recessed lighting

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  #1  
Old 12-11-02, 08:14 AM
builder bill
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Smile recessed lighting

hello everyone in building land, I have a question pertaining to recessed lighting. I am finishing my entire basement little by little if you know what i mean. I am installing 4 maybe six cans in the rec. area of the basement my question is this if I have an exsisting pull string light fixture in the middle of the rec. room can i run power from this to my six cans and then to the switch. My second question is this, if my first question is possible can i then run the same six cans to a second switch as well. In other words control all six cans from to switch locations. could you please be descriptive when explaining this to me please, Iam a little slow........ for example do i need additional junction boxes??? do I just loop from one to the other?
All your help would be of great help.
Thanks
 
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  #2  
Old 12-11-02, 08:21 AM
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All is possible. But there are a hundred ways to wire it correctly and a million ways to wire it wrong. We can't really cover all the possibilities in this forum. And we wouldn't really want to, since there are many good books at your local public library and home improvement center that do it so much better. Post back with and questions that arise from the books.
 
  #3  
Old 12-11-02, 09:33 AM
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Is the only way to turn on the pull-string light with the string? Or, are you saying that another switch exists for that light and the pull-string is somewhat redundant? It would seem like a problem to me if you added 6 lights to a little pull-string switch that is meant for only 1 light.

In a general sense, yes, you can wire two switches to a set of lights...it's called a 3-way switch. This is hard to explain...as, John said, you may want to check out some books for this...they often have diagrams that will make it much clearer to you than just words. It requires a little extra wire, but it can be worth it!

You may want to also look into X-10 technology. Then, you could have as many switches (transmitters) as you want. Basically, you would make your can lights and pull-string lights and X-10 lamp device & the transmitters could plug into any outlet. The inline lamp device is ~$25 (http://www.smarthome.com/2250AC.html) and a table-top switch transmitter is ~$11 (http://www.smarthome.com/4030.html). You could also have a transmitter in another room or upstairs that controls these lights as well as others.

I recommend getting one of the starter kits...cheap & way fun!
 
  #4  
Old 12-11-02, 10:31 AM
builder bill
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Question

the pull string light i am refurring to is only one of 6 pull string lights that used to exsist in the basement, I used the other ones to do other things thru-out the basement. ther are no switches to the cans has we speak, I want to add two switches to the 6 cans from to different locations. Can you please explain to me how to wire the cans running from the exsisting pull string fixture and to two different switch locates. I do have basic wiring skills. Thanks
Bill
 
  #5  
Old 12-11-02, 10:59 AM
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I don't think I can explain this to you without writing a book. 3-way switches are fairly basic, but you probably should have a diagram to make sure that you do it correctly the first time.
 
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Old 12-11-02, 04:39 PM
builder bill
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Please any help!!!!!

Help, please reply!!!
 
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Old 12-11-02, 05:05 PM
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Okay, I'll give you an overview. But you still need to get the book. There are a million important safety and code issues that the book will explain.

1) Shut off the breaker.
2) Remove the existing light fixture.
3) Run a 12/2 NM-B cable from this box to where you want the first switch.
4) Put a blank cover plate on the former location of the pull-chain fixture. This box must remain permanently accessible!
5) Install a switch box at the end of the 12/2.
6) Run 12/3 NM-B cable from this box to where you want the second switch.
7) Install another switch box there.
8) Run a 12/2 from this second switch box to the first light.
9) Run 12/2 from this light to the next light.
10) Run 12/2 from this light to the next light.
11) Run 12/2 from this light to the next light.
12) Run 12/2 from this light to the next light.
13) Run 12/2 from this light to the next light.

Post back when you get this far and we'll tell you how to make all the connections.
 
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Old 12-12-02, 05:55 AM
builder bill
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I AM THERE

Hello Mr Nelson, I am there now what is the next step, wait I have only one question from your previous response what do you mean when you said Put a blank cover plate on the former location of the pull-chain fixture. This box must remain permanently accessible!
Thanks for all of your help.
Bill
when you say accessible do mean you need to visibly see it?
 
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Old 12-12-02, 07:40 AM
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Accessible means that you must be able to open it back up without any damage to the finish of the building. That usually means visible, but not always.

At all boxes except the switches, connect wires by matching colors.

At each switch, connect the whites together. Connect the 12/2 black to the black screw. Connect the 12/2 red and black to the two traveler screws.

If you follow my directions, it will work correctly, But there are still hundreds of ways it might be unsafe. Read a book or two or three.
 
