AFCI breaker with 14/3

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  #1  
Old 11-07-06, 06:29 PM
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Question AFCI breaker with 14/3

I need to add a AFCI breaker to complete my basement finishing project. I have a 14/3 wire carrying two circuits that I need AFCI on. I need a two pole breaker, and have found a GE model that has a single switch for both circuits online.

How can I tell if the new breaker will fit before I order it? I have Square D breakers now.

Has anyone ever seen a two pole AFCI breaker with a switch for each circuit?

Thanks in advance.
 
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  #2  
Old 11-07-06, 06:30 PM
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As far as i know stick with whatever makes your panel. In your case it would be square D. I am unsure of what you are asking tho.
 
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Old 11-07-06, 06:39 PM
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"Has anyone ever seen a two pole AFCI breaker with a switch for each circuit?"


There is no such thing.
You need a two-pole ACFI breaker. Use ONLY what is proper for your panel. If the panel is SqD then nothing but SqD will be proper.
Is it a QO or HOM panel?
 
  #4  
Old 11-07-06, 06:46 PM
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It's a QO panel.

I looked on Square D's website and I can't find a two pole circuit breaker.
 
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Old 11-07-06, 07:14 PM
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actually you can use any breaker that is UL listed to be installed in the panel. There are several companies that have gone to great lengths to have their breakers listed for use in other brands of panels.

So be sure that whatever breaker you do use is listed for use in the panle you have.

from what I could find on their website, you are correct. They do not seem to make a 2 pole afci QO breaker.

http://ecatalog.squared.com/catalog/173/html/sections/06/17306011.html

§Has anyone ever seen a two pole AFCI breaker with a switch for each circuit?

why would they make such a thing. It would defeat the purpose of a 2 pole breaker would it not?

Petey, you are good at code situations. Is it legal to tie 2 single pole breakers together to effectively make a 2 pole? I know it used to be done all the time, just don;t know if it is legal.
 
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Old 11-07-06, 07:29 PM
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I was confused about the two switches also, but the inspector I talked to today was telling me there was such a thing. But, he also did tell me that SqD made a two pole AFCI breaker.

I don't really care about getting two switches. I'm just having trouble finding a two pole AFCI to fit my panel. If I have to take out the 14/3 and put in two 14/2's I have to rip out A LOT of existing drywall.

Any ideas on how I can find other brands that are UL listed for a QO panel?
 
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Old 11-07-06, 08:04 PM
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offhand I can;t tell you. I always simply try to stick with same name.

I do shop at a supplier that has a chart listing a lot of interchange with the brand they carry (actually the other way around. lists panels thier breakers are listed to be used in)

. They carry either cutler-hammer or siemens. I don;t remember offhand. I would suggest either cruising the carious brand websites of call wholesale houses that sell various brands and ask them if thier brand is UL listed to use in QO panels.


maybe some others here can aid a bit more.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 04:10 AM
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In many instances two single pole breakers with a a handle tie satisfy the requirement of a two-pole breaker. This cannot be the case thought with AFCIs and GFCIs. They MUST be two-pole if used with a multi-wire circuit.

Square D is very proprietary about selling their products.
Find an authorized stocking Sq D dealer and you found someone who either has one or can get you one.

***Upon further searching I only find single pole AFCIs in QO. Maybe there is someone more who know if SQ D is now making a QO 2-pole AFCI?***

There are companies that make QO compatible breakers, but I seriously doubt they make AFCIs.
 
  #9  
Old 11-08-06, 09:03 AM
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Why do you need an AFCI? Is part of the project a bedroom?
 
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Old 11-08-06, 05:26 PM
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More over, Why do you need a 2-pole AFCI?
Code calls for 120v ckts.

What is in the basement that needs AFCI?
A Bedroom? Is it a legal bedroom (based on building code def.)?

Most building codes have wireing codes aswell, you must referance both for a "true" complete/compliant job.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 05:35 PM
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Lee, in the OP he states 14/3 carrying two circuits.

I do agree though about needing/wanting AFCIs.
Is this a legal bedroom? In a basement?
There are some very strict rules regarding bedrooms in basements.

You may not want to call it a BR for liability reasons.
You may not want to use it as a BR for safety reasons.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 06:09 PM
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It is a legal bedroom in the basement. It is a walkout, so we have a good egress route.

I have all the proper permits which is why I must have the AFCI. I won't pass the final inspection without it.

I called SqD today and they said they don't make a two pole AFCI for the QO panel. They didn't give me any help on finding alternative manufacturers. The five distributors I called today couldn't help either. I'm going to call some other manufacturers tomorrow, but I don't think the part exists.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 06:14 PM
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Cool

Sorry as I read I lost the 14/3 post.

As Far as a 2pole AFCI, I have not seen one nor do I feel there is a need for one. The code calls for 120V ckts only.Never really thought about this application though.Perhaps "they" want us out of this practice.
Add a 220v AC unit the're not required.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 06:16 PM
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Well, how difficult would it be to split the neut on the 2 circuits so you could use 1 (or 2 if needed) AFCI breaker(s)?

It's getting to the point that may be your best and maybe only fix.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 06:16 PM
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It's a bit of work, but short of re-running the homerun with two 2-wires, you can install a 2-space Cutler-Hammer BR series sub-panel next to the main panel.
Install the two pole BR series AFCI breaker there.
 
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Old 11-08-06, 06:24 PM
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Could the OP, splice the red and black to make one ckt? then only 1 AfCI is needed (in a JB outside the panel).
Quick do the calcs. Nothing says the Den cannot be AFCI.
Just a thought.
 
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