speeding, or of the driver's inexperience, or of the weather, or even a collision in the intersection which redirects a vehicle into the barrier. Potentially no fault of their own.

When I look at my crummy MS Paint diagram, I realize that it's that first facet of my career that came up with that plan, and I don't like it. Sacrificing a (relatively) innocent person's life or limb to protect property is difficult for me to justify. Plus, intentionally placing a large, fixed object at a place where it may be more readily struck could open you up to increased liability. I'm not saying that your life couldn't potentially be in danger if you're in or near the garage. And I'm not trying to minimize the emotional trauma, financial cost, and inconvenience of repairing the damage to the structure. However, that's what your homeowners insurance and the driver's vehicle insurance is for.

I can imagine how I'd feel in your situation. But I'm also imagining how I'd feel if my daughter struck a giant roadside boulder and died. Whether she was speeding or not, she will always be daddy's princess.

I'll see what I can think of for an alternative plan. Perhaps we could come up with something that could slow or deflect an approaching vehicle without imparting such a tremendous force to the driver.
 
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Old 12-02-17, 03:18 AM
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Thanks for your long reply. But to sum it up, whether if it is a boulder or currently my truck parked on the driveway, they can hit anywhere else or on another property that has another boulder. The result would still be the same.
 
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Old 12-02-17, 07:37 AM
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Yes, there are other fixed objects that the car could strike, but you're not the one responsible for them being there. What you put in your own driveway is generally your own business. But near the street may be much different. If it's within the city's right of way, they may have a problem with it. And I think you'd be quite peeved with us if you order a bunch of multi-ton boulders and have them delivered with a crane on our advice, just to be told by the city to take them out, right?

As for striking one of your vehicles, remember that your vehicles, unlike a boulder, have crumple zones which help dissipate and redirect some of the energy of the crash and slow the violent deceleration. Two "squishy" things hitting each other isn't quite as bad as one "squishy" thing hitting one non-squishy thing.

This is my moral issue, not yours, but I feel that there's a way to be just as effective, while also being safer for all involved. If you're still interested in ideas, here's what I have come up with. First, have you placed any sort of signs or reflectors on your property? Perhaps you or the city could put in some chevrons or other delineators, so that approaching traffic can more easily see that the road ends. It doesn't stop vehicles by brute force, but if drivers can see that they can't go straight, they may be less likely to accidentally overshoot the turn.

The next thought I had was, instead of large boulders, smaller rocks, partially buried in the ground, so as to create a "trap" that would high-center a vehicle. If it hits a stretch of rocks that stick up, say, 8-10 inches, the front of the vehicle may ride up and over the rocks and then get stuck on them. It would probably have to be a decently sized "arrestor pad" in order to make sure the vehicle has enough time to get caught, and not just hit once and bounce over. Again, the city may complain if it's in their right-of-way, but it's a possibility.

Then perhaps your next layer of defense behind them, as PilotDane said, could be a row of telephone poles or other wood posts, buried in the ground and extending maybe 1 foot out of the ground. I think they'd be effective, but also have more give than a boulder.

The "many layers of squishy things" approach is what's used on highways at toll booths, exit ramps, guardrail ends, etc. It's the sudden deceleration that's deadly in a crash, and the longer that deceleration has to take place, the less severe the forces, and the more survivable the crash.

How big is the distance between the street and the garage? And is there room to either side of the house to safely direct a vehicle away (and not into someone else's house), or would any barriers in the driveway itself have to absorb an impact and stop the car? I still think that planters in the driveway might be effective. They'll probably slide a little on the driveway surface if they're struck, which helps dissipate the force of the collision.
 
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Old 12-02-17, 08:32 AM
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Usually, the answer is to landscape the font yard with a couple of evergreens to block the headlights,
a couple of mounds of earth to block the car,
and a couple of big rocks around the house, if the other two fail to stop em.
 
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