Pre-Drilling Studs B4 framing.

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Old 01-05-07, 09:37 AM
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Pre-Drilling Studs B4 framing.

Hi Everyone,

I am trying to get a permit for a major re-model. Since its going to take months & months I am trying to think of ways in advance to make things easier IF & when I ever get said permit.

I have read about puting a bunch of 2x6 studs in a stack and cutting a V notch right in the middle where they will attach to sole plate. this would allow 2 wires (cables) to be run & would only have to drill corners. Is there something wrong with the wires running right on top of sole plate? (carefully stapled dead center)

If not OK then what about pre-drilling (2) 7/8" holes dead center in every stud. What height would you drill the holes at? Is there a certain height that horizontal runs must be above sole plate? Is it better for the wires to be above the receptacle boxes or below. What is easiest or most common?

Might sound crazy to pre-drill but I know from experience that drilling after framing is a lot of work especially corners and studs that are closer together than 16". Maybe ONE 7/8" hole would be enough since (2) 12-2 wires can be run through one hole (correct?)

Any other helpfull advice greatly appreciated. I have completely re-wired an existing house including new 200 amp panel but I haven't done much "new construction" work.

Also - what order would you prefer electrical to be done. I assume you would want rough plumbing & hvac to be installed B4 electrical if you have a choice right?

Thanks for any advice.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 10:15 AM
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You will have to see what your local requirement is for bore diamter. NEC requires at least 1 1/4" on each side of the bore. You can knotch out the stud, but have to have a steel plate covering it so it does not get nailed.

I haven't seen anything in the NEC that says you can't run 2 12-2 cable through one hole. If that was not allowed, then the wall studs would look like swiss cheese running all that cable.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 10:31 AM
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Why will it take "months and months" for a permit?
 
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Old 01-05-07, 11:21 AM
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Mark, the notch he is describing is on the bottom of the stud, not in the face, so no nail plate would be required.
I myself think this is a crazy idea. Doing old work we have to drill up into existing stud bays all the time. The thought of a wire running right on the sole plate is a scary one to me!


I also think pre-drilling is nuts myself. The holes will line up probably less than 50% of the time and you have to be conscious of where the holes are every time you cut a stud. Besides, you do not have to drill every stud. Most, but not every.
Drilling is REALLY not that big of a deal. A MUCH better idea would be to spring for a really good drill. You will be much happier with that decision, and you will have yourself a nice drill after the job is done.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 01:04 PM
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OK -so it was a dumb idea.......

I beleive 7/8" is max dia. allowed. In a 2x6 stud that still leaves 2.25" on either side if your close to center. 7/8" is real easy to pull TWO 12-2 cables thru.

Am I correct that its ok to pull 2 but not 3 cables due to heat buildup or whatever? (Or you'd have to derate them or something) Just talking about 14-2 or 12-2 cables for lites & receptacles (NOT oven or 10-2 size cables)

So at what level do you like to run horizontal if your receptacles are at about 12" above subfloor? I guess it might be easier to shoulve wires into the outlet boxes from above?

I agree with the comment about drilling up through sole plate later. That does make sense putting horizontal run up out of way of later work.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 01:08 PM
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To Wayne: How much time you got? Its a long story - do you have much experience dealing with permit issues? I could sure use advice!

Ever heard of 50% re-construction or renovation stuff? I can start there IF your intrested..............City & BO are total PITA in my opinion but maybe it's just me?
 
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Old 01-05-07, 03:56 PM
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Is this a Hysterical..umm....historical job?

New construction or renovation? Partial add with renovation?

I assume the "months and months" is due to Building permit issues.

1) Do not pre drill. 1A)The carpenter framer will want you "dead by the second wall. 1B) you'll want the framer "dead" by the 3rd upside down stud.
1C) you'll want to kill yourself if you are doing the frameing. Nothing good will come from this idea.

Residential boxes are typicaly 18" AFF. Switches 48" AFF (top of box).

You can run horizontal if you want or you can go up/over and down or inverse.

great idea to let the plumbers and HVAC get outa' your way first,They can be brutal (wink). Now that your framer (or yourself) hates you,You don't want them not likeing you too. You'll need all the friends you can get.

In MA. You need the structure closed in before rough.This is windows exterior doors (some want siding) and the roof (shingled). Again these may be local issues.

Don't sweat the little stuff, You'll go crazy! Roll with it and negotiate best you can. Good Luck.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 05:08 PM
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Thanks "Lectric" AND Everyone else.
Nothing but hysterical - I thought I was doing good to get rid of old 6" un-reinforced stem wall foundation and putting in a whole new 1 st floor with a nice 8" mono-poured conc. found. What the H was I thinking. Buried deep in the last pages of zoning was a 50% "renovation clause" which say any alteration exceeding 50% of existing bldg. value means upgrading EVRYTHING to 2003 or 2006 IRC. Also would mean $12K sprinkler system.
Now I have to keep shrinking & shrinking my plan to get under this because If I could afford to do all that crap I wouldn't be foolishly trying to do it myself.
I will Not predrill my studs.

Thanks for your help everyone.
 
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Old 01-05-07, 05:11 PM
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The best way i can see around that would be to do it in stages if possible...kinda like contracts...If you don't have the 2 million allowances bid the job out in 6 different contracts (dates) just a suggestion if it will work
 
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Old 01-05-07, 05:35 PM
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Thumbs up

Now thats a good idea! It may take some re-engineering to get the peices to fit, But if planned out right one end could nicely segway to the next, with propper provisions built in.

Hell, You got all this time now...... Plan "B" ?

I like thinkers, their so crafty
 
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Old 01-06-07, 10:54 AM
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Around here if you build any outside structure or add on to the building more than 30% of the original square footage, you have to clear cut a 70' perimeter around your house. (We live in a wildfire prone area.) So if you have a 1600 sq ft house and want to put in a 600 sq ft deck, you can have zero trees around your place for 70'. So what folks will do is build multiple smaller decks at different times that just happen to join together...

We wound up nixing the concrete patio (considered a permanent outside structure) and instead are doing a flagstone patio (considered temporary) so we could have a larger deck and not have to clear cut. Oh and you have to pay another $200 for someone to come out and determine whether you have to clear cut or not.
 
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Old 01-06-07, 01:30 PM
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Aren't these "huggers" against cutting down forests? Now they mandate it?
Is this the building code or insurance? Fortunately I can't relate. but I can see the reasoning,unless you're against the trade winds.
I'm confused.. I love the enviroment too..But.. Make up my mind.

I'm surprised they let you build.
 
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Old 01-06-07, 01:35 PM
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Ahh.....frame it and then drill it...as Speedy says.....just not worth the agrivation of trying to make sure they are all lined up in the end....we drill them everyday of the week and they line up fine.

Just not worth the hassle to pre-drill anything with regards to running the wires through studs.
 
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Old 01-07-07, 05:04 AM
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My personal preference is to not run wires through wall studs. I prefer to run them through the top plate. This uses more wire, but there is ZERO chance of ever nailing through a wire.

As far as pre-drilling, if you knew you had a lot to do, pre-drilling makes sense to me. If you use a drill press with a stop, the holes will be at exactly the same spot in every stud. Go ahead and nail the stop plate on both sides while you are at it.

For the contractor.. do you really want a contractor who won't (or can't) follow your instructions on something as simple as 'put the hole near the bottom' ?

Since you've already said you are doing this yourself, you will pay far more attention than any contractor ever would.

Go tell a contractor you want a 500' x 500' concrete slab, level by no less than 1/2" and he will laugh at you, yet the Egyptians managed it over 5000 years ago.
 
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