Yet another ice inside windows issue


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Old 12-21-08, 02:47 PM
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Yet another ice inside windows issue

I live in the Northeast, and this is my 3rd winter in this house, with the same windows all 3 years . They are double-paned Harvey windows (no storm windows). For some reason, this year I am finding ice forming on the bottom pane. It happens on most windows in the house, not all. It has not done this the past two years I have been here. Two things have changed since last winter. First is I pulled off the window molding on most of the windows to spray foam insulation in the gaps in the drywall and then put the molding back in place. I don't see how this could cause an issue, and actually one window that I did not do this to is also icing, so that must not be the issue. The other thing that changed is we added about 10" on blown-in cellulose insulation in our attic. It was professionally done and they installed insulation batts into the rafter eaves, but they also put baffles in before doing so. My only thought at this point is that the ventilation has changed and its relating to the icing issue I am having? I could be way off, but that's all that really changed.

Any ideas on why it would be icing this year?
 
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Old 12-21-08, 02:51 PM
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Maybe higher humidity in the house, due to the extra insulation? Did they also seal all the attic penetrations as part of the job?
 
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Old 12-21-08, 03:21 PM
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Harvey is one of the best windows in terms of insulation value you can buy, I don't understand your problem. I could understand condensation with extreme cold temps, but not ice. I would contact a Harvey rep and have them look at things. They have an excellent warranty on glass.

OOOPPPSSS!! I mispoke, I was thinking of Hurd windows. Harvey is also a good window, but it depends on what glass you ordered with the windows. There should be a sticker on lft or rght edge of each sash that tells you what you have. If Lo-E/argon, you should not have ice, plain double glass, possible with the early winter weather we have had(globle warming you understand). High interior humidity could definitely contribute to the problem. Lots of house plants, teenager taking showers, more the usual amount of cooking, can all contribute.
 

Last edited by Just Bill; 12-21-08 at 03:39 PM.
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Old 12-21-08, 08:17 PM
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Hi wags1970, you are correct, the cellulose is noted for it's air sealing properties. It covers your attic like a blanket and greatly reduces the air exchange in your house and that is good. However, you now have to deal with the effects of having a more energy efficient home. Pick up a humidistat to tell you what your relative humidity actually is. Then start looking for ways to reduce the moisture in your home. Moisture from any source in the basement, dirt floor, leaks, anything. Do you have exhaust fans in the bathrooms and are they vented to the outside. Same for a Kitchen fan. When you shower, you should run your exhaust fan for 30 minutes after the shower. They make a special, not expensive, switch that has a delay timer built in, so when you turn it off, it will stay for a pre-set time.

As for the windows, they probably haven't changed. Yes we would like our windows to work better, but glass is simply a poor insulator. If your efforts to control the humidity prove ineffective, then consider storm windows or plastic window kits. They increase the insulation properties and move the warm air away from the glass.

The plus side is, that condensation and ice is at least telling you your insulation is working.

HH
Bud
 
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Old 12-22-08, 08:38 AM
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Same problem

I am noticing the same problem with my double-hung windows. The temps have gone down near 5 degrees the last couple of nights and in the morning, I'm noticing a thin line of ice forming along the bottom edge of the top window sash--right near where the window locks are located. This condensation is on the interior of the window--no fogging of the panes themselves.

Are we saying this occurrence is normal and probably not a defect in the window itself, but rather due to elevated humidity in the room?
 
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Old 12-22-08, 05:44 PM
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Yup! Condensation always appears along the bottom of the sash due to cold air sinking. It's not the windows so begin your humidity/ventilation hunt.
 
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Old 12-23-08, 05:49 AM
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I think I will just have to accept the condensation on the windows. I have people in my house prone to bronchitis/respitory problems, so I can't let the air get too dry.
 
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Old 01-01-09, 10:00 AM
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Ice on Sash

I understand and accept the condinsation appearance and why it is occuring even the best insulated glass, but why is ice appearing? The space where the top sash meets the bottom sash should be tight due to the weather stripping installed with the window. However, this is the very place where the ice is forming. I installed Harvey windows two years ago and I am having the same prooblem. Condensation appears on the glass due to its cold surface, but it turns to ice due to a draft or air movement that is seeping in from the outside due to, in my opinion, a poor window seal. Ice should not form. Another contributing factor to this is that viynal windows do move and distort with temperature extremes. When this happens a tight seal that is present at one time may not be so tight at another. Does anyone have an opinion on my theory?
 
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Old 01-04-09, 03:26 PM
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I do agree about vinyl windows "shifting". I find that I have to keep mine locked or the top sash will eventually shift down just a bit--especially if there's extreme changes in temps. But I'm sure they're still better than the 50 yr old single pain wood windows and aluminum storm windows they replaced.
 
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Old 03-03-09, 07:08 AM
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window icing

disregard this reply, I was trying to post a thread for questions that I had.
 

Last edited by SK0RPIUS; 03-03-09 at 07:44 AM. Reason: wanted to post thread not reply to one
 

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