  #10  
Old 12-12-02, 07:47 AM
builder bill
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traveler screws?

what are traveler screws? and where does the 12/3 wire come into play?
thanks
bill
 
  #11  
Old 12-12-02, 07:48 AM
builder bill
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pig-tails

are pig-tails needed anywhere in this applcation?
Bill
 
  #12  
Old 12-12-02, 09:39 AM
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Traveler screw are the two screws on a 3-way switch other than the black (common) and green (grounding) screws.

The 12/3 cable comes into play just where you already ran it -- between the two switches.

Pigtails are only going to be needed on the grounding wires at the switches.
 
  #13  
Old 12-13-02, 10:27 PM
builder bill
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to my adding recessed lighting from the esisting pull cord?

Hello everyone is it possible to add a ceiling fan to the pull cord light fixture and still run power to my six cans using this same fixture as our power sorce?
Thanks
Bill
 
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Old 12-14-02, 08:44 AM
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Yes, anything is possible with more wire! Do you want the ceiling fan controlled by pull chains or wall switches? Same switches as the lights, or different switches? Will the fan have a light? Do you want separate switches for the fan and its light? Don't forget to replace the light box with a fan rated box so it doesn't fall on your head.
 
  #15  
Old 12-14-02, 09:12 PM
builder bill
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ceiling fan

Hello John

I would like to install the ceiling fan with no lights and have it run on its own switch. So now we have six cans running from the pull string fixture operated from to different locations and now adding a ceiling fan to the exsisting pull sting location, but first replacing the pull string fixture box with a ceiling fan rated box. I ran 12/2 wire from the pull string fixture to my first switch and then ran 12/3 wire from my first switch to my second switch and 12/2 wire from my second switch to my first can and and from my first can to my second can and so on, now how to I wire the ceiling fan to its our switch. The switch to the fan will be in a two gang switch box nested beside my first switch that operates my recessed lights, can you help me?
Thanks
PS I probably owe you a case of beer by now john, let me know where to send it and it will be on it's way PSS what kind do ya drink?
Bill
 
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Old 12-14-02, 09:24 PM
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Replace the 12/2 between that fan box and the double-gang switch box with 12/3. Hook up the black and white of the 12/3 just like you did on the 12/2. The red wire will return a switched hot to the fan (i.e., the fan will connect to red and white, but not black). At the double-gang switch box, use two pigtails on the 12/3 black wire from the fan. One pigtail connects to the common on the 3-way (as before), and the other connects to one screw on the new single-pole switch. The red of the 12/3 from the fan connects to the other screw on the single-pole switch.

I drink any kind. Beer is not just for breakfast any more. But send $20 to Habitat for Humanity.
 

Last edited by John Nelson; 12-14-02 at 10:20 PM.
  #17  
Old 12-15-02, 06:51 AM
RickJ6956
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"send $20 to Habitat for Humanity."

Nicely done, John.
 
  #18  
Old 12-15-02, 07:26 AM
builder bill
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hello john

Thanks for all your help,is there any way you could be just a little more specific on installing the fan and having it on it's own swith. I am having trouble understanding the connection of all these wires to where and what? can we go thru it once more from the top?
Thanks
Bill Scheib
 
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Old 12-15-02, 07:54 AM
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At the fan box, you have two cables. Call the incoming power cable "P". Call the 12/3 going to the double-gang switch box "S".

At the double-gang switch box, you have two cables. One is the other end of "S". The other is a 12/3 going to the other switch box. Call that "T".

You will have two switches in the double-gang box: a 3-way switch, and a standard single-pole switch. Use the largest double-gang box you can buy to allow for enough room for all the connections.

At the fan: (1) Connect Pb to Sb. (2) Connect Pw to Sw to the fan's white wire. (3) Connect Sr to the fan's black wire.

At the double-gang switch box: (1) Connect Sw to Tw. (2) Connect Tb and Tr to the two traveler screws on the 3-way switch. (3) Connect Sr to one of the non-green screws on the single-pole switch. (4) Connect Sb with a wire nut to two 4" pieces of black wire ("pigtails"). (5) Connect one pigtail to the common (black) screw on the 3-way switch. (6) Connect the other pigtail to the other non-green screw on the single pole switch.
 
  #20  
Old 12-16-02, 06:29 AM
builder bill
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hello john

I am sorry but I have not a clue to your ps sp to your sr it makes no sense to me, could you maybe color code every thing. I understand p for power and s for switch but whats the other letter code you are using?
Thanks
Bill
 
  #21  
Old 12-16-02, 07:59 AM
hotarc
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w is white, b is black, and r is red.
 
  #22  
Old 12-16-02, 08:02 AM
builder bill
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Thank you!!!
Bill
 
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