UGHH!!! new vinyl windows and condenstaion!


  #1  
Old 11-03-04, 07:46 PM
sharvel
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UGHH!!! new vinyl windows and condenstaion!

Hello folks....I just replaced my old wooden double hungs with low e vinyls. I had a moisture problem before with the old windows. I was told with the new replacement windows......fogging,condenstaion is eliminated.....absolutly fasle BS there! I have just as much condenstaion if not more with the new vinyls! Some history....last winter I insulated with cellulose both in the attic and the outside walls.This summer I put on a new roof with adequate ventialtation which the home never had. I went with gable vents and put 2" vent plugs under my soffit every 2ft. It's roughly 38 degrees outside today and without a doubt humid. For that matter it's been a horrid summer here in western NY.....a ton of rain fall!!! My thinking now is possibly moisture from the ground seeping right through my concrere cellar floor.That being said what the heck can I do about this moisture on the inside of my windows???? The only thing I can possibly think of is a dehumidifier

Thanks,
Tom
 
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Old 11-03-04, 08:36 PM
L
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Don't blame the windows, at least not yet!!

(When you take a shower and the mirror in the bathroom fogs up, do you blame the mirror??)

What is your source of heat?
 
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Old 11-04-04, 04:50 AM
sharvel
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hot water baseboard is my heat source. Another thing I was considering is putting the old aluminum storms back up.Figure it could only help.right??

any advice folks?????
 
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Old 11-04-04, 05:02 AM
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I would try a dehumidifier. I think your heat source is causing the problem.
 
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Old 11-04-04, 05:26 AM
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Tom,

The root of the problem is that you do not have enough air change in your home which causes the moisture to build up to the point of condensing on your windows.

The first thing I would suggest is that you purchase a digital humidity guage so that you can monitor the humidity level in your home.
The next step would be to first try to eliminate sources of moisture and then plan on a way to ventilate your home.

One thing you can try is to leave the bathroom or vented range fan running 24/7 to reduce the moisture in your home.

Once you determine the actual humidity level in the home you then can make a judgment as to wheter or not the windows are the problem.
Modern triple pane windows should be able to handle an in house humidity level of at least 20% at -20 deg F. As the outside temperature increases the inside level should also increase without causing condensation.
There will be humidity recomendations in the window mfr's literature.
 
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Old 11-04-04, 05:56 AM
sharvel
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Thanks for the help Greg! I had a temp/humidy gauage I used last year to monitor the heat in the cellar. What was bizzare was it was less humid down there than upstairs. The temp difference is 15 degrees lower and and half the humidity in the cellar. Reason I was doing this was it was chilly down there! and wanted to find what the actual temp was. I only have 1 zone for the thermostat which is located upstairs. Before I insulated the house the cellar was the warmest room in the house. Now it's the coolest room which makes sense since the heat is kicking on much less due to the insulation. If I remember right the cellar was 20% humidity and the upstairs was around 40% . What the heck is causing the high humidity??? I have both kitchen and bathroom exhaust fans. I can't see running these 24/7 since that would suck my heat out which gets pretty costly here in western NY! My only guess again would be the ground causing the moisture. Seems I'm out of options at this point.......I've done everything to improve energy loss........insulation/ventalation,weatherstripping,chaulking etc etc. I've shaved my heat usgae down a good 1/3 of what I was using so I'm quite happy with that. My only concern now is the window condenstaion which I could live with only I fear rot eventually on the bottom sill.
 
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Old 11-04-04, 07:03 AM
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The windows, the insulation, the caulking, -- those things are doing their job of keeping the heat in the house. But they are accomplishing that by stopping air change. The lack of air change combined with the high humidity is what is leading to your condensation problems. A digital humidity guage will tell you what your actual humidity levels are in various rooms and on both floors. It's possible that simply circulating the air throughout the house may solve or reduce the problem. Beyond that, finding the source(s) of the humidity (I'm thinking the heat system could be a problem) and /or a dehumidifier may be the best solution.
 
