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How (not) to replace door in stucco wall - a big box store installation


klawman213's Avatar
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06-26-17, 09:04 AM   #1  
How (not) to replace door in stucco wall - a big box store installation

This thread is about how a nightmare I am living. A big box store (call it "BBS") is now installing an Anderson Gliding Patio Door after its installer botched the install of the same door nearly a year ago. A brief thread, called "Patio slider set deep below stucco on one side" was began in February of this year about an issue with the first installation. In an attempt to avoid costly litigation, I agreed to allow BBS to let BBS remove the first door and correctly install another. The nightmare only worsened.

This time BBS may have used a more competent installer, but the guy doing the work freely admits that he shouldn't be doing the job and he urged his company to find someone that knows how to the job. (I believe his experience is with replacement doors and windows installed into an original frame and not with new construction type doors requiring a chip out.) The job is now at the point where the lath is done and the city should inspect later this week. Here we come to the vortex of the nightmare.

The installer does not expect the lath and paper to pass inspection, but hopes that the inspector will tell him that all he has to do is apply caulking to bridge the gaps at the joint of the original paper and the new paper. I don't mean to seal where the new paper slides under the remaining old, as in many places the new doesn't even reach the old. Where the new paper does slide under, it does so by perhaps 1/4".

Is this even code and if it is allowed by code, is it shoddy work? I am in CA and believe that my city follows the 2013 California Residential Code and am looking at section R703.2 "Water Resistive Barriers" and where it requires 6 inches of lapping, but does it even apply if an approved paper backed stucco lath is used. The installer says he doesn't know that it is required to lap by a specific amount, but doesn't it have to at least be lapped?

If the preserved old paper must lap the new, there is a big problem. This installer cut the stucco back just short of where the wall makes a corner. In order to lap the paper, won't he have to remove several inches of the stucco around that corner?

I realize this is a long post, but I fear that things are spinning out of control, and I would really appreciate any input from you folks. [When I asked about the housewrap problem on the bricks and masonry forum for exterior improvements, Bud9051 suggested I ask here. That thread ia here.

Some pictures can be seen by following this link. (There currently is a problem with uploading pics to the forum.)

 
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06-26-17, 04:23 PM   #2  
First of all, there was no reason to start a second thread. Secondly, there is no reason to let the job be inspected until it's finished. Is the door installed & working properly?? If it is, finish the aesthetics before the inspector arrives.

 
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06-26-17, 05:59 PM   #3  
ShortyLong,

Having it inspected now is the call made by the guy hired by the Big Box Store, although I wouldn't call it finished when he doesn't expect it to pass inspection.

 
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06-27-17, 07:59 AM   #4  
Does the door work properly or not?

 
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06-27-17, 03:02 PM   #5  
Second thread? More like the fourth... but who's counting?

The irc codes primarily apply to new construction, it is not always possible or practical to follow the code when repairing stucco due to the unique challenges of remodelling. If removing the stucco around the door damages the existing wrb (no matter how careful you are when removing the stucco...) then removing even MORE stucco is not the answer. Of course, our opinion is not what matters, it is your inspector that needs to be happy with it.

You could hammer out an additional 6" on each side, but what will that gain you if the wrb is all full of rips and tears? IMO, new wrb should be put around the nail fin of the door that is as wide as is practical and reasonable. It can lap over the old wrb on the sides... caulk it if you like. I would be using a peel and stick membrane tape. The new wrb should tuck under the old by 2" across the top, if possible. Then stucco casing bead should be installed around the perimeter of the door.

 
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06-28-17, 09:44 PM   #6  
what will that gain you if the wrb is all full of rips and tears?
That is a big "if". There is no reason to believe that it is full of rips and tears. The paper that has been exposed was ripped and torn by the door installers. But thank you on your suggestions as to how you would do the job if the wrap beneath the adjacent several inches of stucco is ripped and torn.

 
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06-29-17, 05:19 AM   #7  
I dont think you understand the problem. You hit the stucco with a hammer to break the stucco off the wire lathe. That process tears the paper. Hammer off more stucco and it will likely damage more of your paper. If that wasnt an issue you wouldn't have any problem with your paper overlap.

 
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06-29-17, 10:05 AM   #8  
Thanks for explaining, XSleeper. The problem assumes that an experienced plasterer would so totally destroy the wrap.

 
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06-29-17, 05:54 PM   #9  
Yes. Even an experienced laborer would have difficulty saving that paper if its a poor quality paper. You have no sheathing so the paper rips where there are voids between studs, and even if the hammer hits on a stud the shattered stucco is sharp and cuts the paper.

So no matter how much stucco is removed I think you will face tears in the existing wrb that more overlap alone does not solve.

 
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06-29-17, 07:18 PM   #10  
Thanks again for all your help, XSleeper. I better understand. There were things I didn't get but I believe I now see what can be done.


Last edited by klawman213; 06-29-17 at 07:33 PM.
 
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07-14-17, 04:14 PM   #11  
Failed Inspection

Thanks for all you suggestions. I believe the inspector shared XSleeper's concerns that further chipping would tear underlying paper and issued a notice of correction as how to seal openings and nail holes. He also failed the job on account of the stucco was saw cut instead of chipped, which he explained would result in a weak joint that would easily break. The Big Box Store is now agreeable to hiring the stucco guy I earlier suggested and have him redo the lathing and do the plastering.

 
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