Hanging interior door with no frame
#1
03-10-07, 05:41 AM
Hanging interior door with no frame
We have a laundry closet in our kitchen that had two unattactive bi-fold doors. Those doors do not open wide enough to accommodate a new larger capacity washer and dryer. They also have no vents. To resolve all three issues I am replacing the bi-fold doors with two louvered door slabs.
The closet opening is 59-3/4 X 79-1/2 inches, and there is no door frame installed since there were no doors mounted. The corners are properly finished with metal corner beads and compound. The doors are 30" X 80", so I will need to trim them, and they weigh about 30 lbs each.
Do I need to cut out the drywall corners and build a frame, or can I mount the door hinges directly onto the drywall corner bead with long screws that grab the studs?
Second question: Should I use two hinges per side or three?
Thanks very much for your help.
Robin
The closet opening is 59-3/4 X 79-1/2 inches, and there is no door frame installed since there were no doors mounted. The corners are properly finished with metal corner beads and compound. The doors are 30" X 80", so I will need to trim them, and they weigh about 30 lbs each.
Do I need to cut out the drywall corners and build a frame, or can I mount the door hinges directly onto the drywall corner bead with long screws that grab the studs?
Second question: Should I use two hinges per side or three?
Thanks very much for your help.
Robin
#2
03-10-07, 06:40 AM
Welcome to the forums Robin
3 hinges is always better than 2
You should take off the drywall. It isn't possible to get a good solid hold with the hinges when there is a compressable material [drywall] in between the hinge and the stud.
I would remove the unnneeded drywall and rip down some 1/4" plywood to cover the studs - provided they are plumb. Then install the door/hinges thru that, add door stop and casing. You could install the hinges directly to the studs - just wouldn't be pretty.
One thing to remember the doors will open out a LOT further than the current bifolds - hopefully that won't create another problem.
mark
3 hinges is always better than 2
You should take off the drywall. It isn't possible to get a good solid hold with the hinges when there is a compressable material [drywall] in between the hinge and the stud.
I would remove the unnneeded drywall and rip down some 1/4" plywood to cover the studs - provided they are plumb. Then install the door/hinges thru that, add door stop and casing. You could install the hinges directly to the studs - just wouldn't be pretty.
One thing to remember the doors will open out a LOT further than the current bifolds - hopefully that won't create another problem.
mark
#3
03-10-07, 06:43 AM
Member
Laundry Closet Doors
Door hinges should be fastened directly to wood. If you attach to drywall, even though you use long screws, the hinges will "bite" into the drywall and become loose over time.
I would remove the drywall from the opening and reframe to the correct size to allow for correctly sized door jambs and trim. This would eliminate trimming the sides and ends of the doors.
As a passing note: You could remove the doors you have from their hinges, install the new appliances, and rehang the doors.
I would remove the drywall from the opening and reframe to the correct size to allow for correctly sized door jambs and trim. This would eliminate trimming the sides and ends of the doors.
As a passing note: You could remove the doors you have from their hinges, install the new appliances, and rehang the doors.
#4
03-10-07, 08:23 AM
Discard convention entirely. We can do better than mediocre adaptation of butt hinge mounting.
Are swing doors an absolute necessity?
Surface mounted hooded track (with a valance) with the slabs stacked on either side, or a single side, leaves 100% opening width plus no cutting or hinges. (Single or by-pass track, depending on the stack). Too cumbersome in my kitchen! I object esthetically also.
Why are you trimming the slabs?
Convention dictates that passage doors are mounted flush, or slightly inset, within the opening. And, by God, I will follow convention. Is that your tude?
Hinged "swing" doors can be surface mounted (across an opening - typcial kitchen cabinet doors are an example). Benefits: 100% opening width. Trimming eliminated. Selection from a wide variety of hinge styles (pivot, butt, strap, ect.). Jamb or frame - optional. Trim - optional.
That my be, but my tude is non-adjustable.
The other posts are conventional triogue. Leaving you with 95% of the opening width.
Are swing doors an absolute necessity?
Surface mounted hooded track (with a valance) with the slabs stacked on either side, or a single side, leaves 100% opening width plus no cutting or hinges. (Single or by-pass track, depending on the stack). Too cumbersome in my kitchen! I object esthetically also.
Why are you trimming the slabs?
Convention dictates that passage doors are mounted flush, or slightly inset, within the opening. And, by God, I will follow convention. Is that your tude?
Hinged "swing" doors can be surface mounted (across an opening - typcial kitchen cabinet doors are an example). Benefits: 100% opening width. Trimming eliminated. Selection from a wide variety of hinge styles (pivot, butt, strap, ect.). Jamb or frame - optional. Trim - optional.
