Sliding Patio Door Replacement

Hello all, I have one badly rotten patio door that needs replacing. The house has aluminum siding and the trim is all aluminum too. I've torn part of it apart and it looks like after the door was installed, they simply put 1x4's to trim around the door and then covered them with aluminum.

Now a new door should be fairly close in size to this door but I hardly believe I'll be able to reuse these old 1x4 pieces covered with aluminum. Any thoughts to this?

My other question is about the siding below the door. I could potentially build a deck here but as of right now no deck is planned. The reason I say this is that the rim joist is completely gone below this sliding door for one cavity and it may reach into another. So this means I'll be adding new bracing, beefing up a couple of the floor joists with sistered on joists and some new plywood flooring, stupid termites/water! It would be very hard to remove the existing siding and reinstall it in this location in my opinion (no siding experience really). The one piece runs right behind the cable/power meter/ telephone boxes. What can be done to trim this out and make it look decent? Something like a white piece of aluminum that runs the length of the door and goes from the bottom of the door all the way over the rim joist?

Any insight is greatly appreciated!

 

The exterior trim is not a big deal. You'll tear it off and throw it away. Once the new door is installed, you'll likely need trim that is a slightly different size, and you can worry about it then. There's several good products to choose from... Miratec, Azek, and many similar trim boards that take and hold paint better than wood. Or, you'll want to do something similar to what's on there now... rip 1x4's to size, then wrap that with aluminum trim coil.

As far as the rot below the door, it's not uncommon to find. Usually the problem dates back to poor flashing techniques when the door was installed, which is usually aggravated by the addition of more layers of siding (like vinyl or aluminum) which creates a ledge for water to stand on, and a trap for dirt and debris. As a result of water intrusion, it rarely dries out beneath the door and invites rot, decay, and insects as you have probably discovered. All you can do is be prepared to do some repairs once the door is completely removed. Better to be prepared than to start such a project after work one night and find out the sotres are closed and you have 8 hours of repairs to do before you can begin to install the door. The repairs will almost certainly involve replacing some of the subfloor below the door, possibly extending out into the room. Floor joists are rarely rotton to the point their strength is compromised. Regarding the floor, usually only a small section of floor actually needs to be removed, since blocking can be added between joists to support the cut edge you create when making a splice in the subfloor. If you have several layers of subfloor you will want to stagger the joint between the layers you are replacing.

When you have vinyl or aluminum siding on top of underlying siding, you are getting a pretty wide wall. When people install a patio door that is made for a 2x4 wall into a wall that is 6-8" thick, there are going to be some problems. Mostly it creates a flashing problem on the bottom of the door. So the doorway either needs to have a sloped sill extending beyond the nose of the patio door's sill... or you need to order a door that is wider than normal, so that the nose of the patio door sill will extend BEYOND the siding (or trim) that is below the sill. This alone helps alleviate a lot of problems with water infiltration. Something else that will help is installing ice and water shield across the bottom of the rough opening (before you set the door), folded out over the exterior sheathing. It helps protect the wood in the event that it gets wet. Better yet would be to use a pan flashing inside the rough opening (again, before you set the door), which is the best way to prevent water from coming in under the door.

If you have more building plans in the future, I'd recommend that you get rid of your current steps... cut the vinyl siding away below the door. (carefully cutting through it with angle grinder would do the trick, (with aluminum siding you really can't remove the siding and cut with tin snips ). With the steps removed and the aluminum siding below the door gone, you could either install a skirt board (Miratec/Azek, etc) even a big piece of Hardipanel cement siding... or just apply a piece of flashing below the door. (the custom bent aluminum trim coil you mentioned, for example) If you ever build a deck out there, I'd highly recommend that you make it freestanding, spaced away from the house 1 or 2" so that there is an air space between the ledger and the house. This promotes drying, and allows water to escape, not buildup. Your deck's floor boards would still run up close to the house so there would "appear" to be no gap.

Hopefully some of these suggestions will help. The biggest thing is getting the door thicker than you think it should be so that the nose of the door sill sticks out beyond the sheathing/trim below the door. I'd recommend calculating the wall thickness by measuring from the interior wall surface to the back side of the aluminum siding. (remove an exterior trim board for an exact measurement.)

 

I wonder if I may ask a question, as well? It looks like a lot of water has been coming down on that door...Is there a gutter above there, someplace? Also, what is the surface that the "step" is sitting on? It looks like plywood?

Connie

 

Those "streaks" in the left side panel look like the reason the door is being replaced... bad seal with condensation between panes...

FWIW - take X-sleeper's advice... He's probably the most knowledgeable individual on the forum for this type of work.

 

Yes, bad seals and also the rot below the door. The floor is pretty soft in front of the door so some of that will need replaced I'm sure.

I believe there is a gutter there, no real water problems.

Good to know on the trim, so basically some kind of composite from menards or the like painted white will work, sounds easy.

I believe the termites used the concrete steps to get into the house and eat away at the rim joist. The steps are not attached but I can see where they would trap moisture in there too.

There's actually just a standard 2x4 wall, then that black fiber board, the the aluminum siding so I don't think depth is a problem here thankfully. The floor joist that needs another ones sistered on is soft in multiple places, termites ran through it. I need a rigid floor here, planning on placing ceramic tile on it.

Interesting ideas for below the door, I take it that aluminum would take a brake to bend it so a piece of the composite stuff would be easier. Not sure if that would fit behind the steps as those don't look like they'd be much fun to jackhammer out. I'll probably replace the rim joist with a piece of treated wood and paint it for extra protection.

Thanks for the great ideas!

 

I realize the "streaky" look is from a breached seal...I just saw the evidence of water in the lower left of the door. I asked about run off, because it would do no good to replace the door, the trim and the floor if it was going to recur.

It's okay, you keep tabs on me so I don't make a mistake...I don't resent it, I appreciate it. It's important to me that I only give good advice.

Connie

 

Ok, anyone have a favorite door brand/style that they can recommend? I have Menards, Lowes, and Home Depot available as well as a couple local lumberyards.

I've looked some and basically what I want is a 6' slider and I'd like it to be vinyl I believe. The inside should just be vinyl or white as I have all white trim. I would prefer to have the window grills too if possible but its not a deal breaker.

Menards had Jeldwen and Mastercraft doors at the low end but how good are they? Pella was available and I'm sure Anderson at the local places, but those are $900+.

 

$900ish... Wow... I, personally, hate sliding doors and am constantly replacing them with metal french doors from HD/LOW. I always buy lower end units that will run me around $400ish.... (which is why a $900ish price surprises me) They look good, work well, and are easy to install.... Of course, you'd have to extend your step below the door to make it look right...