Stuck: 4 wire timer on 3 wire circuit ?

I bought a 6215 Leviton Electronic Timer to replace a single pole switch for a bathroom fan.

The new timer has Ground + 3 wires called Load, Line, and Neutral.

When I went to install, I realized that the existing switch only has only Ground + 2 wires connected to it.

Can I still use the new timer? Is it a case where I just ignore the timer's white (Neutral) ?

Do I need to replace with a different Timer ?

Please advise

Thanks for the help

 

Line - the source of power to the circuit.
Load - the connection to the fan
Neutral - connects to the neutral of the circuit, usually white.
Ground - connects to bare copper or green insulated ground wire.

If you have a switch loop to the fan, then you would not be using the neutral as the circuit does not have one. In a switch loop, both wires are part of the hot line, just open where the switch goes. Both wires should be black. I know they aren't, but the white should be marked as black. If you don't use the neutral, cap it off.

Hope this helps.

 

Yes.


The Leviton 6215 requires a neutral connection, they do have other models that don't require the neutral.

 

That time probably has an electric motor to drive the timer. You will need a spring wound mechanical type like Bolted says.

 

Thanks for the suggestions. Here is an update:

I experimented a bit:

First I just capped the switch's Neutral (white) wire. There were no side effects, but the timer did not work.

I finally ended up connecting the white (Neutral) wire to Ground, and then the timer worked properly. This is how I have left it.

Does anybody see a potential problem ?

Thanks again.

 

YES! You have current on the ground, which is not safe.
Grounding is only for fault currents, it is not a conductor for carrying a load. This situation is not safe, and should be immediatly remedied.

Tell us what you wanted to accomplishy with the timer to begin with, we can provide you with a suggestion for other models of timers that will accomplish your goal and be compatible with your wiring.
It cannot be emphasized enough that you have created an unsafe situation and have the wrong timer for the application
Are there any other wires in the box? I havn't seen a answer to that. Other switches?

gj

 

Thanks for the warning, Green Jacket. Sound like I am one guy who should not be doing his own wiring....

Just to make sure I explained my scenarion properly, here it is again:

The applications are a small bathroom fan and an exterior light:

As an example, I wanted to place my exterior light on a timer, so it would go on in the evening and off at a certain hour automatically

For the exterior light (indoor switch box with 4 light switches):

The pre-existing switch on the circuit had 3 connectors: ground + 2 connectors (load and line).

The new timer had 4 wires coming out of it: ground + 3 wires (Load, Line and Neutral)

I removed the switch and connected the wires coming out of the new timer as follows:

-Ground+Neutral to Circuit Ground
-Load to Circuit Load
-Line to Circuit Line


There is no current detectable on any of the ground contacts. But I do detect 110volts when I bridge line and ground with a volt meter. I am assuming this the unsafe condition you are referring to....

There are 3 additional light switches in the same box (some 3 way and some 1 way)

There are 4 more switches in another box right above it. All else seems to be working properly.

Hope this help. I am interested in your final opinion.

Thanks

 

chfite / green jacket

I just re-read and earlier reply by chfite who wrote:

Quote

If you have a switch loop to the fan, then you would not be using the neutral as the circuit does not have one. In a switch loop, both wires are part of the hot line, just open where the switch goes. Both wires should be black. I know they aren't, but the white should be marked as black.

unquote


Question:
Does this mean that a possible solution is that I discconnect the white (neutral) wire away from ground and join it to the black (hot) wire ?


Thanks

 

He was thinking that some white wires may have been used as part of switchloops. That is not the part of this scenario. This timer needs a neutral wire,, which in home wiring is always white,,,, but not all white wires may be neutral, however they should really be marked when they are not. Do not hook that to a black or it will trip the breaker. Are there black and white wires going to some of the switches in those boxes? If so those are not neutrals, they just ran down from the fixture with one cable. Switch loop. Electric doesnt know what color the wire is.

 

sberry27

what's a "switch loop" ?

Thanks

 

supply goes to the fixture, and line from fixture tp switch is called switch loop; hence electricity loops back to its prior location.

black feed goes to white going to switch, black fromn switch to black on light, and white on light goes to white from feed.
Make sense?

How are determining the is no recognizable current on the ground from that timer? Do you have a clamp-on meter to read amps? The neutral is there for a reason.
If the grounding ere to fail before that location in the circuit, you would have a current leak at all grounding devices, posinbg a shock/electricution hazard. It only takes 5 milliamps to kill a person.

gj

 

Figured it out.

The suggestion came from the supplier of the timer, who suggested that "there's got to be a neutral wire in there hiding in the back of the box".

He was right. I found the white (neutral) wires and re-wired the timer properly.

I no longer have the hazardous condition.

THANKS TO ALL FOR YOUR HELP AND GREEN JACKET FOR THE WARNINGS. I WOULD HAVE BEEN UNKNOWINGLY AT RISK WITHOUT YOUR HELP !!!

FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY HEART

THANKS