Breakers Qs

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  #1  
Old 06-24-09, 10:21 PM
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Breakers Qs

I just got a new panel installed[Cuttler Hammer cpm 130] and need some help understanding the breakers [allways had fuse panels]
Are the 15 amps with tie-bar what I would use for a split recetacle or a 15 amp 220 V circuit?
There are seven 15 amps with tie-bar in the panel. Can I remove the tie-bar and if so how,to have more single pole 15 amp breakers?
Thank you

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Old 06-24-09, 10:26 PM
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Those just look to be tandem breakers, ie, two half size breakers in the space of one. The inner pairs look like they are for 240 volt circuits.

Without looking up the specs for your panel I would guess that you cannot install any more breakers in it. You have forty circuits in there already.
 

Last edited by pcboss; 06-25-09 at 04:48 PM.
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Old 06-24-09, 11:11 PM
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Thanks for reply, sorry I dont think I was clear on my questions
I dont understand how these seven pairs of 15 amp breakers ,the ones with the tie-bar, work.
I understand that two breakers ,one above the other ,are used to supply split receptacles on the kitchen counter and that the tie-bar is needed to operate both breakers at the same time.
I wont be needing seven circuits for split receptacles so Im wondering if the tie-bar can be removed and each breaker used for two wires 15 amps circuits.
Thank you
 
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Old 06-25-09, 01:04 AM
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I really doubt that you can take the handle ties off acorrding to the type of breaker and I bearly read the breaker model number and IMO it pretty much ya can't remove the handle ties.

The only way you can do this is change the breaker to standard quad format without intertied handles before you do anything more to this I need the legit model number it will say like example 20/30C100 so look at the cover door to see model number otherwise there is a number stamped on the tub on the inside of it on the side.

Second thing make sure this is not a MWBC set up this is very crictal part. { surefire way to tell is red and black conductors at the breaker }

If everything is clear as I mention above then you can change the breaker but ask one of us we will give you the correct model for that type of breaker.

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 06-25-09, 12:23 PM
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Without looking up the specs for your panel I would guess that you cannot install any more breakers in it. You have twenty circuits in there already.
Nope, there are forty possible circuits, you have to count each individual breaker.


I really doubt that you can take the handle ties off acorrding to the type of breaker and I bearly read the breaker model number and IMO it pretty much ya can't remove the handle ties.
Look closely, those are are all twin breakers and all of the handle ties are field installed.

IF (big if) any of the handle-tied circuit breakers is NOT supplying either a Multi-Wired-Branch-Circuit OR a straight 240 volt circuit then yes, you could remove the circuit breakers from the panel and remove the field installed handle ties. However, in the United States kitchen Small Appliance Branch Circuits are required to be 20 ampere circuits and also include circuits supplying receptacles in pantries and dining areas. I don't know what other circuits these might be supplying but baseboard electric heaters is one possibility. Why don't you ask the electrician who installed the panel why there are so many handle-tied circuit breakers?
 
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Old 06-25-09, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by furd View Post
Why don't you ask the electrician who installed the panel why there are so many handle-tied circuit breakers?
While you're at it, ask him/her why nothing is labeled, geez what a pet peeve.
 
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Old 06-25-09, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by furd View Post
Look closely, those are are all twin breakers and all of the handle ties are field installed.

Furd ., Look again with the wiring connection on the right side of breaker and look for " 240 V " right next to the handle tie and if you see straght 240 volts that is factory installed handle tie and have two single pole riveted together from factory.

That model number is BRQ151515 the first two digit is outside breaker next two digit number is the center two the third digit is the last pole breaker { yeah it is a legit number }I will be back little later with photo to show what it look like.

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 06-25-09, 05:38 PM
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No pro..you guys know...but..so those are quad breakers? Makes sense from the labeling sorta...
 
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Old 06-25-09, 07:32 PM
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Well, Marc, you've probably seen more circuit breakers in the last year than I have in my entire life so I will accept what you have written. I have never seen any circuit breakers with factory installed handle ties that are of that type; all I have seen have a metal cap wrapped around the entire handle of both breakers.
 
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Old 06-25-09, 10:18 PM
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Thank you for all replies and my apologies for not having provided all the info
I while ago a got the permit to rewire the house and have not done much yet.

The new panel is in a different location and at the moment only four circuits are connected to the panel that is the reason that no labels are visible on those breakers.

The brakers in question are not in use now and I dont forsee needing all seven to supply split receptacles.

In Ontario[ Canada ]where GFI protection is not required for plug outlets on the kitchen counter, single pole 15 amp breakers with tie-bar can be used.
I will be posting the breakers model number
Thanks so much
 
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Old 06-25-09, 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by RODEL View Post
In Ontario[ Canada ]where GFI protection is not required for plug outlets on the kitchen counter, single pole 15 amp breakers with tie-bar can be used.
I will be posting the breakers model number
Thanks so much
Rodel.,

If my memory serve me right that the kitchen circuits with single pole 15 amp really the legit way is have split circuit aka MWBC that is legit but right now I don't have confirmation that they are slowly drop out that format and go with single 20 amp GFCI'ed circuit.

( I will get ahold of canada electrician in Ontario area to get the corret code verison }

Merci,Marc
 
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Old 06-26-09, 10:47 AM
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Marc merci pour reponse
for the kitchen counter I ment to use one of the existing seven pairs of 15 amp with tie-bar and connect a 3 wire cable to supply the split receptacle
 
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Old 06-26-09, 10:08 PM
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On the panel:

Use only Cuttler Hammer type BR, BRAF.BD.BRD.BRH.DNPL.GFCB.GFEP

breaker # 1 model:
Cuttler Hammer/BRD 2152115 DNPL 15 15 15
TYPE BRD,A,DNPL 120/240 HACR TYPE 4 POLE UNIT J969 E/819-T LR4356

breaker #3 non common trip

I need to install a 20 amp SP not sure what to get
Thank you
 
  #14  
Old 06-27-09, 04:08 AM
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For single pole breaker get BR120 breaker

Let me break it down so you can able understand the breaker model little more clear

BR - BR series breaker
1 - numbers of pole it will be 1 or 2 or 3 pole verison
20 - amp rating of breaker that will varies but common size will be 15,20,30,40,50 yeah there is oddball size on hand as well.

Those breaker you should able find them in big box store without any issue.

Merci,Marc
 
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