Dishwasher spray tube does not pop up

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  #1  
Old 04-12-04, 04:53 PM
ez4u2chere
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Dishwasher spray tube does not pop up

My Kenmore diswasher is having issues. It appears as though the tube does not pop up and the arm doesn't spin. If I turn it on for a few seconds and then open the door I can see water, so it is getting water.

What could be wrong?

It's model 363.14391992 if that helps.
 
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  #2  
Old 04-13-04, 08:06 AM
appliancepresid
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You may have a clogged spray arm and a filter screen that is restricted.
take off the spray arm and check to see if any debri is inside the arm and try to clear it. also you may have a weak pump assembly
worn impellar where it cant pump the water up and through the unit as it once did.

the 363. tells me it is a GE dishwasher there may be broken glass in the impellar have you had a glass break recently?

but check your spray arms for blockage first and a filter screen if the unit has one.
 
  #3  
Old 04-13-04, 09:13 AM
ez4u2chere
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^^^^

Thanks for the help. Does the spray arm come off from the top or bottom? Where is the screen you are talking about located? I can pull the spray tube up with my finger with ease.

Sorry, I'm a computer and a car guy, but notmuch of an appliance guy.

To my knowledge nothing has ever broken during a wash cycle. But it is odd that it worked fine one day then two days later it didn't.
 
  #4  
Old 04-13-04, 09:37 AM
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Hello: ez4u2chere

The advice and info you got from appliancepresid is correct and I agree. You need to check out all those possibilities. Restricted filter screens and restricted wasker arms and the holes in them.

Hard water deposits and soap residues clog up the water passages and filter screens, etc. Very common and one aspect of dishwasher maintainence.

Especially in areas where hard water exists and or too much dishwasher soap and or types of soaps have a tendency to do, leave residuals.

Most spray arms have a center screw which has to be removed first to remove the arm. The lower arm has to be removed to access fully the lower filter area beneath the lower arm.

Once lower arm is removed, more screws to lift up and out the filter screen(s). Hard water deposits must be removed. Once cleaned reassemble exactly as found.

Problem should than be solved. Motor to pump may not need to be checked and or replaced, etc.

You may want to explore the provided links to help pages in the banner ad on the top of the page.

Retail appliance parts dealers can also help determine what the possible problem may be. Bring the make, model and serial numbers. Appliance part stores and dealers are listed in the phone book.

Check back on your question several more times. Other members posting replies in this forum topic may offer you additional advice, ideas, suggestions, test and or repair methods.

Use the reply button to add additional information or questions. Using this method moves the topic back up to the top of the list automatically.

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  #5  
Old 04-14-04, 02:49 PM
ez4u2chere
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OK, Thanks for the help in advance. I got the arm off. It had a couple tabs that if you press out on them you can lift it right off. But I still can't seem to find the screen you guys are talking about. Here are a few pics that I am hoping will be some help.








I don't know why the pictures didn't work, but here is a
LINK
 

Last edited by ez4u2chere; 04-14-04 at 03:00 PM.
  #6  
Old 04-14-04, 03:01 PM
ez4u2chere
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OK, why won't my pictures or my links work?

http://members.cox.net/mmorin/dishwasher
 
  #7  
Old 04-14-04, 03:24 PM
ez4u2chere
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Wink

OK, here's the deal. When I first turn it on the tube pops up for a second, then goes back down into its hole never to be seen again.

Sorry for so many posts, but I'd like to get this fixed.
 
  #8  
Old 04-15-04, 02:58 PM
ez4u2chere
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I also just realized that the initial spurt of water is dirty. It seems like it's just "leftover" water or something.

Could a inlet valve be the culprit?
 
  #9  
Old 04-15-04, 03:07 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez4u,
If you do not have enough water in the unit it will not spray.

water level should be up to the heating element inside the tub.
if not you may have a bad water valve or clogged screen in the water valve.

what is the water level?
 
  #10  
Old 04-15-04, 03:13 PM
ez4u2chere
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Originally posted by appliancepresid
Hi Ez4u,
If you do not have enough water in the unit it will not spray.

water level should be up to the heating element inside the tub.
if not you may have a bad water valve or clogged screen in the water valve.

what is the water level?
I'm really confused as to how dishwashers work, maybe that's why I'm having such a hard time.

