New pool pump trips breaker?

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Old 05-24-08, 12:52 PM
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New pool pump trips breaker?

I replaced my old (dead) pool pump this morning with a new Wayne WIP150 pump. The old pump was 1HP; the new is 1.5HP- better suited to the size of the pool.

When I put power to the pump it trips the 20 A breaker within 2-3 seconds.

The old pump had ratings of 10A/5A at 115/230. The new pump shows 17.4A/8.7A.

Do I need to increase the breaker size? If so, to 30A? Anything else I should be looking at?

Any help appreciated. Can't get in touch with Wayne until Monday...

Tom
 
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Old 05-24-08, 01:30 PM
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If you look at the paper work that came with the pump it will more then likely show that you need a 25amp C/B with the 1.5 HP pump. Now the question what size wire was used with the old pump? If it was a 14 gage wire you have the wrong size wire. If by chance you need a 30 amp C/B you may need a number 10 wire.
 
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Old 05-24-08, 01:34 PM
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Motor and pump loads will draw several times the running current while starting. It sounds like yours is pulling too much for the breaker.

Do not upsize the breaker without the proper size wire in place.
 
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Old 05-24-08, 02:17 PM
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Oh, no!

Thanks for the quick replies.

The existing wire is just 12 GA.

According to this link http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm ,

it appears 12 GA wire can handle up to 9.3 A for current transmission.

There is nothing in the manual concerning breaker size/wire size. It's a generic manual that covers different models.

Where can I get a definite answer???
 

Last edited by TomLusk; 05-24-08 at 02:32 PM. Reason: Clarification
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Old 05-24-08, 02:47 PM
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First of all, forget that link when calculating wire ampacities for premise wiring, you need to use the tables published in the National Electrical Code.

Further, because this is a motor load there are additional requirements and rules.

Generally, a #12 copper wire is limited to a 20 Ampere circuit breaker but IF this wire serves ONLY the motor (no other receptacles or lights or anything) then you may increase the size of the circuit breaker PROVIDED the motor has local overload protection. Usually the motor will have a thermal overload device as part of the motor itself. It may be a manual rest or it may be automatic.

Look on the motor and see if the nameplate states "thermally protected" and if it does then you may increase the size of the circuit breaker provided all the other items I mention in the preceding paragraph are true.
 
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Old 05-24-08, 07:12 PM
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First thing first.,, the link you got is not used at all for building wiring the NEC and CEC codes have specific details on the ampcapitcy on the wires itself.

Normally #12 awg size is rated for 20 amp circuits.

But there is a specal cause to use more ampcapity on Motor load only it very speficed on Art 430 and Art 440.

Right now what voltage the old motor used to be wired on for ? and new motor what voltage it is on now ??

I did check the website of that motor and by factory default is on 240 v.

so double check all the connection first to make sure nothing funny going on with it.

If everything is ok. this part not very often i will suggest but try to throttle the discharge port or intake port to throttle back a little maybe the water flowage is too much for the pump to handle. [ i will keep this option as last resort if other items are ok ]

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 05-25-08, 09:57 AM
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No progress...



The circuit serves the pool pump only - no lights, outlets, etc.

The pump is thermally protected, and auto-resets after approx. 5 seconds. It is set for 220V. Previous pump was running on 220V for several years.

I replaced the 20A breaker with a new 30A breaker, and it makes no difference.

Ideas?
 
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Old 05-25-08, 10:23 AM
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It is set for 220V.
Why didn't you mention this before? If it is tripping a 30 ampere circuit breaker then something is seriously wrong with the motor or the installation.
 
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Old 05-25-08, 10:36 AM
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Tell us the color of each of the wires at the motor and how they are hooked up. Replace the 30a breaker with a 20a breaker before testing again. (An 8.7 amp motor does not need a 30 amp breaker. It should even run on a 15a breaker.)

Just to ask the obvious you do have 240V at the pump don't you?
 
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Old 05-25-08, 11:22 AM
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Sorry...

Originally Posted by furd View Post
Why didn't you mention this before? If it is tripping a 30 ampere circuit breaker then something is seriously wrong with the motor or the installation.
I guess I assumed you would know that I would have the pump running at 240V, so I didn't mention it.

The previous pump was running on 240 (1HP) and didn't ever trip the breaker.

The wiring right from the panel is 12/2 AWG Pirelli. Both wires inside (aside from the ground) are black and there are only two connectors where they can go in the pump. I confirmed the pump is set for 240 - there is a switch inside.

If I switch the pump setting over to 120 from 240 and wire it to a 15A single pole breaker would this tell me anything? If the problem is with the pump, I'd like to exchange it ASAP.

Thanks for your patience with me on this one.
 
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Old 05-25-08, 12:15 PM
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IME, a 1.5HP motor set for 240V should work fine even on a 15A circuit. I believe something isn't right, possibly a faulty motor.
 
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Old 05-25-08, 01:20 PM
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Now we are getting somewhere now.

Ok.,, the motor is set up for 240 volts that fine.

Kinda give us a rough idea how far the pump is from subpanel and main panel because with #12 wire you are pretty close to the limit espcally with pretty long run.

You should switch back to 20 amp breaker then double check all the connection make sure they are good and tight.

I am thinking maybe a defective motor [ it possible that can happend ]

If you have voltmeter or test light that can read 240 v verify to make sure you got good 240 v if so.,,

You may want to ask someone to borrow the ampmeter [ clamp on type ] and check the current drawage on the motor it should not go over 9 amp the most when running correct otherwise you have issue with it.

Possiblty the starting switch go bad and be stuck on can really draw more current than it should be. when you start up the motor you should able hear a pretty fast click when it speed up and turn off the power to the motor it should heard click as well so you know the starting switch is function right.

if above list fail to slove the issue then you have to exchange the motor.

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 05-25-08, 08:04 PM
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Distance from panel to pump is approx. 60'.

I'll see if I can get a suitable volt meter and ammeter,but I won't be able to get back at this job for a few days.
 
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Old 05-26-08, 07:11 AM
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Is this a GFI circuit ? I'm assuming it is. You would then need to determine if this is a GFI fault or an over current fault.

The first this I would do is take the motor back and have it bench tested.
 
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Old 05-26-08, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by TomLusk View Post
The pump is thermally protected, and auto-resets after approx. 5 seconds.
The motor auto-resets? You mean, in addition to the 20 and now 30 amp breaker trip, the internal thermal overload is tripping?

What happens the instant that the motor is energized? Does it turn at all? Does it hum? It may well be defective.
 
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Old 05-26-08, 03:49 PM
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More info.

Yes it is a GFI circuit (GFI breaker). I pushed the test button on the 20A GFI breaker and nothing happens???

The motor turns and runs fine for approx. 3 seconds before tripping the breaker.

By auto-resets, I meant the breaker has to be off for 5 seconds or so before the motor will attempt to restart. I was assuming that it was taking this long for the thermal overload feature on the motor to reset.
 
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