Adding An Outdoor Outlet?

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  #1  
Old 06-30-06, 04:28 PM
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Location: Sterling Heights
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Adding An Outdoor Outlet?

Last year I installed a 20amp-ground fault protected outlet in an outdoor type sealed box near my A/C condensing unit. I wanted a plug nearby so I could hook up my shop vac to clean the coil; plus if the condensing unit ever needs service, the A/C tech will have an outlet nearby if needed.
This 20amp outlet is connected to its own 20 amp breaker in the main box with 12 gauge UF.

I want to add a similar 20amp-ground fault protected outlet near my patio to plug in a radio or whatever else I might want to run while I'm basking in the sun or barbequing.

My question is this:
Can I land the 12 gauge UF from the new 20 amp patio outlet to the same 20 amp breaker that's protecting the outlet by my A/C condensing unit or, do I have to install another separate 20 amp breaker? I doubt both of these outlets would ever be used at the same time.
Thanks,
Phil
 
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  #2  
Old 06-30-06, 04:56 PM
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There is no code prohibition against this. However, the breaker may not be designed for two wires. If the breaker is designed to accommodate two wires then they can both be connected to the breaker. However, if the breaker can only accommodate one wire, then you will have to pigtail in the breaker panel so that only one wire (the pigtail) connects to the breaker.

Incidentally, unless the wire runs outside, you don't need UF wire. If the wire does run outside, you likely need to protect it with conduit.
 
  #3  
Old 06-30-06, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by racraft
Incidentally, unless the wire runs outside, you don't need UF wire. If the wire does run outside, you likely need to protect it with conduit.
The main panel is in the basement (Michigan) and and the wire is stapled to the floor joists and then goes through the wall; to the outside. On the outside, the wire comes through the wall (near the ground) from there the wire runs through about 2 feet of conduit to the outlet.
Sound okay?

Also, don't know about the breaker. How do I know if it can accomodate two wires? Two screws?
Thanks,
Phil
 
  #4  
Old 06-30-06, 06:20 PM
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Smile Uf

Hello, just a few thoughts:

Is the outlet installed by the A/C closer to the proposed patio outlet location than the patio distance to the panel? Or is the route easier to install than routing to the panel?

UF: Something to remember

"If the cable is buried directly in the earth, the minimum burial depth permitted is 24 inches if the cable is unprotected and 18 inches when a supplemental covering, such as a 2-inch concrete pad, metal raceway, pipe, or other suitable protection, is provided." Minimum cover for conduit is 18".

I have never had an inspector that would sign up for two wires on a breaker, unless it was the "piggy back" model which has two separate attachment terminals but also has two seperate switches.

Most inspectors frown on wire connections inside the panel but most let it pass anyway after making their comments, especially when it is adding to an existing panel. Some will not allow connections to be made in a new panel installation.

Remember, this outlet also needs GFCI protection. If you used a GFCI breaker, no problem but hots, neutrals, and grounds will have to be connected with one pigtail each to the various attachments or the GFCI will not function correctly. If you used a GFCI outlet for the A/C area you can run from the load side of that outlet to the patio outlet without purchasing another outlet.


Peace
 
  #5  
Old 06-30-06, 10:27 PM
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I did what you want to....

I did exactly what you want to do....
I had 12nm wire from the 20 amp fuse directly to a gfci plug outside.

Use good outdoor calk to seal the hole you drill in the side of your house.

I would make a junction box hanging somewhere in your basement from the wire connected to the fuse and run the line to the other side. Drill a hole above the foundation and calk it.
You can run multiple outlets.
 
  #6  
Old 07-01-06, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Philossifer
How do I know if it can accomodate two wires? Two screws?
Thanks,
Phil
You'll have to look at the rating embossed on the breaker or an identical breaker. For example my CH20 is embossed on the side adjacent to the screw. It says:
(1) #8-14 AL/CU 20 LB/IN
(2) #10-14 CU ONLY 30 LB/IN

Which means I can connect one 8, 10, 12, or 14 AWG aluminum or copper wire and I must torque to 20 LB/IN.
...
or I can connect two 10, 12, or 14 AWG only copper wires and I must torque to 30 LB/IN.

LB/IN is "pounds per inch" and I am not sure if that's the same unit as inch-pounds which is how my arm is calibrated. I am too lazy to check, so you're on your own there.
 
  #7  
Old 07-03-06, 10:53 AM
Join Date: Dec 2005
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LB/IN is "pounds per inch" and I am not sure if that's the same unit as inch-pounds which is how my arm is calibrated. I am too lazy to check, so you're on your own there.
I hate to be a nit picker Arg, but everyone knows that arms are calibrated in ft/lbs and fingers in in/lbs.

There are six accurate levels of fastener torque - no measuring instruments required.

Finger tight
Hand tight
Wrench tight
Grunt torque
Star torque

and lastly
Soprano torque
 
  #8  
Old 07-03-06, 10:55 AM
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,188
LB/IN is "pounds per inch" and I am not sure if that's the same unit as inch-pounds which is how my arm is calibrated. I am too lazy to check, so you're on your own there.
I hate to be a nit picker Arg, but everyone knows that arms are calibrated in ft/lbs and fingers in in/lbs.

There are six accurate levels of fastener torque - no measuring instruments required.

Finger tight
Hand tight
Wrench tight
Grunt torque
Star torque

and lastly
Soprano torque
 
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