Is the washer actually supposed to "fill" up? If it is, it's not. There is an initial "burst" of water that shoots out of the tube, and then it just trickles out the sides and it looks like it drains out.

I think what you are saying is that I should have an inch or two of water accumulate in the bottom of the washer?

If that's the case, then maybe I'm looking at this from the wrong perspective. I'm thinking I'm not getting pressure, but I'm actually not getting water.
 
  #11  
Old 04-15-04, 03:25 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez,
The d/w fills with water from the inlet water valve, there is a float sw. inside tub generally on left hand side , it shuts off the water along with the timer contacts , then the pump in the d/w takes over and pushes that water up inside the spray arms .

if the float is stuck in the up position water will not enter the tub. if you lift up on the float you should hear a clicking noise that is working the micro sw. mounted under the tub.

you may even have a bad water valve, not opening to let enough water in by the time the timer shuts off current to the valve.

check in the water area sounds like you don,t have enough water to start with.

let us know
 
  #12  
Old 04-15-04, 03:27 PM
appliancepresid
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EZ,
another thing to try is manually adding water up to the element then start the d/w in middle of the cycle should hear the washing action if you are fast enough you can open the door and catch a glimps.
 
  #13  
Old 04-15-04, 03:37 PM
ez4u2chere
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OK thanks. I'll try and add water to it and see what happens.

I don't know why my links didn't work, but if you look at the bottom picture on the page I tried to post members.cox.net/mmorin/dishwasher

on the far left, this is the inlet valve right? And in the middle, there is a solenoid kind of gadget. What is it?

And in the top picture, bottom left, what is the canister looking thing inside the dishwasher?

Thanks for all your help. We'll get it one day!
 
  #14  
Old 04-15-04, 03:46 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi EZ,
Can't see the pics but if you have the lower access panel off and follow your water line (hot) it will go to the inlet water valve the part on top that has wire attached is the solenoid for that valve.

inside the dishwasher on the left side that dome is the float switch, there may be a cover over it held down with a 1/4" screw
if you remove that cover you should see the float assembly lift it up and down a few times they sometimes get clogged with soap sediment and debri. may even need to be cleaned.

I am sure you will get it
 
  #15  
Old 04-15-04, 03:50 PM
appliancepresid
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ez,
pics came up you are correct that is your inlet valve and on the inside left is your float dome, remove that cover float is under it
 
  #16  
Old 04-15-04, 04:18 PM
ez4u2chere
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Thanks again appliancepresid for helping me out!

I took the float switch dome cover off and cleaned it up really good, but it didn't help me out any.

I then filled the washer with water like you suggested, and the tube pops up, etc... like it is supposed to.

So it looks like my real problem is not getting water. Where should I go from here? Is the inlet valve the only culprit? Or are there other things that should be checked? I did not disconnect any water lines, but everything appears to be fine with my hoses and lines. Nothing appears to be kinked in any way.
 
  #17  
Old 04-15-04, 05:23 PM
ez4u2chere
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I took a couple more pics. One of them I think is my water inlet valve or solenoid (I don't know if it's one in the same) and the other one I don't know what it is, that's what I wanted to know.

http://members.cox.net/mmorin/dishwasher.htm

(copy and paste link into your browser)

Is there another filter or something I should look at before I go and replace what I think is the water inlet valve?
 
  #18  
Old 04-15-04, 05:51 PM
ez4u2chere
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Unhappy

appliancepresid ---

That water you had me put in........

Now it won't drain! So it looks like I have another problem. Not only will it not fill, but it won't drain the water out that I put in.
 
  #19  
Old 04-15-04, 06:33 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez,
he part in the pics you dont know is called a drain valve solenoid

if the plunger does not pull in unit will not drain
check the linkage that is connected to the solenoid also watch when unit goes into drain cycle you can put a volt meter across the terminals should get 120 vac


unit will go into a drain cycle at the very begining and at end of cycle before dry cycle ,
 
  #20  
Old 04-15-04, 06:34 PM
appliancepresid
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Hey Ez,
by any chance did you install a new disposal or any one else?
 
  #21  
Old 04-15-04, 06:36 PM
appliancepresid
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also make sure no one turned water off under sink by mistake and might have forgot to turn it on

I have seen it happen more than once
 
  #22  
Old 04-16-04, 05:49 AM
ez4u2chere
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appliancepresid--
I was able to drain my diswasher this morning by pushing down on the drain valve solenoid while the washer was turned on. I think that might have just been a glitch, and it very well could have been jammed from me putting my fat fingers where they probably don't belong.