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Old 11-04-04, 07:43 AM
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If you have sealed up your house tight then that would mean that you are generating more moisture than is able to leave the structure.
If you have exhausted (pun!) all avenues of moisture source, then the only thing you can do is either stop breathing while in the house, turn on the exhaust fan or install a heat recovery ventilator.

One more thing you can do is to lay a sheet of plastic on the concrete floor to test for moisture.

Again, regardless of the cost to heat your house, if you have sealed it up you will have to ventilate, or like I said, stop breathing.

Try the fan thing for a couple of days and see what happens.
 
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Old 11-04-04, 08:04 AM
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Wink

Like has been said here. For now Id get a dehumidifier.

I was told with the new replacement windows......fogging,condenstaion is eliminated.....absolutly fasle BS there! I have just as much condenstaion if not more with the new vinyls!
Have to ask here Low e but are they thermopane?
This also is why we try to use the aluminum type window all the time . The one that the outside part of the frame has a vinyl insert between it and the inside part of the frame. They dont sweat.
You said you had the storm windows Id but them back up .

ED
My .02 cents
 
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Old 11-04-04, 08:51 AM
sharvel
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Thanks to all for the support!.truly appreciate it! Ed the windows are thermo paned. It's an aluminum insert in a vinyl casement. I have to definitly agree with Greg with the sealing factor. This condensation really went into effect last year when I insualted. I went through the winter with poor next to no ventilation. This summer I tore off my old roof and ventialted properly. Those factors there alone you'd think I'd be on my way to better energy efficiency!
Like I said I'm happy to cut my gas bill by a 1/3 however mosit air and seems to be a fair amount obviously problems me.I'm going to try a few things....hopefully I get this sorted out!
 
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Old 11-04-04, 01:17 PM
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Thumbs up

You might want to kick it around for awhile. Years back went on a service call.Got the furnace running ok looked around and most of the windows water was running down the walls off the windows. The humidifier didnt work right and was putting water in the air in the furnace like mad. Told the lady about it and that I could fix it. She started in on me. No way was I to do anything to the furnace and humidifier. let it alone. She had 4 small kids and said this is the first year that she has not spent all her time and money at a doctor office with the kids. This year she had not had to go one time. So you figure it out

Ed
 
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Old 11-06-04, 11:59 AM
sharvel
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Just an update folks......... found my source or shall I say sources for the condensation issue I was having. 1st off I intruduced much cool humid air in the house the day I installed these. That same day my wife cooked up a storm without exhausting the fan. I also found leakage in my dryer vent pipe in the cellar. I fixed that easily. Had a pow wow with the Mrs. and stressed the importance of using the stove vent! ...On top of that I haven't been letting any more cool air in the house by ripping out my windows. Needless to say I have'nt seen a drop of water since!!! Again thanks to all for the support!
 
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Old 11-06-04, 06:43 PM
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sharvel,

Glad you found the problem(s) and got them corrected. Aren't you glad that the windows don't have ears and can't read -- they'll never know all of the bad things you were thinking and saying about them!! They'll just keep saving you money on the utility bills like nothing ever happened.
 
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Old 11-17-04, 11:15 AM
jasonnc
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Red face

I'm having the same condesation problem in my master bed/bath. We assume it is due to the shower near by.
The house is 15 years old with double-pane all vinyl windows, two in the bedroom, two in the bathroom. Of course the bathroom windows fog up, but so do the bedroom windows even with the door closed and bath fan on. It seems that opening the windows in the bathroom, running the fan as long as possible and running the bedroom ceiling fan as much as possible does help.

The problem we're still seeing is MOLD! Black mold or mildew seem to grow year-round in the cracks and corners of all 4 of these windows. Bleach and other cleaning products help, but the dang mold comes right back a few weeks later!
Any tips or tricks...?
 
 

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