breaker boxes


  #1  
Old 10-25-03, 12:41 PM
sparky13
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breaker boxes

I am installing 110/220 service out to our garage 65 feet. I am using 2-2-2 wire with a fourth 2 gauge braided ground. It is 18 inches down and ran in 1 1/4 electrical pvc. 1 1/4 junction boxes have been used inside and out 4 total. breaker box is a Siemens G1224B1100CU with a 100 amp main. First question is is this good so far? Second question is how high does the breaker box have to be mounted? Third question is with the fourth ground do i have to remove jumper between neutral and ground bar? Fourth question is with the 2 gauge ground running horizontal 65 feet do i still need ground rod at gagage? Thanks for any help you can give.
 
  #2  
Old 10-25-03, 01:50 PM
J
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I don't have my book to look up conduit size right now, but tell us whether you used Schedule 40 or Schedule 80 PVC. And the wire is copper? Detached garage, right?

The breaker box should be mounted such that no breaker handle is over 6'6" from the ground (or is it 6'7"? -- have to look that up too).

Yes, remove the jumper such that the grounding bar and neutral bar are electrically isolated.

Yes, you still need a grounding rod. It serves a different purpose than the grounding wire between buildings. Your grounding conductor between buildings doesn't have to be anywhere near that heavy.
 
  #3  
Old 10-25-03, 03:24 PM
CSelectric
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Switch height is 6'7" max. (I swera they added an inch to that requirement, as everyone still thinks it's 6'6"... including me if I don't catch myself.)
 
  #4  
Old 10-25-03, 06:35 PM
sparky13
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answers to your questions

wire is aluminum i didn't find copper until i had already bought aluminum. is that still ok? pvc is schedule 40. guess i should have asked questions before i started this. One more question too is it alright to turn breaker box upside down cause power is coming in from the bottom. main switch is at top of breaker box. Panel door opens from right.
 
  #5  
Old 10-25-03, 08:34 PM
frenchsparky
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ok for detached garage :


max breaker hight is 6'7" ( it became 2 meter even number to meet the international verison )

keep the netural and grounding wire separtated on "subfeed box"

2-2-2 plus 2 bare grounding wire with 1 1/4 inch pvc pipe but have to tell what version pipe thin wall or thick wall?? the thin wall is shed 40 and thick pipe is shed 80 . it can make the diffrence to get the wire in there and IMO it is pretty tight there . could use 1 1/2 pvc shd 80.


becarefull with alum wire termation make sure don't nick the wire and also use anti-oxiy compund on it and properly toqure the screw or lug.


Becarefull with main breaker it might not met the nec codes unless the handle do move horzontally on main breaker if handle move verctally you might have to invert the main breaker or get the inverted breaker from electral suppy or large home centere area ( please check with inspecter with this one this is very imporat part )

[ this is from 96 nec code :
240-81 Indicating Circuit breaker shall clearly indicate whether they are in the open"off" or closed"on" position.

Where circuit breaker handle(s) are operated vertically rather than rotationally or horizontally the "up" postion of the handle shall be the "on" postion]

(i am sure it is pretty much the same as 02 codes are now too )

merci, marc
 
  #6  
Old 10-26-03, 10:52 AM
sparky13
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more questions

what happens if you nick the wire?
 
  #7  
Old 10-26-03, 12:48 PM
hotarc
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It reduces it current-carrying capability which can result in overheating and fire.
 
  #8  
Old 10-31-03, 08:56 AM
sparky13
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splicing

is there a way to strip the wire without nicking? my wire is already about as short as it can go because i came up short about 5 feet and had to splice. splice ended up in the outside junction box and i am going to have to take it back apart because i forgot to add antioxidant. on the splice lugs i just tighten them as tight as i can using 1/4 inch wratchet with screwdriver head. if that is not correct let me know.
 
  #9  
Old 11-05-03, 09:36 AM
sparky13
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copper vs alum

After finding out all this about copper vs aluminum i've decided the aluminum needs to come out of there and proper length copper in. any tips on changing them out? I have junction boxes at all major curves. I don't want to take the risk of fire danger.
 
  #10  
Old 11-05-03, 09:52 AM
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There is nothing wrong with alum wire but I wouldnt want any splices in it if it was mine and if you shave the insulation at the ends instead of cutting around it so as not to nick it its fine. But, if you are going to replace it anyway you could go to number 3 copper and still be good for 100A. The 4th (ground) wire needs to be only number 8 for 100A so that helps with the conduit fill and the cost.
 
  #11  
Old 11-05-03, 12:26 PM
sparky13
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So the aluminum would be fine as long as i take the splice apart and apply antioxidant. I did shave instead of cut around. i'm not really looking forward to try and pull more wire through because pvc condiut is complete into garage. I did use rubber tape for the splice too. Also we had an early freeze so i don't know if i can get second ground rod in till spring. Is that going to be safe?
 
  #12  
Old 11-18-03, 08:36 AM
sparky13
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update

Ok, I have put antioxidant on all splice joints, got the ground rod in, taken jumper bar out of breaker box to seperate ground and neutral, and main breaker moves horizontally so there should be no problem if I need to mount upside down. I would like to verify the breaker wiring; bare copper to ground bar, white to neutral bar, and black to breaker. Please post response.
 
  #13  
Old 11-18-03, 09:21 AM
solipsist9
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contrary to a previous post, there is something wrong with aluminum. unless it's done perfectly, al can easily become a problem. even then, those connections can loosen up over time due to aluminum's tendency to "collapse" from constant heating and cooling. the right to do it is to go back periodically and retighten the connections, but no one ever does that. personally, i have never used al and never will. the only reason why people use it is because it's cheaper. why is it allowed? look at who's on some of the code-making panels.
i'm curious. if you've run pvc the entire length, why are you pulling a cable into it and not individual conductors?
john
 
  #14  
Old 11-19-03, 10:21 AM
sparky13
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??

I'm not sure what you mean; the 2-2-2 is run thru the pvc by itself, three wires, and the ground is ran outside, buried with the pvc. Am I missing something?
 
  #15  
Old 11-19-03, 04:11 PM
rob1kva
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AL cable is just as safe as CU cable when prepared right ,have use it since I started in the industry and never had a callback. Using anti-ox, rubber splicing tape & the right kind of BUGS.Which leads me to my next question, did you say you were using lugs to make you splices? Lugs are not listed for the purpose of splicing in any cicumstances. You must use bugs that are Cu/Al rated. Post back.
 
  #16  
Old 11-19-03, 05:06 PM
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Pretty much agree with rob1kva's whole post.
I had never even seen aluminum service cable until I move from LI to upstate NY. Al URD and SEU/SER is all I can get. Cost is a non-issue. Maybe if I special order a 500' spool I can get it.
Normally we buy 500' or 1000' spools of URD for the typical 200A service. The 4/0al URD is heavy enough, thank you!

I think the whole anti-aluminum thing comes from the past use of AL romex. This WAS a problem. Especially since it was all hidden in boxes and behind walls.
 
  #17  
Old 11-19-03, 05:08 PM
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What type of cable did you install in the conduit? Also you said you used 1 1/4 junction boxes, are you sure about your sizes? For the size conductors you have the boxes should be much larger.

ALL conductors should be installed together in the conduit.
 
 

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