That my be, but my tude is non-adjustable.
The other posts are conventional triogue. Leaving you with 95% of the opening width.
#5
03-10-07, 11:55 AM
Laundry Closet Doors
Thank you all for your help. I was going to Home Depot to get the framing, when I saw 2000's reply.
I can't picture what a surface mounted hooded track is unless that is like the track the bi-folds were hanging from. In that case, mounting the slabs on that would only allow me to open 1/2 the opening at a time, not 100%. I think I don't understand.
I trimmed the bottoms already because the slabs were 1/2 inch larger than the opening. I will attempt to mount the doors without trimming the widths, but that may not work.
I never thought about an outside mount (not necessarily too unconventional), but I think it would intrude too much on the kitchen space.
Thanks again!
Robin
I can't picture what a surface mounted hooded track is unless that is like the track the bi-folds were hanging from. In that case, mounting the slabs on that would only allow me to open 1/2 the opening at a time, not 100%. I think I don't understand.
I trimmed the bottoms already because the slabs were 1/2 inch larger than the opening. I will attempt to mount the doors without trimming the widths, but that may not work.
I never thought about an outside mount (not necessarily too unconventional), but I think it would intrude too much on the kitchen space.
Thanks again!
Robin
#6
03-10-07, 02:49 PM
You're still focused within the opening. Open your eyes and your mind.
Track mounted within the opening would provide for up to 50% opening. Track mounted on the exterior surface that just spanned the opening would be about 50% also.
By-pass or by-parting track mounted on the exterior surface (aka "surface mount") that extends beyond the opening the width of a door leaf or more provides for 100% opening. You save money and space when two or more leafs stack on a single side. Ordinary by-pass track can be used for two leafs. (By-pass doors - leafs cross one another, but the styles never meet). Longer track is required when the leafs stack on either side. By-pass track is not required for two leafs. (By-parting doors - styles meet [act as a stop], but the leafs do not cross one another). By-pass track could be used.
In all instanaces the door leafs slide along the surface of the wall or walls. The opening is simply a hole you're covering.
Your objection is an esthetic one. Kid yourself if you like. The swing door will be revere handed. It swings into the kitchen (encroaching on it). A right or left handed door would defeat one of your goals.
Track mounted within the opening would provide for up to 50% opening. Track mounted on the exterior surface that just spanned the opening would be about 50% also.
By-pass or by-parting track mounted on the exterior surface (aka "surface mount") that extends beyond the opening the width of a door leaf or more provides for 100% opening. You save money and space when two or more leafs stack on a single side. Ordinary by-pass track can be used for two leafs. (By-pass doors - leafs cross one another, but the styles never meet). Longer track is required when the leafs stack on either side. By-pass track is not required for two leafs. (By-parting doors - styles meet [act as a stop], but the leafs do not cross one another). By-pass track could be used.
In all instanaces the door leafs slide along the surface of the wall or walls. The opening is simply a hole you're covering.
Your objection is an esthetic one. Kid yourself if you like. The swing door will be revere handed. It swings into the kitchen (encroaching on it). A right or left handed door would defeat one of your goals.
#7
03-11-07, 05:20 AM
Laundry Closet Doors
Thanks for the explanation, 2000. I get it now. I was not thinking outside the box! I like your idea of the outside sliders, but it won't work in my kitchen. To the right of the laundry closet is the entrance way to the dining room, and the refrigerator.
My issue with the doors being outside hinged probably is esthetic as you suggest rather than space. 1-1/2 inches is not too much to give up. The conventional mount doors, however, only encroach on space when open.
I am planning to mount two slabs, of course; a right swing, and a left swing.
I'm still removing the drywall on the corners (I've only got one side done), so I may reconsider the hinge type and mounting location.
My issue with the doors being outside hinged probably is esthetic as you suggest rather than space. 1-1/2 inches is not too much to give up. The conventional mount doors, however, only encroach on space when open.
I am planning to mount two slabs, of course; a right swing, and a left swing.
I'm still removing the drywall on the corners (I've only got one side done), so I may reconsider the hinge type and mounting location.
#8
03-11-07, 11:17 AM
I have the sliding doors on my barn, and I am afraid that is what your hallway will look like once you case in the tracks. It will probably stick out 2 1/2" into the passageway, and look completely like a barn entrance, but to each his/her own. Sometimes conventional wisdom may be, well conventional, but it works.
If the doors aren't too heavy, you may could use 3 of the European hinges, like on cabinet doors, which would give an obtuse opening, and certain ones will give a complete fold back of the doors.
If the doors aren't too heavy, you may could use 3 of the European hinges, like on cabinet doors, which would give an obtuse opening, and certain ones will give a complete fold back of the doors.
