receptacle question


Old 02-05-07, 09:54 PM
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receptacle question

can i run power into a receptacle and then from that run out 2 seperate cables to 2 different receptacles
so if u dont really understand that, i wanna run 2 receptacles in parallel i guess

feed---->receptacle1---->receptacle a
feed---->receptacle1---->receptacle b
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Old 02-05-07, 10:53 PM
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The short answer is: probably. You will have to pigtail to the receptacle since you will have more conductors than what can be connected to the receptacle itself.

You also need to check the box size to make sure you have adequate space for all the conductors. See NEC Article 314.16 for code regarding conductor fill in general, and Table 314.16(A) for conductor fill allowances. For 14 AWG, you need a minimum 18.0 box for nine conductors, and for 12 AWG, you need a minimum 21.0 box for nine conductors.

Finally, check your existing conductor gauge, and the circuit breaker size that protects the circuit you are tapping. Install the same gauge cable and corresponding rated receptacles. For example, if the circuit uses 14 AWG cable, and has a 15 amp circuit breaker, then use 14 AWG cable and 15 amp rated receptacles for the new stuff. (You could use 12 AWG cable but it wouldn't be cost effective, and it could fool somebody later into thinking the entire circuit is 12 AWG and therefore rated for 20 amps.)

Best wishes.
Old 02-06-07, 05:27 AM
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However, there are not nine conductors in this setup. There are only 7 as far as box fill count is concerned. Only the current carrying conductors are counted as one each. The grounds together count as one.
Old 02-06-07, 06:38 AM
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Box fill

The receptacle counts as two, making a total of nine.
Old 02-06-07, 07:03 AM
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Yes, the device (in this case a receptacle is counted), but you don't count the ground wires.

Someone unfamiliar with these calculations might get confused, as it just so happens that three 14-2 cables (and three 12-2 cables) have nine conductors. Adding another 14-2 (or 12-2) cable to the mix would add 2 conductors, not three.

Bottom line. For this situation, each current carrying conductor is counted as one. All the grounds together are counted as one. Each device is counted as two.
Old 03-09-10, 08:34 AM
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Bringing back an old post to help me clear some confusion on fill calculations.
If I have a regular wall plug outlet is that called two receptacles or one? Each outlet has two plug hole configurations which I would think is a receptacle. Since each receptacle is counted as 2 fills then one wall plug outlet would be 2*2 = 4 fills? Or is a receptacle another term for the wall plug outlet and it would only count as 2 fills. In that case a two gang outlet box with two outlets in it would be 2*2 fills. Confused.

EDIT: Since a switch is counted as 2 then I am guessing a complete outlet (2 plugs) is counted as 2. So a double gang outlet would be 2*2 = 4 fills.
Old 03-09-10, 09:16 AM
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Each yoke is counted as two fill units, regardless of what type of device is mounted on the yoke. It can be a duplex receptacle, simplex receptacle or switch -- for two fill units.
Old 03-10-10, 09:23 AM
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The current outlet box is 21 cu in metal. So by changing from one receptacle to two receptacles should be fine with 12-2 w/g wire.

2*2.25+2*2.25+1*2.25 = 15.75 cu in.

I pulled the cover and the current wiring looks questionable to me. The run is 1/2" EMT. The hot & neutral look correct, but the ground bothers me. There is no ground wire to the panel. There is just a ground wire from the receptacle to the box. It depends on the conduit to make a good electrical connection to the panel. Should there also be a dedicated ground wire tied to the bus bar? This type of wiring that depends on structure for grounds always bothers me. I like to see true ground wiring, but I don't know what the code calls for.
Old 03-10-10, 09:31 AM
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Using the conduit for ground is code compliant so long as it is metallic and continious.
Old 03-10-10, 09:35 AM
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Thank you. Yes, in this case it is all metal and continuous. I am surprised they allow this.
It seems like it could easily end up with a joint / connection with a large resistance and poor path. I guess I just so used to working on cars and seeing ground problems due to weathered connections.

Would code not allow a ground wire to be run in the EMT from the box back to the panel ground bus?
Old 03-10-10, 02:26 PM
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Cars see much more corrosive conditions than a stick of EMT attached to the wall. Grounding through EMT and fittings is used all the time in commercial applications with no issues. Code does not prohibit running a separate ground wire in any way. It is commonly done with the use of isolated ground receptacles.

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