Wall backing for commercial stove question ??

Reply

  #1  
Old 12-19-15, 07:22 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 3
Wall backing for commercial stove question ??

I put a commercial stove in our kitchen. I have checked with my insurance and dotted my eyes. My question comes to the surround behind the stove. In the wall behind the stove I have installed fire resistant batts, then covered the wall with 5/8" fire resistant drywall and on top of that a sheet of 1/8" 304 stainless steel. On the sides of the cabinets I have sandwiched the fire resistant between the cabinet and a piece of 304 stainless steel. Just getting opinions on if I have done a good enough job at prepping the walls?
 
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 12-19-15, 07:28 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 50,627
Likes Received: 112
Welcome to the forums.

It would appear that you have taken every precaution. Every appliance, especially a stove, comes with an installation guide book. Have you checked that for any special considerations ?
 
  #3  
Old 12-19-15, 09:30 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 3
I have read the manual. The problem and as to why I have gone to the extent that I have is I will not be able to follow the clearances it states. I have had the stove running this way already for at least 4 or ( months with the plaster that was on the walls originally. I currently have been installing the large range good to go with it so I have taken the opportunity to get the stainless and such. I think it will be fine. I just couldn't find any info on it so I wanted a second opinion.
 
  #4  
Old 12-19-15, 09:46 PM
PJmax's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Northern NJ - USA
Posts: 50,627
Likes Received: 112
I gave you my opinion but unfortunately the manufacturer's recommendations take precedence over that.
 
  #5  
Old 12-20-15, 02:27 AM
GregH's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 9,905
Likes Received: 3
Welcome to our forums!

I agree.
A device that has some form of risk attached to it has an approval based on being installed according to the mfr's installation instructions.
Any deviation from those instructions would require someone with authority to approve any changes.

You say you "checked with my insurance" but can't see how they would approve something not installed to mfr's specs.
An analogy to this is walking into your insurance broker's office to tell them you just installed a wood burning appliance and them telling you that is just fine.....which it is not unless the installation is noted in writing on your policy.
If they said it was ok you may not have given them the whole story.
 
  #6  
Old 12-20-15, 07:06 AM
Handyone's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: U.S.
Posts: 5,451
I just couldn't find any info on it so I wanted a second opinion.
Was applying the steel at the sides and back of the oven manufacturers recommendations, or did you apply this fireproof material in lieu of specified clearances?

Here's my opinion: The greatest risk of fire is vertical. A standard home range specifies a minimum vertical clearance of 30" to combustible materials (from the cooking surface).

I would imagine you have no cabinet above the range? Probably a professional hood?
This is something in your favor.

Many higher end home ranges now have at least one 30K BTU burner, and are safe at 30".
I don't want to compare that to your range, but I'm just pointing out new ranges, while not professional, are kicking up quite a bit of heat and no extra precautions are needed.
 
  #7  
Old 12-20-15, 08:14 AM
GregH's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 9,905
Likes Received: 3
The debate is not as much about whether alterations could make a device safe it's about what happens if you need to make an insurance claim for property damage or worse, personal liability.
IOW it's really about risk.
I can not imagine a contractor doing this without a written waiver by either the insurance company and/or mfr.

We try here to offer professional advice and it would be somewhat irresponsible for a professional to offer advice that differs from what is known to be proven safe.

Odds are all is good and it's likely ok but a diy'er needs to know and weigh the risks and then accept responsibility.
Not sure if a generalized diy forum is the place to gain knowledge for this.
 
  #8  
Old 12-20-15, 08:35 AM
Handyone's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: U.S.
Posts: 5,451
it would be somewhat irresponsible for a professional to offer advice that differs from what is known to be proven safe
True. I guess opinions don't count, I was looking at some good points. For all I know, a lack of a fire suppression system and/or improper clearances would fail this installation immediately as far as the insurance company is concerned, and then you have trouble.
 
  #9  
Old 12-20-15, 08:54 AM
GregH's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 9,905
Likes Received: 3
Everyone who diy has to accept responsibility for what they do.
There are area's that I work in where others could be impacted and in those cases there is no question about their safety or well being.

However, I also am a big fan of diy, and do many things for myself that are other than what the manual says.
I do it based on my personal knowledge and experience but try not to use that knowledge and experience when someone asks for advice that is other that what is in the book .
It is a risk that is totally out of my control and one I personally don't want to take on someone else's behalf..
 
  #10  
Old 12-20-15, 10:42 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 3
I appreciate everyone's comments and conversation. I totally understand everyone's stance on making sure and giving solid good advice. Before install I read a lot about insurance companies possibly denying a claim due to a commercial stove. So I called my insurance and stated that I was installing a commercial stove in my house. I asked if I needed them to inspect installation or what I needed to do. The girl was unsure but said she would call the underwriter and ask to be certain. Got a call back and was told the underwriter had no further requirements, or inspections needed but they did add a notation in the insurance that stated we had a commercial stove and they were informed up front. I feel insurance wise I have done what I needed.


There is no cabinet above the stove. It is approx 4' from the cook top surface to the bottom of a commercial grade vent hood. It has a double squirrel cage blower and a 6" discharge which it vented straight through the exterior wall.

The stainless was installed instead of the 6" clearance behind the stove like stated in the manual. I probably have around 3" instead.
 
  #11  
Old 12-20-15, 12:24 PM
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 635
Telling them you were installing a commercial grade stove, but not telling them you were installing it against the manufacturer's stated required specifications are two different things. I'd be willing to bet a large sum of money that their reaction will change if you call them back and tell them you installed it with half the stated required clearance.

The precautions you've taken, while admirable, will not suffice if the insurance company does an investigation if something happens. All they need is one little open door to deny your claim and they're gonna walk right through it.

It'd be like telling them you were having a propane heating system installed on your home, but not telling them the line from the tank coming into the house was a garden hose.

This is exactly the reason why, when we had our woodstove installed our insurance company gave me what was basically the size of a workbook to take home and fill out. I had to give them the exact clearance measurements to virtually everything, detail exactly who did the installation and provide their contact information and WETT certification number, specifically list exactly what I would be burning in the woodstove. I'm pretty sure, if anything ever happens and they determine any of that information is incorrect... We're gonna be out of luck.
 
  #12  
Old 12-20-15, 01:39 PM
GregH's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 9,905
Likes Received: 3
wildbill is correct and exactly what I was talking about.
I too have a wood burning furnace and if we ever have a fire I am confident in having full insurance coverage.
We too documented the installation with measurements and photos then sent them an update a few years later.
If an adjuster has to comb through the ruins of a fire everything will be in order.

We have worked too hard to pay for our home to have it taken away by a simple error in judgement.
 
  #13  
Old 12-20-15, 07:20 PM
Handyone's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: U.S.
Posts: 5,451
After reading posts 10 thru 12, there might be hope for this.
I would like to see if GregH agrees.
IF the only problem you have is the back clearance, 3" versus 6", it's time to interpret the instructions. By interpret, I don't mean get around the requirements, but ask for help from the manufacturer and insurance company.

- If the 6" rear clearance is from a combustible wall or cabinet, can this clearance be reduced (and to what minimum) when non-combustible walls are present?
- What constitutes a non-combustible wall?
 
  #14  
Old 12-28-15, 01:10 PM
GregH's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Manitoba
Posts: 9,905
Likes Received: 3
What I would take as a non-combustible wall is one that is fire rated.
Something like 5/8" "fireguard" drywall would be a non-combustible wall....For some applications it needs to be two layers of 5/8" FG.
You would need to look at the specific building code requirements for a particular region to determine what is required for this.
 
Reply

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes