220v service please

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  #1  
Old 02-17-05, 05:46 PM
dirty-d
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220v service please

Hey there I need some advice on installing 220V service to my garage.
I recently purchased a 220v mig welder but I lack 220V service in my garage.
Max draw amps for the welder is 22amps.
So I purchased a 30amp double pole breaker, 60ft of 10-2 romex, and a 50amp welder receptacle picture of it here:
welder receptacle
So I have three questions
1: Is this the correct breaker and wire to use?

2: Is it safe to use a 50A female receptacle with a 30A breaker?

3: I plan on running the 10-2 to the garage (all of the 10-2 will be indoors running along my unfinished basement ceiling) into a jbox located in the garage. From the jbox I plan to wire 25ft of 10-3 (3 wire) cabtire so it will act as a hard wired extension cord so I can move the welder around. I'm using cabtire because it's alot more flexible than romex.... Finally to my question. WIll I notice power loss due to the line being so long (60ft + 25ft)?
And should I ground the jbox or is it safe to just mount it to the drywall and simply pigtail the ground wires to the screw in the jbox?

I thank you all for reading this post and greatly appreciate any helpful advice given.
Regards,
Dave C
 
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  #2  
Old 02-17-05, 06:18 PM
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Hello Dave,

It would be helpfull to have a link to the exact welder that you bought.
 
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Old 02-17-05, 06:23 PM
dirty-d
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Originally Posted by GregH
Hello Dave,

It would be helpfull to have a link to the exact welder that you bought.
Coming up in a flash!
 
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Old 02-17-05, 06:24 PM
dirty-d
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Old 02-18-05, 06:58 AM
dirty-d
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  #6  
Old 02-18-05, 12:39 PM
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1. the 30A breaker and 10-2 wire are correct, Ground the j-box with the ground on the 10-2, leave a 6 " pigtail to hook the ground wire of the 10-3 cord up.
2. What is cabtire? Is it a listed cord for the application?? In the US we would use sj cord for up to 300v apps.
3. Why the 50A recep? whats on the welder?
 
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Old 02-18-05, 01:40 PM
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I agree on the breaker and wire sizing.

Cabtire is another term for "portable device cable".
I occasionally see that description on specs for some equipment that needs to have a cord installed.
The term allows the installer to select the correct type of cord for the application. That is, SJ,SJTW, SO, SOW etc.

I don't believe it is permitted to hard wire this type of cable except in certain circumstances.

I too question the 50 amp recepticle.
Is this what is on your welder?

Also, any places the romex is exposed and subject to damage it requires mechanical protection.
 
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Old 02-18-05, 02:30 PM
dirty-d
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I'm using 50A receptacles because that's all that's available at home depot. Is it safe to use this receptacle with a 30A breaker?
 
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Old 02-18-05, 05:03 PM
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Safe?............ The plug has a rating greater than the breaker but I am unsure if the code specifically allows a plug to be supplied at less than its capacity.
I'm also not sure what good a 50 amp recepticle is, if the welder uses a 30 amp plug.

Me, I wouldn't use the 50 amp. It will just encourage someone to plug too big a load.
 
  #10  
Old 02-18-05, 10:20 PM
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You need a 30-amp receptacle. Keep looking.
 
  #11  
Old 02-19-05, 02:08 AM
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The manual I found states.
MIG-PAK 15

Recommended:
40 amp fuse
8 AWG conductors
10 AWG ground
(Copper wire in conduit)

Factory plug is
50 amp 250v three prong plug
NEMA Type 6-50P
 
  #12  
Old 02-19-05, 12:01 PM
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Just so everybody is clear here, code allows a 50-amp receptacle on a 40-amp circuit, but not on a 30-amp circuit. Sorry Dave, but if GWIZ has posted the correct information, you have to start all over from ground zero--new breaker, new cable, new everything.

Was the information that GWIZ posted not available to you when you started?
 
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Old 02-21-05, 09:24 PM
dirty-d
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Damnit!
This info was not available until now. I just asked the guy at the electrical supply what he thought a good wiring set up would be.

I do have a spare 40 amp breaker from my stove which uses gas, and I am absolutely positive no other machine will run off this plug.
Do you think I can just replace the 30 amp breaker with the 40 amp breaker and keep the 50 amp receptacles even though the 10/2 wire isn't in conduit?
 
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Old 02-21-05, 10:13 PM
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No........
 
  #15  
Old 02-21-05, 10:22 PM
dirty-d
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Ok what if I use the 40amp breaker, keep the 50 amp receptacles (50amp receptacles are the only receptacles which match my welders prongs) and replace the 10-2 with 8-2 but not in conduit, it's indoors?
 
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Old 02-21-05, 10:32 PM
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Sorry, I just noticed that you're in Ontario, so everything I said might be wrong. Anyway, if conduit is not required by your city, then you don't need conduit. In most cities in the U.S., a 40-amp breaker, 8/2 cable properly protected from physical damage and secured, and a 50-amp receptacle would be correct.
 
  #17  
Old 02-21-05, 10:59 PM
dirty-d
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Then how is it that some people run these welders off their dryer plugs without having any problems or safety issues. Dryers use 10-3 gauge and 30amp breakers correct?
ALso, where can I get info on elctrical safety codes for my country/province?
 
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