Pool Wiring

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Old 05-26-09, 06:38 PM
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Pool Wiring

I am getting ready to install an above ground pool and would like to know if the wire for the pool pump must be run underground. I was planning on using conduit from the house to the pool We have a fence around the back yard an I wanted to know of I could attache the conduit to the fence and not need to run it underground. I live in Tennessee.

I would like to power both the pump and lights/outlets on a deck around the pool. Can I use one circuit for both the pump and lights or do I need to run two circuits?

Thanks,
Karl
 
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Old 05-26-09, 07:33 PM
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You can use an above ground conduit as you desire. If it's not reasonably protected, you'll need to use sched 80 or metal conduit.

There are a hundred (at least) rules that go along with pool wiring to keep it safe. Make sure you know all the details before you start.

(I'll leave your other question to the experts since I haven't yet wired a pool myself)

Good luck!
 
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Old 05-26-09, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by kreddick4 View Post
Can I use one circuit for both the pump and lights or do I need to run two circuits?
We'll need to know the electrical specs of both the pump and the proposed lights. If you do not know those yet, then plan for a separate circuit for each, or perhaps a multiwire circuit. Is the pump a normal pool pump or is it a cord-and-plug double-insulated pump? Is this a permanently installed above ground pool or a portable pool? The rules are substantially different for each case, so it is important we know the details before we can give proper advice.
 
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Old 05-26-09, 09:29 PM
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It will be a permanent installed above ground pool. The pump is a standard 2hp cord and plug pump rated at 16 amps/120V. I know it will require at least a 20 amp circuit with a GFCI. We don't have the lights yet but I would think they would each use a 40-60 watt bulb. I also want a couple of outlets on the deck. I know this circuit will also need to have a GFCI if on a separate circuit from the pool pump.
 
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Old 05-26-09, 10:40 PM
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Based on the size of the pump, it does need its own dedicated 20A circuit. The lights and general-purpose receptacles can share a 20A GFCI circuit.

The pump receptacle should be 10' from the rim of the pool if possible. If it must be closer, then the receptacle must be a twist-lock type and you need to use a GFCI breaker. The receptacle cannot be closer than 5' from the rim of the pool. The pump receptacle should have an in-use bubble cover if exposed to the weather.

You may need to check the manuf. spec sheet, but if the pump is double-insulated, then you are free to use any legal outdoor wiring method such as UF-B cable. If the pump is not double-insulated (or if it is not marked), then you must use the stricter requirement of PVC conduit with an insulated green ground wire.

Any of your general-purpose receptacles must be at least 10' from the pool.
 
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Old 05-26-09, 11:04 PM
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Thanks, that is what I was getting from reading the other posts. One more thing, we are also thinking of installing an underwater light. Can this share the same circuit as the general-purpose receptacles and lights? I also know that if both circuits are run in the same conduit then they both must be GFCI protected with breakers in the panel.
 
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Old 05-27-09, 09:25 AM
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As long as the wattages aren't outrageous (>= 1200W), the underwater lights may share a 20A circuit with general-purpose lighting and receptacles.

The type of underwater light you use will affect the grounding requirements of the circuit. There are basically four classes of pool light: wet niche, dry niche, no-niche (packaged UL listed assembly w/ cord and plug), and low voltage. Grounding requirements range from solid brass conduit and boxes down to a simple GFCI receptacle, so you'll need to know the type of light before getting too far with the wiring.
 
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Old 05-27-09, 04:26 PM
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I beleive the pool light will be either a low voltage or no-niche (packaged UL listed assembly w/ cord and plug). I know it hangs over the side of the pool with a cord. I did not look at it closely to determine if their was a transformer at the end of the cord or just a normal plug. Will their be a difference between the wiring for either of these?

One more item. The current panel is an older 1966 ITE load center with all breaker slots full. Do they make GFCI breakers for these older panels or will I need to install a sub-panel to install the GFCI breakers into?
 
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Old 05-28-09, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by kreddick4 View Post
I beleive the pool light will be either a low voltage or no-niche (packaged UL listed assembly w/ cord and plug). I know it hangs over the side of the pool with a cord.
That's good. You can just plug that into one of the GFCI receptacles mounted on or around the deck. The receptacle should still be 10' from the pool though. I suspect the cord on such a light should be long enough to accommodate that distance.

The current panel is an older 1966 ITE load center with all breaker slots full. Do they make GFCI breakers for these older panels or will I need to install a sub-panel to install the GFCI breakers into?
You may need to install a subpanel. Most of the old ITE panels will accept Siemens Q-series breakers, but I do not know about one that old off the top of my head.
 
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Old 06-02-09, 08:50 PM
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That's good. You can just plug that into one of the GFCI receptacles mounted on or around the deck. The receptacle should still be 10' from the pool though. I suspect the cord on such a light should be long enough to accommodate that distance.


Originally Posted by ibpooks View Post
You may need to install a subpanel. Most of the old ITE panels will accept Siemens Q-series breakers, but I do not know about one that old off the top of my head.
I am going to install a sub-panel run from a 60A breaker in the main panel. I am planing on using #6 AWG for the 2 hots and neutral and #10 AWG for the ground to run between the main and sub-panel.

I have a question on what size wire to run from the sub-panel to the pump and deck outlets. The run from the sub-panel to the outlet for the pump is about 75' on one circuit. This will be on a 20A breaker.

The second circuit will be about 80' to the first outlet on the deck. I was planing on using a 20A breaker for this also.
 
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Old 06-02-09, 09:29 PM
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Make sure to use a green insulated #10 for the ground to the subpanel (not bare copper). The rest of the subpanel plan sounds good.

You can safely use #12 conductors in black, white and green (hot, neutral and ground) for the 20A circuits to the receptacles and pump. If the circuits share a conduit out to the pool area then you only need one ground wire in the shared portion.
 
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Old 06-02-09, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ibpooks View Post
Make sure to use a green insulated #10 for the ground to the subpanel (not bare copper). The rest of the subpanel plan sounds good.

You can safely use #12 conductors in black, white and green (hot, neutral and ground) for the 20A circuits to the receptacles and pump. If the circuits share a conduit out to the pool area then you only need one ground wire in the shared portion.
I have #10 green insulated for the ground. I was wondering about using a common ground for the shared portion of the conduit run.

Can I use red in place of black for one of the two circuits to the pool so I can keep the circuits separate?

And one last question, what size conduit do I need to run from the sub-panel to the pool for the two circuits.
 
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Old 06-03-09, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by kreddick4 View Post
Can I use red in place of black for one of the two circuits to the pool so I can keep the circuits separate?
Yes. Hots may be any color except white, gray or green. Neutrals may be white or gray. Ground must be green.

And one last question, what size conduit do I need to run from the sub-panel to the pool for the two circuits.
1/2" would do it, but I would upsize to 3/4" based on almost no price bump and easier to pull / expand if necessary.
 
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