grounding a dishwasher

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  #1  
Old 01-06-07, 07:37 AM
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grounding a dishwasher

I changed dishwasers and in the process of connecting the water inlet (metal Flex line) it touched the sink drain which is brass and it causes a spark. rechecked the electrical connections and all are good. when i disconnected the ground wire to the dishwasher , the sparking stopped and the DW still worked. I also noticed that the kitchen lights flicker while doing all of this. The panel is 100AMP circuit breakers, and the feed to the DW is a dedicated 15AMP breaker. Any suggestions.


Thanks,

CB


[racraft: To start a new post, use the "New Thread" button on the main electrical page.]
 

Last edited by racraft; 01-06-07 at 07:50 AM.
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  #2  
Old 01-06-07, 07:52 AM
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Verify that your electrical service is properly grounded and that your incoming water pipes are part of grounding system, or if they are non-metal that the pipes in your house are properly bonded to the grounding system.
 
  #3  
Old 01-06-07, 08:12 AM
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Thanks Racraft

Thanks for the help, i found the ground wire to be loose but thought I tightened it pretty good, I am going to check for a grounding rod .

CB
 
  #4  
Old 01-06-07, 08:52 AM
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A ground rod will NOT solve this. A ground rod does NOT provide a ground. Racraft's point was about the water pipes being grounded/bonded.

Your problem lies with your water bond. Verify that your service is bonded to the copper pipes in your house. If they are, verify that there is no plastic filter, etc, that is breaking the bond.
 
  #5  
Old 01-06-07, 09:31 AM
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Cabcab, be careful. Your drain pipe may have become accidentally livened up and the drain pipe is not bonded. Or, the ground wire to the dishwasher may be accidentally alive and not really bonded to ground.
 
  #6  
Old 01-06-07, 09:40 AM
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If there was a spark when the diswasher was connected to the water supply it means that SOMETHING attached to the water line is using it for a neutral return or that a hot wire is in contact with it. Either way, the dishwasher ground is providing the return to the panel when the dishwasher is connected to the water line. You getting between the water line and grounded dishwasher could be lethal. As these issues can even be a problem at a nieghbors house it is IMPERATIVE you make sure you have a good connection between the incoming water line and the panel. I'd really recommend a pro do this if you don't see any obvious problems as stuff like this kills people.
 
  #7  
Old 01-06-07, 10:20 AM
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Bonding is critical. Check from panel to water line comming in, there should be a bond wire connecting them. The water meter should have a jumper (street side to house side) incase of plastic seals.

Additionaly if the water comes into a filter system first (before going to fixtures) there should be a bonding jumper installed there aswell.
I've seen many houses done this way with plastic filters, the end use plumbing MUST be bonded.

Also, I have seen this problem with hot air furnaces, The flexible transition at the unit has not been jumped,therefore leaving the duct work unbonded.
 
  #8  
Old 01-07-07, 04:42 AM
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problem fixed

Well guys, thanks for all the advice. The problem was the grounding wire was loose and attached to the water supply pipe which is somewhat rusty and corroded. The water supply from the street was actually hot from this (i mean hot like a heating pipe). I shut off the main power breaker and reclamped the ground wire to copper nipple going into the meter. Also there is another jumper ground from one side of the meter to the other side. I believe the town did this when they installed a radio meter read device, so they don't have to come inside to read the water meters.

Any way problem solved, no more sparking and no more flickering lights, and I thank you all once again.

CB
 
  #9  
Old 01-07-07, 06:50 AM
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Cabcab, you should not have that much current flow to your water pipe. Your neutral current may be going out your water service instead of back on the neutral conductor. You may have a bad neutral connection at your panel, or meter, or at the utility connection. There's a remote chance that you could be getting a current flow from a neighbor. In any case the neutral connections needs to be checked. Be careful to not put yourself in series with your grounding electrode conductor or you could get shocked. Better still, have an electrician check this out. Bad neutral connections can cause your electronic stuff to fry.

This is a potentially dangerous situation and needs immediate attention.
 

Last edited by yanici; 01-07-07 at 08:49 AM.
  #10  
Old 01-07-07, 01:45 PM
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If you suspect a loose neatrel the PoCo will ocme out immediatly, and for free and recheck their end.
 
  #11  
Old 01-07-07, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by burkej62 View Post
If you suspect a loose neatrel the PoCo will ocme out immediatly, and for free and recheck their end.

I do not know where you live, but my experience is that the POCO is quick to deny it is their problem, and if they do send a truck the lineman will look for less than ten minutes before insisting that it is on your side of the meter and leave.

I have been on jobs like this and had to get them back out for the third or foruth time, before then said "oops" and fixed one of thier connections.
 
  #12  
Old 01-07-07, 04:04 PM
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My POCO was very good when I called them to report a lost neutral. Because of this site, I knew what the symptoms meant when I saw them. I called the POCO and told them that I had lost the neutral to my house and within an hour, they had found a treelimb had fallen and broken the neutral conductor on the overhead feed.
 
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