The water is turned on, and no I have not recently had any work done. I had the house built four years ago and the builder put the garbage disposal and the diswasher in at that time.


So does it look like the inlet valve is the likely culprit here? Is there anything I can do to it before I go and buy a replacement? You know how some things just mysteriously start to work when you take them apart and put them back together, I was wondering if it was likely to happen in this case?
 
  #23  
Old 04-16-04, 06:14 AM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez,
Sounds like the car is running headed towards the appliance parts store.
Yes I would replace the water valve.

they dont cost much and will save the frustration if the old one would start to leak afterwards.
 
  #24  
Old 04-16-04, 02:47 PM
ez4u2chere
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I bought a water inlet valve today for $18, but before I replaced it I thought I'd check it again. So I filled it up w/ water and let it run.

It still won't drain tough, unless I push down on the solenoid. Should I bother replacing the inlet valve? Or could something else be wrong?
 
  #25  
Old 04-16-04, 02:56 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez,
I am assuming you did the voltage test at the water valve solenoid you can also check that drain solenoid also with the voltmeter.

with the meter attached to the drain solenoid when it goes into a drain mode you should get a voltage reading.

if you are not getting power you may have a timer contact problem or broken wire do the voltage checks.

If you get voltage and the linkage is fine then a drain solenoid more than likley is burnt out.
 
  #26  
Old 04-16-04, 03:00 PM
ez4u2chere
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^^^No I didn't test for voltage. I remembered I lent my multimeter out when I went looking for it and the guy I lent it to is on vacation. Should I just go buy a cheapo mulitmeter and check before I proceed with replacing the water inlet valve? Does it sound like I might have something else going on?
 
  #27  
Old 04-16-04, 03:08 PM
appliancepresid
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I hate to tell anyone to go buy another meter, if you have an electrical tester (two wire with a neon light) that will also work you can watch the drain solenoid to see if the plunger pulls in when manually put d/w in drain cycle. but testing would be prefered method. Need to verify if it is getting power at both solenoids before replacing parts.
 
  #28  
Old 04-16-04, 04:12 PM
ez4u2chere
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Originally posted by appliancepresid
I hate to tell anyone to go buy another meter, if you have an electrical tester (two wire with a neon light) that will also work you can watch the drain solenoid to see if the plunger pulls in when manually put d/w in drain cycle. but testing would be prefered method. Need to verify if it is getting power at both solenoids before replacing parts.
I can't wait much longer, so I went and bought a multimeter. When I check for continuity between the two electrical connections on the water inlet valve I measure .85 kohms. Is this good or bad?

I then turned the washer on and measured for voltage and measured 0 volts. Obviously that's not good.
 
  #29  
Old 04-16-04, 06:33 PM
ez4u2chere
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^^^also, how do you go about removing the connectors from whatever they are attached to? Is there a special tool used to get the connectors off?
 
  #30  
Old 04-17-04, 02:38 PM
ez4u2chere
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I got the connectors off. I guess you just need to put a little muscle behind it.

I'm still not getting any voltage any where underneat except for the motor. It won't fill, it won't drain, and I also realized that the heated dry doesn't work.

So....I guess this would leave either the dial or the buttons to be bad????????????
 
  #31  
Old 04-19-04, 07:00 PM
appliancepresid
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Hi Ez,
I was looking for a schematic of your model but could not find one,
If not getting power to the items listed I would take the control console apart look for a burnt wire or either a defectice timer.
 
  #32  
Old 04-20-04, 06:31 AM
ez4u2chere
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Well I gave up.

I can't find any open, shorted, burnt, or loose wires, so it has to be either the timer or the push buttons, but I don't want to waste money replacing parts just to see if it's fixed or not. Odds are I'd still come out cheaper replacing the timer and the buttons, but with my luck it still wouldn't work. The repairman is coming over tomorrow morning. I'll let you know the results.

Thanks a million for your help!
 
  #33  
Old 04-24-04, 05:48 AM
ez4u2chere
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It was the selectory switch.
The wife is happy now that she has her dishwasher back, but of course she wasn't the one who had to write the check out.
 
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