Correct wire for hooking up 220v

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Old 04-14-06, 03:37 PM
Adamls
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Correct wire for hooking up 220v

Ok I would like to replace my 110 12/2wG wire with a 220v line out to the garage.
I have several questions starting with my 200 amp house panel. It is full so can I use one of those mini double breakers to do this or am I stuck with just running a heavier wire and staying with the 110v?
Next is on the wire selection it is 150' to the garage so will a 10 gauge buryable wire be heavy enough. I run 2 florest lights and misc hand power tools only, no heat. I know that you would use a 10/2wG for the 110 circuit do you use the same wire for the 220 or should I be using a 10/3wG.
Lastly I will be installing a breaker panel in the garage do I need to drive in its own grounding stake or with the two panels being connected together will the oringinal panels grounding stake be suffieent?
Thanks for any feed back
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Adamls
I run 2 florest lights and misc hand power tools only, no heat.
If this is all you have, isn't the single 20A 120V circuit sufficient?

Improving your system is kinda involved. We'd need to know more about your existing panel and what it supplies, to determine whether you should (or physically can) add to it or not.

What's prompting you to do the work?
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:24 PM
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> I would like to replace my 110 12/2wG wire with a 220v line out to the garage.

First of all, the names for the voltages are 120V and 240V.


> my 200 amp house panel is full so can I use one of those mini double breakers

No.


> to do this or am I stuck with just running a heavier wire

You might be able to rearrange your circuits to use a piggyback breaker elsewhere to free a spot for the new breaker, or use one with four minis on it.


> on the wire selection: it is 150' to the garage so will a 10 gauge wire be heavy enough?
> I run 2 fluorescent lights and misc hand power tools only,

Perhaps.


> do you use the same wire for the 240V or should I be using a 10/3wG.

You have no choice. If you don't use four wires, you won't have 240/120V.


> I will be installing a breaker panel in the garage
> do I need to drive in its own grounding stake?

Yes.


> with the two panels being connected together will the original panel's grounding stake be sufficient?

No.
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:27 PM
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It is full so can I use one of those mini double breakers to do this or am I stuck with just running a heavier wire and staying with the 110v?
Just replacing a single pole breaker with a tandem breaker will NOT result in a 220 volt circuit. You must use a two pole breaker that connects to both phases of the 200 amp panel.

Next is on the wire selection it is 150' to the garage so will a 10 gauge buryable wire be heavy enough.
The only way to know if that is to do a load calculation and then use that to do a voltage drop calculation. The formula for a voltage drop is VD = 2*K*I*L/CM Where K=12.9 for copper wire, I=amps, L=lenght, and CM=circular mils of the wire use.

I know that you would use a 10/2wG for the 110 circuit do you use the same wire for the 220 or should I be using a 10/3wG.
This depends on what the load is. If you are running a feeder to a sub-panel at the garage you would need to have a 10/3 with ground, assuming that after the load and voltage drop calculations a #10 UF cable is OK.

Lastly I will be installing a breaker panel in the garage do I need to drive in its own grounding stake or with the two panels being connected together will the oringinal panels grounding stake be suffieent?
You must install a grounding electrode at the garage if you are using a feeder to a sub-panel. Also you need to have a disconnecting means at the garage. I would suggest that you review sections 225 part II of the NEC for requirements for a feeder to a separate structure, section 250.32 for the requirements for grounding. This is alot more challanging then people first think.

Chris
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:28 PM
Adamls
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I seem to have a high volt drop as it is currently 12/2 and running 150' + . When we runs acouple of saws the lights dim quite a bit. Measuring the voltage during that time I noticed I have only 105v in the circuit. We are doing new underground spriklers this weekend so we will have the yard trenched up so it is a perfect time to make a change.
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:34 PM
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If the yard is going to be dug up, why not run a conduit to the garage?

Just a thought.

Chris
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:35 PM
Adamls
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[QUOTE=raider1]Just replacing a single pole breaker with a tandem breaker will NOT result in a 220 volt circuit. You must use a two pole breaker that connects to both phases of the 200 amp panel.

Ok this makes sense



The only way to know if that is to do a load calculation and then use that to do a voltage drop calculation. The formula for a voltage drop is VD = 2*K*I*L/CM Where K=12.9 for copper wire, I=amps, L=lenght, and CM=circular mils of the wire use.

I went to this site and did the voltdrop calc
http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm



This depends on what the load is. If you are running a feeder to a sub-panel at the garage you would need to have a 10/3 with ground, assuming that after the load and voltage drop calculations a #10 UF cable is OK.

? Whats a "feeder" ?



You must install a grounding electrode at the garage if you are using a feeder to a sub-panel. Also you need to have a disconnecting means at the garage. I would suggest that you review sections 225 part II of the NEC for requirements for a feeder to a separate structure, section 250.32 for the requirements for grounding. This is alot more challanging then people first think.

I figured it needed grounded........................
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Adamls
We are doing new underground spriklers this weekend so we will have the yard trenched up so it is a perfect time to make a change.
Then do it right and install a 1 1/2" PVC along with another 1" for future and/or possible low voltage.
This way you can pull in individual conductors and install a real sub-panel out there.

You always need a ground rod as raider1 said.

You may very well be able to install twin (tandem, skinny) breakers in the main panel...if it will accept them. Just saying no, you can't use them is a bit premature. If it is a 30/40 panel you can install twins in the bottom 5 spaces on each side.
Tell us what the make and model of the panel are and we can guide you better.
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:37 PM
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I forgot to ask, are you in the US or Canada?
 
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Old 04-14-06, 04:46 PM
Adamls
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Originally Posted by Speedy Petey
I forgot to ask, are you in the US or Canada?
USA - it is a Square D QO panel with 30 breakers.
 
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Old 04-14-06, 05:20 PM
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What is the model number?
 
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Old 04-17-06, 09:39 AM
Adamls
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thanks for all the help, I decided it would be easier to just stay with the 120v line.
 
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