Why would windows be installed like this??
#1
07-23-18, 09:17 PM
Why would windows be installed like this??
Found out the upper sash in my laundry room window has rotted, and so I need to buy a replacement. I've replaced a few sashes before - just pop out the old one and pop in the new one - never anything more than that. I had tried to put in the new balances that came with the last one, but the directions didn't match what I was seeing, so I gave up.
So, I was telling my BF about my rotten window, and he said why not replace it with a vinyl...and I explained to him that I would love to, but wouldn't that mean ripping my casing off, and then I sent him a couple of pics....to which he promptly replied - "well that's a problem." And then "Why the h#ll would they trim a window like that?"
So...thought I would ask here....you guys ever seen this done? If so, any idea why? Sort of makes it a lot more work to replace an entire window with something better.
Pics show my recently painted laundry room window, and then the one upstairs, where I had tried to remove the stop, but it was way beyond me. That window has no paint on it , just natural stain/varnish, but you can better see the construction.
So, I was telling my BF about my rotten window, and he said why not replace it with a vinyl...and I explained to him that I would love to, but wouldn't that mean ripping my casing off, and then I sent him a couple of pics....to which he promptly replied - "well that's a problem." And then "Why the h#ll would they trim a window like that?"
So...thought I would ask here....you guys ever seen this done? If so, any idea why? Sort of makes it a lot more work to replace an entire window with something better.
Pics show my recently painted laundry room window, and then the one upstairs, where I had tried to remove the stop, but it was way beyond me. That window has no paint on it , just natural stain/varnish, but you can better see the construction.
#2
07-24-18, 04:09 AM
Your pics don't show a picture of the sash track ( the part or parts that keep the sash vertical during opening or closing). If the sash track is fixed, it needs to be removed before removing the sash. If the sash track is floating (spring loaded) the sash can be removed by a sharp pull on one side of the sash. One side of the inside casing may also have to be removed if it interferes with the sash removal.
#3
07-24-18, 05:28 AM
Group Moderator
I can't tell much of anything from the pictures... it kind of looks like someone trimmed over the trim in a couple of the photos.
#5
07-24-18, 07:51 AM
There is no new trim here. This is ALL the original window.
The picture of the unpainted window is showing where I had attempted to follow the installation instructions (last year) to replace the balances that came with the last new window I bought. I was trying to figure out why there was no "stop" to be removed (as the instructions were telling me to do), and wound up finding out that the entire trim piece was nailed on top of another piece....and obviously it was NOT a simple matter to remove it to get to those side pieces (balances) to replace them - so I gave up.
These are double-hung wood windows, house built in 1994. I have replaced maybe 3 or 4 of them, sashes only, over the years. I have only painted the ones in my kitchen area, all the others are natural.
This is a picture I took this morning, with the newly-painted bottom sash back in place.
(The top sash is the rotted one, and obviously I would not have repainted the bottom one if I had known the top was beyond repair.
)
Not sure if this helps any. I can take more pics tonight if that would help.
The picture of the unpainted window is showing where I had attempted to follow the installation instructions (last year) to replace the balances that came with the last new window I bought. I was trying to figure out why there was no "stop" to be removed (as the instructions were telling me to do), and wound up finding out that the entire trim piece was nailed on top of another piece....and obviously it was NOT a simple matter to remove it to get to those side pieces (balances) to replace them - so I gave up.
These are double-hung wood windows, house built in 1994. I have replaced maybe 3 or 4 of them, sashes only, over the years. I have only painted the ones in my kitchen area, all the others are natural.
This is a picture I took this morning, with the newly-painted bottom sash back in place.
(The top sash is the rotted one, and obviously I would not have repainted the bottom one if I had known the top was beyond repair.
)Not sure if this helps any. I can take more pics tonight if that would help.
Last edited by PJmax; 07-24-18 at 08:32 AM. Reason: reoriented picture
#6
07-24-18, 08:17 AM
"Your pics don't show a picture of the sash track ( the part or parts that keep the sash vertical during opening or closing). If the sash track is fixed, it needs to be removed before removing the sash. If the sash track is floating (spring loaded) the sash can be removed by a sharp pull on one side of the sash. One side of the inside casing may also have to be removed if it interferes with the sash removal."
Well that was my question - every install video I have watched, states to simply remove the "stop" down the inside/front of the window. I don't have trim like that. It's like they locked in the window, with the trim.
I don't remove the track in order to take out the sash. I literally pull the top of the sash out, (the side track compresses a bit when I push on it) and then after the top is out, I lift up one side of the window, and take it out of the track. So maybe that is a "floating" track. These are PlyGem windows.
Honestly, I know nothing about windows. I clean them, take them out to clean or paint, sometimes have the glass resealed...put them back in. Been here 20 years - house is 24 years old.
Well that was my question - every install video I have watched, states to simply remove the "stop" down the inside/front of the window. I don't have trim like that. It's like they locked in the window, with the trim.
I don't remove the track in order to take out the sash. I literally pull the top of the sash out, (the side track compresses a bit when I push on it) and then after the top is out, I lift up one side of the window, and take it out of the track. So maybe that is a "floating" track. These are PlyGem windows.
Honestly, I know nothing about windows. I clean them, take them out to clean or paint, sometimes have the glass resealed...put them back in. Been here 20 years - house is 24 years old.
#7
07-24-18, 08:29 AM
Group Moderator
Marvin tilt wood windows are like that too. Yes, they are commonly done like that, with the trim applied on top of the "stop". Quite a few other similar brands from that era would be like that too. Especially if they have a vinyl jamb.
it's only much older windows that have a removable stop.
it's only much older windows that have a removable stop.
#8
07-24-18, 09:00 AM
They are??? If so, then why does every "how to replace a window" video show the simple step of removing the stop, to get the thing out? I mean, I have not seen a single video or blog that shows window trim done like this. I'm not questioning your answer, but I don't understand why it's not shown that way in installation videos? I thought I must have wacky windows!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnZ2K3F23yU
https://www.thisoldhouse.com/how-to/...cement-windows
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnZ2K3F23yU
https://www.thisoldhouse.com/how-to/...cement-windows
#9
07-25-18, 05:54 AM
If you can remove the lower sash in your latest picture by the process described in your latest post, you should be able to remove the top sash the same way unless there is some type of stop located in the floating track. This would have to be removed first before removing the top sash. Can the top sash be lowered to the sill?
#10
07-25-18, 09:21 AM
@beelzebob, I have no problems removing both sashes. I stated earlier that I have done that on a few of them over the years. The problem is that to replace the window with a replacement vinyl window, requires complete removal of the side tracks (balances),. and those cannot be removed without complete removal of the interior trim/casing. You can see in the pictures that the trim was installed AROUND the balances.
