Lots o' Range Questions

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  #1  
Old 03-25-07, 03:38 PM
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Lots o' Range Questions

Hello, I'm new here, but have been doing a bit of reading on the site for a while. Anyway, I'm doing some kitchen renovation work. My house was built in the early 70s and seems to have copper wire through-out the house, however uses Aluminum wire for the cooktop and wall oven. It appears to be 3 connector (I say appears because I have not disconnected it to find out yet - it's labed 6AL-3). My plan is to replace both appliances with a freestanding range in a different location (about 4 ft away). My new range is a dual-fuel so only requires electric for the oven (top is gas), therefore only requires a 30 amp circuit. The directions also say it can be connected via 3 or 4-wire, and it recommends a plug.

Before I found out it was AL wire, I was planning to re-route the existing wire to a new out. Because of the AL and the three wire, however, I now believe I'm best off buying new copper wire and replacing the entire run back to the breaker. Does that seem correct? Also, 10/3 AWG or 8/3 AWG? And will I have to replace the breaker that was previously used with AL or should I just replace it anyway because its old and cheap to do?

Thanks,
Guy

PS...I have an additional question about GFCI outlets. I have two GFCI outlets above the counter on the sink wall. As far as I can tell, they each have their own circuit breaker that controls only them and nothing else (I've spending some time verifying all the breakers). It there anything wrong with using one circuit? Additionally, could I replace one of the GFCI outlets with a non-GFCI connected to the load-side of the first GFCI? I'm trying to open up breaker locations for some future room additions.
 

Last edited by 4thisguy; 03-25-07 at 03:49 PM. Reason: Additional Question
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  #2  
Old 03-25-07, 03:57 PM
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Aluminum wire in this gauge used for stove is not a problem. Only the smaller gauge (#14 & #12) used for branch circuits has been a problem. I would just used what is there if it is long enough to reach your new location.
 
  #3  
Old 03-25-07, 04:03 PM
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It is long enough...the new location is closer to the breaker and I have access to the attic were the cables are run and dropped down.

There is a chance I'm going to have to drop from the attic into crawl space then go back up to the location...is that a problem? What would I need to do (conduit?) to have the new outlet on the wall not inside? The new location happens to be right in front of a pocket door so I can't run in the wall where I'd like to.
Thanks,
Guy
 
  #4  
Old 03-25-07, 04:25 PM
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You're going to have to talk with your inspector to see if he's going to require that the circuit be brought up to current code as a part of this remodel.
 
  #5  
Old 03-25-07, 07:29 PM
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I would run anew circuit if it is easy enough to do. An inspector may require it. I would run at least 8 gage copper wire (8/3 with ground), possibly even 6 gage. However, since the range only needs 30 amps I would protect with a 30 amp breaker. The larger wire would allow for an all electric range in the future.

You need 2 circuits serving the counter top. One is not enough.

If you want to free up breaker spaces then either use tandem breakers, if you are able, or install a larger main panel, or install a sub panel. Do not look to eliminate circuits.
 
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Old 03-26-07, 03:54 AM
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If you are getting a new range, and the run is easy, your best bet is to run new #10cu circuit. I assume this is a 120/240v circuit so 10/3 would be correct.
That said I see NO reason to waste money on upsizing this circuit. Since everything is new, and the run is easy, in 30 years if you replace this range, run the circuit again. I think to run #6 is pointless.


On the other topic, I do agree, DO NOT re-do the kitchen receptacles. Find room other ways.
Add tandems if your panel will accept them or install a small sub-panel.
 
  #7  
Old 03-26-07, 04:28 PM
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>> electric for the oven (top is gas), <<


I've never heard of this, sheltered life perhaps.


Why would they make the oven electric and gas on top? I'm sure there's a reason but I'll be darned if I can think of one.

Thanks

Baldwin
 
  #8  
Old 03-26-07, 05:34 PM
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It's affectionately known as "Dual Fuel". VERY popular these days.
Seriously.
 
  #9  
Old 03-26-07, 07:33 PM
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One reason to make the oven electric and the top gas is for cleaning. It is only recently (compared to electric ovens) that they developed the technology to make gas ovens able to get hot enough to self clean. However, that technology comes with a price. elf cleaning in a gas oven increases the price quite a bit. Self cleaning ability in an electric oven is no additional cost.

Another reason to make the oven electric is the heating issue. Electric ovens have much more steady and uniform heat. Gas ovens have much wider fluctuations in temperature.

Most chefs, if they could choose one style only, would want gas burners and an electric oven.
 
  #10  
Old 03-31-07, 09:04 AM
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Yes, the reason for dual fuel is my preference in cooking. I like the even heat of the electric oven and much prefer the precise control of gas cooktops.

Thanks for the advice. I think I agree that I will re-run with 10/3 copper, replace the breaker the current 40 amp breaker with a 30 amp, and put in a 30 amp receptical. Frankly, I'm not sure I'll be here more than a few years, so if someone needs an all electric range, they can redo the whole run themselves.

On the counter top outlets (sink side)...what is the reason that these need to be on separate circuits (just trying to understand the rational).

I also have two outlets on another counter area (no sink) that were previously on the same circuit as the microwave. Since I move the microwave, I took that circuit to make it dedicated to the microwave. I'm eliminating one of the two other outlets, but would like to keep one. Is there a problem tying that it with a circuit that passes by (it supplies power to outlets in an adjoining room).

Thanks,
Guy
 
  #11  
Old 03-31-07, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by 4thisguy View Post
...what is the reason that these need to be on separate circuits (just trying to understand the rational)...
NEC requires two counter-top kitchen circuits. Even if you only have two receptacles, they have to be separate circuits. They are assuming if you are running a large blender or toaster on one, you'll be better served with a different circuit for something else, so they at least make it available, even though most homeowners don't know which ones are on which circuits anyway, which is a shame.
 
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